Not even sure why I'm posting - no one can help

[MycatsaPirate]

Dp and I have been living together for 5 years. We have 2 dc each, all girls. His 22 and 14, mine 19 and 11. My two live with us although oldest is living away at uni most of the time. His oldest lives with her bf a couple of hours away and his youngest lives with her mum and mum's partner about an hour away.

Dp and his ex finally got divorced four years ago, it was messy and got very acrimonious and after it was finalised she moved away to live with her partner, taking their DD with them (who was 11 at the time). At that point contact started getting sporadic and then stopped with communication between Dp and his DD just grinding to a halt despite his attempts otherwise. I've posted about this a few times in an effort to find a way to help him break through.

This morning he was told that his ex is dying. This is imminent. He went over to mutual friends to see both his DD's. Everyone was then going to see his ex but his exes partner said DP was not able to go. Both dp and I think he should have been able to go as it would be good for their DD's to have him there. His ex is in a coma and not expected to wake :( (Long term illness not accident).

There was also brief discussion about what will happen to DSD2 after her mum dies and his oldest was very vocal about her living with an aunt/uncle while I suspect DSD2 would rather stay where she is. Dp says DSD2 didn't really say anything while he was there, she was trying to watch something on TV and probably just wanted to blot out all the stuff going on around her.

He is going to mutual friends tomorrow to take both his DDs out but I've suggested he only takes DSD2 as DSD1 can be quite loud and forceful with her opinions. She tends to shout others down if they differ in opinion and really DSD2 doesn't need to be shouted down right now, she needs to be listened to.

My heart breaks for DSD2. Both my parents died when I was 6 (very suddenly) and I know exactly how she is going to feel and how hard it is going to be for her without her mum. I wish I could wave a magic wand for her and fix it all.

Mostly I am worried about her future. She used to want to go to uni and train to be a teacher. Her grades are amazing, she is a very bright girl but recently she has decided to be an actress with her back up plan being in a band. I am worried that living with her mum's partner will not be a good idea, he has brain damage and hates arguments, he will take the path of least resistance with her even if it's not in her best interests.

While her living with her aunt and uncle could be a good idea (local to us and her aunt is fabulous), the grandparents are ill and reliant on the aunt for care. She also holds down a full time job and I am unsure how she would get DSD2 to school and have time for her on top of everything else. The uncle is also ill and has been in and out of hospital (transplant/tumours).

I don't know whether DSD2 would come to us. My oldest is willing to give up her bedroom to ensure DSD2 has her own room and share with her sister when she is at home. But the relationship between DSD2 and her dad has broken down so much over the last few years that I honestly don't think it would be an option in her eyes.

Sorry for the huge ramble. I need to collate my thoughts. I just feel so down and sad today. There's nothing I can do, I feel that there may be a big fight in the family over where DSD goes ultimately and I honestly don't know what to even think right now.

Thanks for reading.

I'm can't offer any advice other than to say that you sound lovely and she is lucky to have your love and support at such a time. Surrounding her with love is the only way forward and there are many step mothers who would fail to do this. The shared ground of losing parents as children may also enable you to help her through this.

Oh my goodness what a horrible situation.
I've no advice other than to say well done you for being supportive and understanding and if you keep on doing this then she stands a good chance.

Having lost a parent at 15 and my best friend (only child) having lost both her parents in a 6 month period at 24 my advice would be let her make her decision and change her mind without anyone getting annoyed or hurt. What she wants now may not be what she wants in 3 months or 6 etc....

At least she has multiple people who want/are prepared to take her in, even if they're not all suitable.

I think all your DH can do at this point is make sure his dd's know he is there for them, and that for the youngest to know that coming to him is an option that you would all be happy with if that's what she wanted.

Now isn't going to be the time for anybody (eldest dd especially) to be making demands etc.

Thank you. I like the idea of letting her change her mind without worrying about others, I will tell dp that. She needs to have time to cope and I am so worried because she is 14 and exams next year. Getting her into school here would not be an issue and she has friends at our local high school already.

