Are we being fair to DSD?

[Onthedoorstep]

Dp and I have bought a house that we have been doing up. My two young boys share a room upstairs - with me and dp in an en suite.

Dp is moving in next month. His dd (my dsd) is in her mid-late teens. We have made her a large room of her own in a large 'study' on the ground floor.

However, she is refusing to move with Dp and says she will move back to her mum's unless we give up our bedroom (next to my boys) or convert the attic (we cannot afford this). She says it is not fair that she can't sleep in the 'bedrooms' like my boys.

We have basically told her that she needs to decide where she wants to live, but she will always be welcome here.

Have we done enough? Are we being fair?

What would make her like the room better? Maybe the lobby doesn't do it for her. I held off saying this, but I couldn't bear to sleep in a downstairs room, so I can appreciate the panic that would set up. Can you work with her to make the room work for her? Is it the sense of being cut off? The noises from the street? There will be someting, but because it's an irrational fear, it's hard to pinpoint and solve. Can she use the room but sleep elsewhere for the first few nights until she feels it's hers? Sorry you're having such problems.

If a room has a bed in it, and all associated bedroom furniture etc, then it is a bedroom no matter where it's located (where does she think people who live in bungalows or ground floor flats sleep?). And assuming you have reassured her from a safety perspective re: locks on front and back doors, window locks and so on, then I'm afraid to say I think she's being precious.

You've said a few things about affordability and "guilt" but good grief, even a 2 bed house these days is a total pipe dream to many people and it sounds as if you've made the absolute most of what you can afford. I really hope she hasn't been giving you grief about what she thinks you "should" be able to afford (as if most teenagers would have a clue about the real cost of living and property) because that would be insolent, and you should ignore it. You know you have done your very best and that's all there is to it.

To all intents and purposes she sounds as if she'll be having her own "en suite" anyway if she has an adjacent bathroom which presumably she'll use more than anyone else ?

It comes across to me that she's being difficult for the sake of it. I don't know why - the arrangements aren't changing re: 50:50, it's just that her dad is moving in with you and she gets a big room out of it. I can't help wondering if this is a protest - in a roundabout way - about her dad cementing his relationship with you by moving in ? That it was okay while you didn't live together but now things have moved on a step and she doesn't like it and/or is scared about it. Perhaps she's worried about the inevitable "differences" now there'll always be 5 of you together instead of just her and her dad. Maybe she doesn't want to "share" her dad and this is about jealousy ? I don't know ..... and I haven't meant to excuse her entitled attitude at all, just don't understand why she's being so stroppy when it sounds like she's getting a good deal out of the sleeping arrangements. Can't help thinking that whatever type of house you'd bought she'd have found something to protest about - I think it's the move and the changes she's anticipating which is the issue here, and not the bedroom but of course being a typical teen she can't be honest and talk about her concerns - which would allow you both to reassure her - and instead is flouncing about. I think her saying you're "excluding" her is very telling - because obviously you're not as you've given a great deal of consideration to her room. I suspect that translated from teenspeak that means she feels her daughter-daddy relationship is being threatened, as he'll now need to spread his attention further.

There isn't a lot you can do about it though .... I don't advocate constant reassurance or constant attempts to "win" her over because as Sceptic said upthread she's only one member of the family and not the priority. I assume you've kept her in the loop, have obviously discussed the bedroom plans with her and am guessing you and/or her dad would have talked about how things would be in the new house ? If you've done all this then you shouldn't reproach yourself - and if you've always made it clear that she can come to you with worries, then that's what she needs to do - you're not mindreaders.

Can I ask, has she seen the new house and the new layout? It can be difficult for an adult to understand the layout of a new place so it might just be that she is digging her heels in as she doesn't understand where her room fits in the house and home.

Just wondering. Exactly how old is she, Onthedoorstep? You say she is going to Uni in a couple of years, so I'm guessing she is 16 at the most, but maybe younger.
Also, how long since her parents split up and has she being living with her Dad 50% for all of that time?

Also, I notice you say "But I got the separate 'lobby' built between the lounge an her room so she can lock herself in to feel safer".

So does that mean that she does in fact feel seperated/unsafe/spooked by the room and/or the downstairs layout, since you have already thought "she can lock herself in to feel safer".

Trying to picture it in my head. The room leads off the lounge, yes (albeit with the lobby you built between the two)? And it is the biggest room in the house (maybe apart from the lounge)?

Do any other doors led off the room? Is there anything you don't like about the room? (do the Devil's advocate bit again!)

Just trying to see the whole situation and I do see the position you are in, but I don't necessarily think she is being 'entitled' ... more likely a bit 'young' and lost.

How old are your little boys? I'm guessing they are very young, but maybe your DP's daughter doesn't emotionally feel the difference in needs is that huge.

