Advice on disciplining partners kids

[ceit27]

Looking for some advice here as I'm feeling a bit lost.

My partner and I have been together 2 years, I have 2 teenagers, he has 3 and a half year old twins. We have started talking about moving in together, and are pretty much doing so between 2 houses. My kids are happy with the idea, but I'm worried about his kids behaviour. We've just come home from a 2 week holiday and it was pretty horrendous. His kids mum doesn't discipline them, she'll tell them no in one breath and give them what they want in the other. They're quite young for their age, and don't seem to understand when we say things like no ice cream now, have some dinner then ice cream. They'll just throw a tantrum and continue asking even though we don't give in, and never have to their tantrums. Their mum hasn't potty trained them yet, we've been trying while he had them but stopped as she was putting them right back in nappies and we felt it was more confusing for them. We did try the first week of our holiday as he normally only has them for weekends and we thought the long stretch would be a good time to do it, but it was making everyone miserable and we gave in and put them into pull up pants and just kept trying as best we could. Their mum still has them in high chairs, and one of the kids sleeps in her bed most nights. They are lovely kids, great personalities and I love having them in my life, but their behaviour can be appaling, constantly screaming at the top of their lungs, breaking things or turning on taps, emptying the fridge and freezer, generally just running amock any time they were left alone. And when I say left alone I mean for a few minutes to use the loo, get them a drink etc. We generally had one of us cooking or doing a washing and the other watching them if it came to anything longer than a loo break.

Now one of my kids has ADHD and I work with kids with special needs so I'm no stranger to challenging behaviour and have tons of patience, but these kids are just constant, all day every day. And it seems to me it comes down to their home environment. My partner has tried to talk to his ex, but he just gets a guilt trip because he's not their and she's doing it all on her own (she left him then changed her mind but he didn't want back with her). He works away 3 weeks at a time, and he works hard and has the kids as much as he can so it's not like he doesn't take responsibility. But basically anything he says with regards to behaviour and potty training is him criticising her and he's not there etc.

I felt I was constantly saying no or putting them on the naughty spot, moving them away from things they shouldn't be doing while away. My partner can be pretty soft on them, but does discipline them. I ended up speaking to him to explain i felt I was getting no support from him and he had to step up and deal with their behaviour. He said he had agreed with the times I'd given them into trouble and did step up a bit after that, but how do we/he work on their behaviour when they don't get any discipline at home?

Any advice would be really appreciated

You sound like a perfectly reasonable, rational, decent woman.
I agree.
A sensible woman asks for help and advice regarding blending families when there's a large discrepancy in behaviour standards and behaviour approach between two sets of children. The children's mother has told the OP the struggles and the OP may well (unsurprisingly!!) know more about the home situation than they want to post on mumsnet.

Option 1 - people could offer helpful advice and guidance and things to consider for situations like this

Option 2 - people can stick the boot in, tell the OP she obviously has no idea at all about the children's lives, her DP is criticised for working away as if working away means he is less of a dad, and she needs to know her place and shut up and keep out because their mum is a single parent.

Totally right Courtney. I expected some negativity but not practically all of them! Maybe better to find a step parent forum for advice x

yikes, I think this is a hard situation for everyone involved.

whilst I sympathise with your situation, I mean it must be awful trying to parent someone elses 3 year olds, I feel sorry for their mum too and think you might be being a teeny bit harsh on her.

I have 1 3.5yo and he isn't potty trained yet and me and dp live together, so I think for 1 mum on her own to potty train 2 stubborn 3.5yo boys sounds like quite the task tbh!

I appreciate that you have tried and that's great but it needs consistency and so I think the only solution here is communication between all parents. A plan of how to deal with potty training, behaviour etc etc so the kids know that whatever happens in one house will happen in the other. Otherwise they'll just be confused and all 3 adults will be tearing their hair out.

and to be honest I think most 3yos behaviour can be appalling at times, I don't find that bit unusual at all!