I just feel utterly helpless. My relationship with her mum broke down when dp had his accident. She demanded that DSD be allowed in to see him but she wouldn't accept that HDU would not allow under 18's. She then got her BIL to phone asking for exceptions to be made and got annoyed when they said no. When he was moved to a ward I did let her know and also posted on fb asking people to wait 24 hours so all the kids could get into see him before anyone else. She told everyone that I was blocking their DD from seeing her dad. I wasn't. His oldest was 18 at the time and she was allowed in and even she said that she wouldnt' have wanted any of the other 3 to see him like that, he was wired up to everything, he tubes in his chest, catheter, oxygen, heart monitors, there literally wasn't a bit of him that didn't have a wire or tube sticking out of him and he was completely black and blue. Since then she hasn't spoken to me as she really did think it was me stopping DSD going in there.

(thinking out loud here) I wonder if DSD will feel conflicted if she comes here. Her mum had nothing nice to say about dp and me, his oldest said she did nothing but slate us relentlessly - so maybe she would feel like she would be betraying her mum if she comes to her dad now?

I wish dp had had the chance to go and see her before she went into a coma. They could have made peace. He says he is not bothered about seeing her now, she won't be waking up but out of a sense of duty he would go if he was able to. I think he would have gone a few weeks back to speak to her, make peace, talk about the DDs and just generally remember that at one point they loved each other enough to marry and have their daughter.

Instead their DD will be left wondering if she is doing the 'right thing' and may feel conflicted about where to go and who to see.

It's nice to have a chance to put this down. It's hard to talk at home, my youngest is sitting here and likes to have her say on anything so I will talk to dp later tonight.

luna Totally agree. DSD1 is very vocal (or gobby) and really does like to be heard and agreed with. I'm trying to be polite here! Her and I got into a discussion on fb once and because she didn't like what I thought about Britain First she rang her dad and started shouting at him down the phone about me. She's 22! I've told Dp that for once, he needs to shout her down if need be and tell her to shut up. This is not a decision she will be making. And she certainly should not be telling DSD2 what to think/do. Ex is not DSD1's mum and although she was her step mum for years there was certainly a lot of aggravation between them to the point ex threw DSD1 out of the house when she moved in with her partner.

Dp is soft, he will let the DDs rule the roost but in this case, I have said he needs to stand up to DSD1 for the sake of DSD2. Also said that it should be just him and DSD2 tomorrow. DSD1 comes round here frequently, she has support in spades from others too but DSD2 really does need some time with just her dad tomorrow.

Losing a parent is so hard for dependant children - it's good you're all aware of that and being so considerate.

It sounds like, after her mother's death, its only her father who will have PR? This means, despite any opinions she may have to the contrary, that he will have a big say in her life, day to day. For example, he's the one who will get letters from her school, even if she lives with another relative. Obviously she doesn't need to be hit over the head with that fact, but gradually I'm sure it will dawn on her.

I agree that he should make it very clear, without exerting undue pressure, that she always has a home with him for as long as she may need it. And also that it needs to be emphasised that she doesn't have to make any permenant desciions at this point - month by month is fine.

The complication is school (GCSEs?) I suppose. It might be she wanted a termtime Home and a weekend/holidays home.

Yes, exams a huge issue. I moved my children when they were 13 and 6 because I was aware that DD1 would be doing exams and it was a pivotal time in her education. It's not a decision any parent takes lightly. Schools here are outstanding as is the school she currently goes to.

I honestly don't know if the stepdad has PR, it may be that she has written into her Will that stepdad retains residency of DSD2 but at the moment we just don't know. At the moment she is still alive, albeit clinging on, she's sedated as even morphine wasn't touching her pain. I feel heartsick to think of anyone suffering like she has been.

So even if DP has PR and no one else has then could they apply to court for it? It's really difficult.