16 is a funny age - half adult, half child. I really do think you need to consider her feelings here as if she is a child. And for a child, her dad moving in with his GF is a difficult time.

I'd drop it and move on, honestly. Asking what else you can do to sweeten this for her is slipping into absurdity. You've been very fair, and any more is pandering to a 16 year old child.

I added the lock because I had exactly the same room setup as a child and I liked being able to lock the door at night! No other doors lead off her room. I think it's lovely and cosy.

Is it the move or the room that is bothering her?

I agree with Grennie.

How old is she Onthedoorstep and how old are your two little boys?

It's easy to say that your dsd is being petty and entitled but tbh I wouldn't have liked being the only one having to sleep in a living room when I was a child. It does look as if she's being pushed out - unless people live in acbungalow bedrooms are usually upstairs - for everyone. Why on earth did you buy a house with 2 bedrooms? Would you want to be sleeping in the room next to the lounge where the tv will be on? I wouldn't. Unless your dc are babies I'd give her the upstairs room, as I would do for my dc, I'd opt for DH and I to have the downstairs study/bedroom since you say it's do big and lovely with a bathroom just off.

Why on earth did you buy a house with 2 bedrooms?

How rude.

Why do you think ? .... OP has already said she can't afford a larger place, like 100s of 1000s of other families who are stuck in less than ideal properties and have to make the most of it.

If only it were as simple as us all having the house we want rather than the house we can (just about) afford.

She's also said her much younger boys are terrible sleepers and she therefore needs to be next to them.

So it's ok for the op's boys to be near their mum, but dsd who we think is around 14-16 to be made to sleep downstairs where she said she doesn't feel safe - how is this fair? And yes I think that when families join together they need to make provision for all children not exclude dsc just because they're not always there. If this isn't possible then wait until you can afford it or until children grow up and don't need a room of their own - I think that's perfectly reasonable. Who wants to sleep in a converted room at the back of the lounge, hardly making her feel one of the family is it?

Strangely enough, we've got a similar set up.
We have interconnecting bedrooms for the boys (ds and dss) upstairs, like our bedroom, and one bedroom, also the largest (!), downstairs for dsd.
When we moved in nearly 5 years ago all the kids were preteen and I envisaged them all sharing the two upstairs connecting rooms, with more privacy for dsd. The downstairs room was to be my study/storage cupboards and extra bedroom for ils when they visit.
However, dh was extremely adamant that dsd somehow had the right to largest bedroom, even though it was always clear she'd be spending the least amount of time with us (ds here fultime, dss 50:50). I say clear because she was then very much under the influence of her mums most aggressive attitude (was not ow, btw, etc...) towards dh and me, and although this has lessened considerably, we've got used to having an extra, basically empty room in a relatively small house...
In the end, we built an extra room so dh and I have that workspace/child free space we need for our jobs and sanity.
I wish we had had counseling then to sort out our problems (I.e. Dh's often unbelievably capricious wishes for his dc), and can only recommend you find a third party in RL to view "the damage."

What if you suggest that you put the boys in the larger downstairs bedroom and because it is larger put a trundle bed under one of their beds for you and then put a baby monitor in their room so you can hear them. It isn't like they are a mile away.

Then you stay in the ensuite and DSD is next to you.

In the evening when DS's go to bed you will be much nearer them in the lounge anyway.

Dd is always the last up - gots to bed about 1 am- and as I've said, there is a lobby between her and the lounge. She is always the one that disturbs the rest of us. :)

I have to sleep next to my boys. They run into my room every night (the younger one). The idea of dsd and me and DH upstairs seems very daft to me.

She also has a boyfriend who spends a lot of time with her.

There is no option but to keep the layout as it is.

We have agreed that if she wants to move to her mums then she can. I suspect she will decide to stay here in the end though.

I still think you've been unfair to not treat the children equally. Is your DH really happy that dsd is away from the rest of the family at night when you say that her bf is always there? Sounds like she's being very much left to her own devices.

I don't think she is being 'treated differently' because she has a room on a different floor.

The only way to treat her the same is to let her share with the boys!

Her bf is not there overnight.

No, children shouldn't be treated equally but fairly. How can you treat a teenager equally the same as a toddler??

She is getting her own room. I'm sure she'd complain if the OP put bunks and a single in the upstairs room with the 2 little ones.

I think she is probably just unsure about the setup, but will probably enjoy it once she is used to it.