Thanks lolasmiles.

I am a single mother and have been since my youngest was 2. My kids are almost grown up now so I know what it's like to be a single parent, and I have always given my partners ex the benefit of the doubt. But you are correct, I'm aware of more going on at home which is not my place to get involved with.

My partner works away yes. That isn't the issue here. He also has 3 full weeks off that he could have the kids but the time he has with them has been decided by their mum. As I said it was a battle to have them for 2 weeks over summer.

As for potty training, we got them further on having them the longer stretch but we basically had to spend the whole first week at home. They are more than ready. It's been delayed by their mum. The nursery has been trying too but she has them back in nappies at home so they're totally confused. Potty training isn't up to me to do away on holiday but we both tried and on the 2nd week we did have to relax it a bit so we could all enjoy the holiday and go out without taking their entire wardrobe! I'm not looking for advice on potty training. I was outlining the things going on at home that I know as fact as I have seen and been told by their mother directly. The other things are not up for discussion here.

I'm looking for advice from people who have been in the same situation and how they've handled it. Because like it or not, I do have to discipline the kids if my ex is cooking dinner or at the loo or whatever else and they misbehave. And being very clear again, this is not about tantrums. I am well aware that those are normal and I can deal with that. This is about the destructive and dangerous behaviour, breaking things, they don't know a thing about road safety, turning on hot taps while away, emptying things out the fridge etc. It is not normal toddler tantrums. And they will be 4 in 5 or 6 weeks, imo lots of things should have been done differently but all I can control is how they are when with my partner and the kids, and that's what I was hoping for advice on.

Thank you again to those who have been helpful.

To those having a go, it's great that you're all for the single mum, but you think it's acceptable to attack another single mum when you know nothing of the situation. Pathetic

if potty training is taking more than 2 weeks for them to be mostly dry, theyre probably not ready imo…

what advice do you actually want, then?

if you already know it all?

I don't know how you could be in a relationship with someone with such young kids, when you've gone through all that with your kids already.

It's way too much hard work. If he was doing the same work when they were together, then his Ex has practically raised them alone.

This is about the destructive and dangerous behaviour, breaking things, they don't know a thing about road safety, turning on hot taps while away, emptying things out the fridge etc

They’re still toddlers! And there’s two of them working as a team. If they are able to turn on taps and empty out the fridge, why are they not being supervised? And how it is mum’s fault that they do this when in your care? And I have yet to come across many toddlers who understand road safety - bolting the second they get out of a car is perfectly normal toddler behaviour.

If getting access is so difficult and there are concerns about the children’s welfare, why is the issue not with the courts?

I think that you need to be able to discipline the kids as 3.5yo need immediate consequences or they forget.

Some of your expectations of them are unreasonable. Being a 3yo is often called the threenager stage and considered worse than. Terrible Twos. Tantrums etc are totally normal. With regards to potty training, it shouldn't take as long as a week if they are ready ime.

Has your partner considered going to court so he doesn't have this drama about seeing the kids? The more that the kids see their Dad, the better for everyone surely?

I don't know how you can help the mum become more a more confident parent without pissing her off. It really needs to be someone close to her who sees the kids. Lot to help her be more consistent etc

OP you are not a victim of anything here! You asked for advice...
I ended up speaking to him to explain i felt I was getting no support from him and he had to step up and deal with their behaviour. He said he had agreed with the times I'd given them into trouble and did step up a bit after that, but how do we/he work on their behaviour when they don't get any discipline at home?

You have house rules. Simple and consistent.

You have got peoples backs up be turning it in to a critique of her parenting, which as you acknowledge, you have no control over.

3/4 is still young for road safety etc. Get wrist straps. You have 2 kids. You know what needs to be done.

I think your DH should be leading this. Not your problem and if it gets to the point where you feel it’s harming your kids, leave him. A lot of men like to blame the mothers of their kids when the kids misbehave which is easy to do in this case as he only has them once a month!