Did your DP's ex know she was dying? Could she have left instructions somewhere as to her wishes for her daughter's care.

Just wanted to say you sound like a lovely person. Have a random 'Thank you for caring' from a stranger.

She has cancer, I presume she was told she was terminal although we were never told that. I would assume she has also made arrangements for her DD. I would hope that would include Dp as her dad.

DSD1 has been stirring things with DP already and I am quite angry with her. This won't affect her any where near as much as DSD2. Although this is DSD1's step mum and obviously she will grieve for her, DSD1 is an adult, who has a home and a life away from all this and it won't impact on her in the way it will DSD2 who will be losing her mum and her whole world as she knows it.

We haven't had any news this morning but Dp is going to go over and get DSD2 shortly and spend some time with her today, just the two of them.

I honestly don't know if the stepdad has PR,

You said she has a partner rather than a husband? If they're not married then he can't have PR. If they are married then she could have applied to share PR, but I'm pretty sure that your DH would have been informed.

it may be that she has written into her Will that stepdad retains residency of DSD2

It doesn't work like that (though I suppose she might think it does, if she didn't take legal advice.) A parent can't assign guardianship of their children at their death unless they are the only person with PR, in which case the person named in their will is given PR (as long as they're suitable). But since SD2 will still have a parent with PR, this won't happen.

So even if DP has PR and no one else has then could they apply to court for it?

I'm not sure. I don't think so.

In your DP's situation I'd be getting some legal advice. Even just CAB or the Gingerbread helpline (or legal board on here?) might be able to provide enough information for clarity.

Obviously your DP could allow her to live with someone who doesn't have PR. But it will be him who'll have to register her with schools and communicate with them, register her for GP, sign consent forms for surgery... everything like that. So he's going to at the very least need to be in close contact with her and whomever she lives with - if he thinks the partner might be obstructive then perhaps he should be encouraging her to move with aunt and uncle as a stopgap measure?

It all sounds so tough.

Thanks for the advice re PR.

Sadly DSD's mum passed away yesterday.

We went to see DSD once DP got home from work at her aunts house very briefly. Aunt, grandad and stepdad were just returning from the hospice and everyone very emotional so we just gave DSD a hug and passed out condolences to everyone. Dp has been trying to call DSD but her phone is switched off and I guess just needs to be alone at the moment.

Dp had a quick chat with stepdad and said they need to meet up to discuss DSD. Stepdad quite defensive and said DSD wants to stay with him but knowing he has no rights is good for DP to know. Right now though DSD is going on holiday at the weekend with family friends which will be good for her and the funeral will be when she gets back. We will be away then but DP will come back (we are only camping locally) to attend.

DSD1 is causing issues already though. Firstly she rang DP yesterday to ask if he had been to see DSD2 and he said yes, we have. She immediately went mad, shouting down the phone at him saying he should have gone alone, that I had no right to be there etc. Dp was trying to tell her that his car is in the garage and we had gone to collect it with the intention of him going to see DSD and me returning home but she wouldn't listen. Then she rang me (I was in the garden and no idea of his call) and she starting screaming at me the minute I answered. She wouldn't listen to me either. She then rang DP back again and screamed at him for posting on facebook that his ex wife had passed away (very nice dignified post to inform friends).

I suspect we will only get more crap from her in the weeks to come. I have no intention of attending the funeral although I would if I didn't think his oldest would kick off. But his friend is going to go with him instead which hopefully will cause less issues with DSD1 (she is 22 btw, not a child).

DSD2 is seemingly bottling everything up at the moment. I said to her yesterday that she is surrounded by those who love her and that anyone will listen to her if she needs to talk. I bought her a lovely card today which will come from us all but mainly Dp. I also bought one for stepdad, aunt and grandad. Poor grandad's wife is in a home with alzheimers and he is not coping well with this at all. Such a lovely sweet man.

