Christmas.. advice please

[Carmex]

We have DSD for most of every holiday. She will be 15 at end of this year. We have never had her for xmas. We normally have her for new year. We've never rocked the boat with this.

In 2016 we want to go away for 5 days over Christmas including xmas day.

DSD is here at the moment. We've had a chat about it all she said she would love to come as she is bored of Christmas routine.

DH has said to her mum what our plan would be etc etc. she is flat out saying no. she said she can not have her away from home on Xmas day.

I nicely reminded her that not once have we had her for xmas and DSD will be 16. We would like to take her away for xmas before she reaches adulthood fully and will then be doing her own thing.

She has flat out said no.

Where do we go from here?

DH has never had a court order for DSD as we've always been able to work things out quite well with each other.

armarmai This is a genuine question, and one I battle with as a mother - at what age do you think it would be appropriate to make arrangements directly with a DC, rather than involve the other parent?

My DDs dad and I have been separated for nearly half her life, and when she was younger, we ensured we communicated directly with each other - but now she's a teen, and a young woman, it seems inappropriate to defer to her dad, when she may well have different opinions and preferences to his. She has an independent relationship with both her step parents too.

Should I continue to make all arrangements with her dad - and expect her step parents to liaise with me and her dad as well, until my DD is living independently from all of us?

As you are her birth mother it is entirely different and up to you. I was addressing a step mother who on the one hand says she makes all the arrangements re sd with the birth mother , but didn't inform far less consult the birth mother before enticingly offering to the sd to take her for a holiday over xmas . Yet the father has allowed the birth mother to have their daughter for every xmas up till then. Clearly an agenda that has the result of causing huge upset and disappointment whichever way it goes and absolutely indefensible. If it were my child i would be listening to what s/he wants to do from the beginning and making sure the other parent knew. No subversive attacks or guerilla warfare. Good luck with your situation.

That's a little bit of double standards though, isn't it?

I mean, if I had "allowed" my DDs dad to have her every year for Xmas, but decided this year to ask DD whether she wanted to come away with me and her stepdad, that's no different - from the DCs perspective - to the OPs situation.

I'm sure it looks different from an external perspective - my DD, therefore my decision, whereas the OP is the stepmum - but from the DCs perspective, the conflict between households is exactly the same; it doesn't actually matter who delivers the message, surely?

You said you had a genuine question - which i did not address , so what are you talking about? I addressed the troublemaking and double standards of the op. Are you the op?

Dp did not "allow" the ex to have dss every Christmas, she insisted on it and he just went along with it to keep the peace. You seem to imply he should have resisted, but I'm not sure it's worth it unless you have a reason other than "because it's what everyone does".

As it is, Christmas day turns out to be the only day we don't have him, he's at ours from school term end to Xmas Eve, then hers overnight, back to us BD morning and back to her the next weekend on the rota after school restarts. So if we had him Xmas day (as we are this year) I have no idea when he will see her.

I am not sure about allowing the kids to make their own arrangements. Suppose dss agreed with his mum (who is RP) to stay with us for a week, then she went away but we already had plans he hadn't checked? This sort of thing already happens and I think it would be worse if dss just made the arrangements without the adults having to agree.

I do think the OP in this situation would have been better off approaching the mother first. Also, it's a long way off, so I am sure it can be raised again in a few months.

I don't think this is anything to do with being the 'birth mother', it's to do with being the resident parent. And with adults acting like adults.

Me and my sister were 15 and 13 when my parents split up, I wished then that there had been formal visitation schedule as it was left up to us to arrange. While this was good for flexibility, it put too much pressure on teenagers, I feel.

I don't think teenagers should be forced to be totally responsible for deciding these things, but equally neither should parents. In an ideal situation, teen could express a preference and all adults would support them, because the love the teen and want them to be happy.

I don't think the OP is gleeful at all, I think she wants the best for dsd, even if that turns out to be stay home with mum for Xmas.

Add message | Report | Message poster amarmai Wed 26-Aug-15 19:43:05
You said you had a genuine question - which i did not address , so what are you talking about? I addressed the troublemaking and double standards of the op. Are you the op?

No, I'm not the OP. You did address my question - you said that it would be different for me because I'm DDs mum.
But if I were to do what the OP did, and begin to ask my DD directly whether she wishes to be included in family events with me at a time that she has traditionally spent with her dad, then how will that be different for my DD than it is for the OPs DSD?
How is it that the OP is accused of troublemaking, but I'm not?

I fully understand the perceived difference in the relationship dynamic - and in sure I wouldn't be happy if my DDs stepmum got involved in this type of issue, but in terms of the DC, how is it different because her stepmum, rather than her parent, has asked her?

perhaps you should start your own thread instead of hijacking this one.

dss DM was always asking him who he wanted to do stuff with. I think RPs maybe do get to do that more though on balance it still seems manipulative.

These discussions are not only the province of the mother and father. Step-parents who have been involved in their children's lives for a long time do actually have the right to discuss these matters with nearly adult step-children.

We don't own our children.