Your expectations of behaviour seems really high though. Maybe your kids were more advanced so you are basing what you think these kids should do on them, but them not meeting these high expectations doesn't make them misbehaving children. They all developed at different speed at reception teachers will experience every year.

What you do is teach them, don't make them feel they are bad little people. They break things, you ask why they did it. If in anger, you explain that's not the way to respond as now they don't have what they broke. They get time out.

Hot water, they should be supervised if close to hot water, but again, they can just be told that hit water can hurt.

They don't know a thing about road safety? Most parents would expect their 3yo to do so. Most 3 year old are right in proximity of their parents when close to roads especially roads they are not familiar to.

It does come across as if you have forgotten how demanding 3yo are and your oh doesn't have a clue because he doesn't see them much.

Any 2 full weeks with 2 3yo would leave you shattered.

You gave up on potty training after less than a week because it was making everybody miserable, but she's a bad mom for not potty training them.

You're complaining about their behaviour but they're both still very young - surely you remember what it was like when your children were that age. It's hard.

Whether she chose to leave or not she's openly admitting that she's finding it tough, so rather than berating her, why doesn't your DP asking what he can do to help?

They need to sit down and agree on rules for the children, and both stick to them, otherwise they'll just get confused.

Being a step parent is tough, but you will need to respect the rules their parents put place, whether you agree with them or not.

I also struggle to understand this obsession with potty training. They have another year to go before starting school, entry of time to be so when they are ready rather than force on them.

How many kids are still in nappies at 5 or 6 because potty training didn't take place at 3yo? None but those who have problems who are more likely to be as a result of forced potty training when not mentally ready for it.

I didn't post here to have the whole situation picked apart. Whether or not outside agencies are involved is not what the post is about.

I came here to ask advice on how to establish discipline in one home that is different from the main home. All I've had are people not actually reading anything but the bits they don't like.

I won't bother to check the forum after this. What a vicious majority on here that are quick to decide that I'm am some terrible person giving the mother a hard time when that could not be further from the truth.

I never proclaimed to be a victim, I am just trying to find a way to co-parent my partners children when he has them. And yes I do know how hard it is having little ones, which if anyone had bothered to read any part of my post which wasn't annoying to them would have seen I already said. My partner has bent over backwards to help and she won't take advice or help or allow him to take them longer if he offers. She's had similar discussions with members of her own family who are also concerned. But then I'm the wicked stepmother so I must be making all of that up too.

I hope you're all enjoying the view from your glass houses.

There wasn't an obsession with potty training, I was simply trying to establish that she won't potty train, still has them in high chairs for hours at a time, they are less than 2 months away from turning 4. From what I've seen and been told by her she is holding them back and not disciplining them and I was here hoping for some advice on establishing different boundaries when we have them, which is not just once a month. My partner is home for 3 weeks and has them as much as possible, every weekend he's here at the very least.

It's difficult to keep track of what you're saying when you change your name halfway through the thread OP.
I've certainly missed bits that you've clarified on because I didn't notice the NC.
I didn't read about how much DP had tried to communicate with the ex.

Just write up a set of simple rules. Include the children when you write them - ask them what they think good behaviour is so you all agree that the rules are fair.

Write them on an A3 piece of paper and stick it to the fridge if you need to (I know they wont be able to read it but you can take them to it and remind them when they break one of the rules).

Simple rules won't cause so much conflict because it doesn't matter what she's doing at her house, they'll just learn that these rules apply in your house.

Then stick with the naughty step (or whatever punishment you choose between you and DP).
It'll get easier as they get older.

They should be starting school in September so desperately need potty training

If they are 3 and a half surely they won't be starting school until next year?
I would leave potty training to the mum tbh it will only be confusing for them if you try and the. They go back into nappies with their Mum.
Do they have developmental delay were they premature?