I have talked to dp briefly and said that while it's right that everyone listens to what DSD's wants are, he also needs to understand that he has responsibilities towards her and that means doing what is right for her in the long run. It's easy to just give in and let a child do whatever they want but sometimes you need to make hard decisions. I have no doubts that DSD will want to stay with stepdad but whether that's the right decision we don't know. I have suggested he talk to the aunt at some point too because she is very level headed and won't be swayed by anyone but will do the right thing.

In the last two years his ex wife and the stepdad have stonewalled dp in trying to call his DD and see her. There has been a distinct lack of communication and I am worried that at the time when she really needs her dad she has no idea how to build that bridge to get the support she needs. Dp is floundering, he has ptsd and his emotions are always held in check and he doesn't seem to know quite how to reach out to her other than to try and see her/talk to her but with that wall up and contact so limited unless through step dad it's bloody difficult.

Lots of touch conversations to be had in the near future.

Dp went down to her aunts tonight to see her but she has gone back with her stepdad to his house.

He has just tried to phone and got through to stepdad and said 'can I speak to dd please?' Stepdad just said 'she doesn't want to talk to you' and hung up on him.

Doesn't bode well at all for trying to maintain contact with his DD :(

Oh dear. Sorry to read all this.

Your partner should get legal advice, pronto. I think he might need to get in touch with social services. (Kinship care doesn't need social services involvement, but hinges on the parent/s consenting to the child living with a relative. Since he's not a relative and your partner doesn't consent, I suspect it might count as a private foster arrangement - which has to be signed off on and monitored by social services for under 16s.)

Thank you, I will give them a call this morning. Dp is devastated at the blocking of contact with his DD. Although he has been phoning trying to talk to her regularly, aware of the severity of his ex wife's illness he hadn't been pushing the issue but he really needs to be in contact with her now to give her the support she needs and be her parent.

It must be hard - but she needs stability now and space - and her friends

I agree ring SS for advice but her whole world hasn't collapsed and your Daps priorities will be different than hers

*has

Dsd maybe 22 but that's still a young adult and it must be hard she has lost her mum.
She seems to be taking on the adult role but doesn't have the emotional maturity.

I can understand her upset with the FB post as if your dp had a poor relationship with her and a very messy divorce it would feel disingenuous to post anything.

I think if you start with recognizing that some fault must lie with your dp for the current state of the relationship with his daughter that will help to cool tempers.

I don't think your dp should shout down his older daughter, he needs to model behaviour and recognise the immense stress she must be under.Now is absolutely not the time to confront her behaviours even if you think she's gobby!

I would suggest your dp offers practical support as a way to build trust and bridges.
Do they have enough money? Can he pay for counselling? Offer lifts (but not to the funeral)
Don't force the issue of where his daughter lives, she will over time make decisions.
Be extremely sensitive to their needs and your dp should keep up regular contact, maybe a card or text.
Don't put any pressure on her or the older daughter as its about them rather than your dp.

He needs to tread carefully as he will be judged if he's perceived to be insensitive at this awful time which will end his relationships with his girls forever.

Ex wife is not DSD1's mum. In fact their relationship had broken down when ex wife and stepdad threw DSD1 out of stepdads house and she ended up sofa surfing. We offered her a bed here but her job was in that area and it wasn't practical.

No one apart from ex wifes family has been notified of her death. One person has tagged ex wife into a post and there are loads of people shocked and stunned as they had no idea. Dp did not tag ex wife into the post, he was only notifying his friends who knew her. I have also private messaged a few people who knew her from DSD2's primary school and to let them know I will send date and place of funeral if they want to attend.