And yes I think that when families join together they need to make provision for all children not exclude dsc just because they're not always there. If this isn't possible then wait until you can afford it or until children grow up and don't need a room of their own - I think that's perfectly reasonable.
The OP and the girl's father have made MORE than ample provision for her. She just doesn't like what's on offer.
There is actually a very good argument to be made (and has been made on these boards before) that the children who reside in the home full-time are entitled to at least one bedroom of their own, rather than having to share while their sibling gets two full-time bedrooms. But whatever you think of that, it isn't even the OP's plan...they have provided the daughter with a bedroom of her own, made it habitable and comfortable as circumstances allow, and she's having a bit of cheek by angling for the master bedroom with en suite.
OP has already said that her boys are young. The daughter is a teen. Yes, it's a reasonable position to keep young children nearer to the parents. For god's sake!

And now we've moved into CrazyLand, because, ladies and gentlemen, we now have a poster actually suggesting that people not marry or cohabitate unless every child in the home can have a bedroom of their own that is identical to every other bedroom. (And never mind that if her dad weren't living with OP, there is still no guarantee that the girl would have a bedroom! Perhaps she'd have a sofa bed to sleep on when visiting, as some children visiting divorced fathers do, you know...but what would you advise then?)

I think that's perfectly insane.

And yes I think that when families join together they need to make provision for all children not exclude dsc just because they're not always there. If this isn't possible then wait until you can afford it or until children grow up and don't need a room of their own - I think that's perfectly reasonable.
The OP and the girl's father have made MORE than ample provision for her. She just doesn't like what's on offer.
There is actually a very good argument to be made (and has been made on these boards before) that the children who reside in the home full-time are entitled to at least one bedroom of their own, rather than having to share while their sibling gets two full-time bedrooms. But whatever you think of that, it isn't even the OP's plan...they have provided the daughter with a bedroom of her own, made it habitable and comfortable as circumstances allow, and she's having a bit of cheek by angling for the master bedroom with en suite.
OP has already said that her boys are young. The daughter is a teen. Yes, it's a reasonable position to keep young children nearer to the parents. For god's sake!

And now we've moved into CrazyLand, because, ladies and gentlemen, we now have a poster actually suggesting that people not marry or cohabitate unless every child in the home can have a bedroom of their own that is identical to every other bedroom. (And never mind that if her dad weren't living with OP, there is still no guarantee that the girl would have a bedroom! Perhaps she'd have a sofa bed to sleep on when visiting, as some children visiting divorced fathers do, you know...but what would you advise then?)

I think that's perfectly insane.

OP, you know perfectly well you have been more than fair. :)

My two DCs are 10 and 14. Until recently their dad lived in a 1 bed flat, with his DW and toddler - Two nights a week when my DCs went to their dad's DD (10) shared her bedroom with 3 other people and DS (14) slept in the lounge. Not ideal at all, but if space is short that's just the way it is. My ex now has a 2 bed flat so DD shares a bedroom with DS and the toddler shares with my ex and his DW for now at least.

When my DS is at mine he shares with DSS every weekend, so never ever gets a lie in in a bedroom to himself. I think he'd say your DSD was bloodly lucky having a room to herself in two separate houses!

It sounds like you have done everything you can op, but has your dh? Did he talk everything through with his dd or was it just presented as a done deal?

There are just so many ways to put a positive spin on this. She could have her own tv and not have to worry about waking anyone up. I can think of so many ways your dh could have sweetened this for his dd that I'm wondering if she has genuine reasons to not want this rather than just being manipulative.

Why might she be scared to be downstairs? Does she feel like she will be a spare part? Has her dad done everything he can to make sure she knows that he is not replacing her with your children?

What I don't get is how her dad (and therefore you) doesn't know what the problem is. I can't imagine moving into a house with my child and not having had conversations about everything.

Sorry, but it's as if you are playing guessing games. She could be feeling all sorts of things, but nobody seems to have a clue. Can't he talk to her? Or, more to the point, listen to her. It seems solveable to me, but there is this blankness about what's going on.

How old is she, Onthedoorstep. Sorry if I'm wrong, but there are an awful lot of questions that you aren't answering, and I'm getting the impression that you are making her sound older than she is. We know from your earlier post that she is maybe at the most 15 OR 16, (which is very different from the mid to late teens thing you suggested earlier), but could be even younger than that.

Actually, other things are confusing me too. "Dd is always the last up ... She is always the one that disturbs the rest of us" but I thought until now, your DP has been living in one home with his DD and you have been living in another with your DSs, that you've bought this house together and done it up, but that your DP's daughter is "is refusing to move with Dp".

"gets to bed about 1 am" This is a schoolgirl?

"She also has a boyfriend who spends a lot of time with her" In her room? Is no one parenting this girl?

I'm sorry if I'm sounding very harsh OP but I really do get the feeling that this is being presented from a selected angle, and this last really does say it all to me "we have agreed that if she wants to move to her mums then she can". If she doesn't like it she can go.