I came here to ask advice on how to establish discipline in one home that is different from the main home

And the answer is that you can do that, but it wont work. Everyone needs to be on board. You wont get anywhere without consistency.

I say this as a parent of a very very stubborn 3yo who DOES NOT wanna do anything I want him to do, AND a step parent who completely understands how hard this situation is for you.

I do think though you are maybe looking back on your kids toddler years with rose tinted glasses. Toddlers are awful!

We have provided advice but you won't comment on these posts, you just respond with what the mum is not doing making things hard for you.

You can't control what she does. She is bringing up the girls as she think is right or how she can manage. She won't change to make it easier for you or because you believe she should be stricter.

You say your oh is having them when he can but surely that shows some flexibility on her part. She could have insisted on every other weekend and that him not being able to have them then wasn't her problem.

We might have got things very wrong but we can only go by what you write and that has been about how the mum is failing to bring up her daughter's appropriately and the high expectations you seem to have of them at their age.

It sounds like somewhere in the middle might be the way to aim for.

@ceit27

Literally I don't know why you're still entertaining this thread. It's Mumsnet step parent assassination as per usual. Don't expect anything different. It's not you, anyone else would get the same. Do exactly as you suggest and find a different platform to ask your perfectly reasonable question.

You can literally give one of these kids your kidney, and you'll get shot down, well that's to be expected, you arsehole, give the other one to his ex as well Cruella

Seriously. Stop defending yourself, it's pointless. Have a glass of wine later, you're doing just fine x

There's no assassination. Why is it that because a SM post, there's to be assumed that they are forcibly reasonable and fair and doing things right and therefore no comments that even dates to suggest that maybe they are not, or not fully is deemed assassination?

Are SM exempt from any criticism because of their status of SM?

There's s huge gap between giving a kidney and complaining that a not even yet 4yo should know road safety!

Is the only acceptable response to say 'yes, that's outrageous, how pathetic is the mum for not having taught her kids yet how and when to cross the road'?

Oh, and been an SM for 14 years here, you just get on with it and treat them how you'd want yours treated. Especially at 4.

Really the issue here is whether moving in together is the right thing to do. You don't live together yet, yet it sounds like you were doing all the disciplining during these two weeks. You say that he is soft with them.

It sounds like their mum has an idea of how to bring them up, you have a totally different view, and your oh yet another.

Moving in together is only going to show this disparity and bring up more frustrations. At the moment, it is easy to focus on the mother but as reading threads here show, it isn't long after moving in together that the different views on discipline between the father and SM comes to light.

As a step parent, I would say that your holiday has shown you what life together would be at this point.

It's not just a question of how to manage the situation. It is an argument in favour of not moving in together.

Kids can get used to 2 different sets of rules - for example nursery and home. At age 3, they go to nursery very frequently so they don't forget the rules and expectations at each. Your partner goes away for 3 weeks at a time so it's not surprising that they "forget" I'm guessing that when they spend a block of time with him like the current 2 weeks, they are more in sync with the expectations of your household. (By your I don't mean you as an individual - I mean your family)

I think that you've had some good advice like having just a few simple rules. In supernanny sort of programmes and nurseries, they put up the rules. The girls probably don't read yet but they are fast approaching an age where they will be able to- especially if there's some pictures by each rule. So "Kind hands and feet" might have a heart, hand and foot next to the written rule. Many schools and nurseries will have their Golden Rules online and that's probably a good starting place.

It is worrying that your partner is normally soft and does discipline to keep you happy. Discipline isn't adults being mean, you want them to be decent humans who will get along with other humans and your partner needs to get that. You haven't mentioned how bad their behaviour is but their peers are not going to have patience if they behave unreasonably. (As you clearly know!)

I think that you should start with the easy changes like high chairs. (I assume you don't mean a Tripp Trapp sort of thing without the tray. I'm surprised that they will sit in high chairs at home - what happens at nursery?