Dp has no idea why the relationship with DSD2 has broken down. He has spoken to his ex BIL who is completely neutral and even he has no idea why on earth DSD2 hasn't had anything to do with dp for the last two years. No one does. It's baffling and despite repeatedly asking ex wife when she was still alive, the only thing she could come up with was little things like me asking her to put dirty washing in the wash basket four years ago and something about a phone charger (which she had left at a friends and accused me of stealing despite it not even fitting my phone). DSD1 has told us that ex wife slagged off DP and I constantly when they were both living with her and I do wonder if DSD2 is just refusing to speak to DP out of some sort of loyalty to her mum. Of course, now ex wife is dead dp is placed in a position of never being able to put his side of things without it looking like he is slagging off DSD2's mum.

Dp has offered help. They have a huge amount of money, we have none so offering them money is not an option. Ex wife got 75% of assets in their divorce and dp lost his home so we are paying extortionate rent. Also stepdad's house has no mortgage and he has a very good pension so they are fine for money. Ex wife also had insurance policies which will pay out and got to DSD2 so she is sorted financially for uni or whatever she needs in the future.

It's also bloody hard to offer help for anything when no one will talk to him. We/he has offered before to help with dropping DSD back from trips (despite it taking us 3 hours out of the way) and it's been refused time and time again.

A card has been left for her at her aunts house. Just from dp rather than from us all.

And as for DSD1, she may be grieving but she has history of trying to be in charge of everything. She always tries to tell dp what to do, demands to know how much he earns, is always giving him a hard time about DSD2 - it's either telling him he's making no effort or telling him he should leave her alone.

For two years dp has not been able to 'win' no matter what he does. I am quite frankly, drained from the effort of trying to find a solution. Dp is torn. He feels if he tries to make contact she will push him away but if he backs off it looks like he doesn't care. There is no ideal solution to it and I have told him that if he leaves her with stepdad and they continually refuse him contact then he will likely lose her forever despite that not being his wish.

Are you saying your DH put up a FB post informing his friends of her death? (Even though he didn't tag her?)

Is he for real?

Has he managed to book an appointment with a solicitor yet? There's no point at all him worrying about contact being refused - legally this seems unlikely since he's the only person with PR. The situation sounds like that of a fellow wid' friend of mine, who as unmarried step parent could only house her teen DSS for 28 days before social services intervened. As it was, DSS's mother was underhoused and couldn't offer him a bedroom so supported my friend's application for 5/7 residence. It still had to go to court though.

I think (hard as it is) the important thing is to keep diffusing emotion and drama as far as possible while her mother's death is so very recent. Personally I'd suggest he delete the FB post and not notify people - leave that to the immediate family, since it's causing upset for some unknown reason. (They might want time to absorb it before they tell others.) Keep all the focus on the relationship with DSD2, and keep discussion around that as factual as possible... that no desicions need making quickly but as her father he legally has responsibility for her health, education and safety so communication needs to restart. It might be possible to co-opt dSD1 to help pass this message along - "it's not that I'm interfering - I have a legal obligation as the only person with PR for her, and she's more likely to be able to stay living where she is now if her late mother's partner will communicate with me so I can assure social services that she's safe..." etc...

Ex wife had him blocked on fb, they had no 'friends in common' on there except those who already knew of her death. He did nothing wrong, he is the surviving parent of their child.

No, he hasn't seen a solicitor yet. He has no wish to start legal proceedings unless it's completely essential. The divorce was messy and acrimonious and neither of us think it's in anyone's best interest to go the legal route unless all other avenues have been explored.

He is meeting with ex BIL later who has hopefully had a chance to talk to the step father. We will see how things go after that.

We are away this weekend and DSD is going on holiday for two weeks tomorrow anyway. The next time he sees her will likely be at the funeral.

But there may have been friends of friends - it's surprising what appears in my feed - and as word spreads people know or ring etc when they haven't 'told' people

It wasn't his news to share - it's very insensitive

I hope it goes well that th extended family member.
Just to clarify - I wasn't suggesting starting legal proceedings! As I said initially, I think he needs legal advice on how to discharge his parental responsibility if he is being prevented from communicating with his child/the adult with residence at present. And I suggested some helplines where he can get that for free (though their advice may be that he needs to speak to a solicitor.)