Flaming ungrateful step-daughter!!

[scotchmeg]

Hi there, this isn't so much a step problem as such, maybe more a general teenager one but I've made the mistake of posting elsewhere before about my DSD and got a massive flaming for being such a wicked stepmother, so I thought I'd post here where it's safer (looks around sheepishly)

So, my DSD lives with her dad and I 3/4 days a week (7 days out of 14) so she needs a proper warddrobe here rather than carry clothes to and fro. Most of the things we buy her end up straying back to her mum's never to see our door again but that is besides the point and something we're working on (any tips on this would be great!)

Despite us having DSD 50/50, DP pays way over the odds for CM which I suspect is why we have a problem with clothing for DSD whereby he is loath to spend a lot of her as he is already paying out so much.

We have had several conversations where I have explained to him that the fact is, he chooses to pay over the odds. And that is not DSD's fault. As such he just has to swallow the fact that he has to kind of pay for her twice. i.e. once for things at her mum's and once for things at ours. He does get it, he's not a cruel person... but for whatever reason we always end up in a situation where DSD needs things, and he is reluctant to buy.

So that's the background. Anyway, what usually happens is that come a new season, (DSD is 13 and growing like a weed so needs new things all the time!) I notice she needs new clothes and ask her to come up with a list of things she needs (either by herself or we do it together) so that I can take her shopping. This is out of my own pocket and so not something I am obliged to do (DP and I keep our finances seperate). I explain that it is about getting her a new wardrobe of sensible things that she can mix and match and that will get her through the season.
What I want her to think is; "that's kind, SM doesn't have to do that for me but she cares about me and wants me to feel at home so has offered to take me shopping. I'll do as she says and think of a way to spend her money wisely, oh and I should probably say 'thank you' too"
What i actually get every time (and.I.never.learn) is something like what I got this morning on text

Me: Good morning gorgeous, it's getting really cold and you'll need a new wardrobe here. Can you have a little think and put together a list of things you need - you know the drill, not one off expensive thinks that don't go with anything, but some sensible stuff that will see you through the cold winter. If you can show me that you can be sensible then I'd love for us to go on a girlie shopping trip at the end of the month and i'll get it all for you xxx"
DSD: "can we get it all from Hollister?"
Me: "haha you're funny"
DSD "I don't see why we can't?"
Me:"because a jumper in Hollister is about £60 and you need a whole wardrobe, not just one jumper"
DSD: "Will you at least think about it?"

and so on and so on.... so I am left feeling like my offer has been thrown back in my face and isn't good enough for her. We will now get locked in to tense negotiations, I'll be bombarded by emails with links to Hollister this and that, her mum will be on the phone saying that if I pay for half of a Hollister jumper for her, she'll pay for the other half... DSD will eventually agree to give in and we'll go shoppoing for the "sensible" wardrobe but the trip will turn out to be a ruse to get me to go to Hollister where she'll beg and plead with me and eventually I'll tell her she's a spoilt brat and sulk off home.
On occassion it will result in me giving in and buying an item for her, feeling really good about it because i know how much she wanted it, and then watching her forget all about it 2 seconds later, start asking for something else, take the item to her mum's and leave it there and we're back to square one with nothing for her to wear when she's here.

This is what always happens. Why do i get involved???!!! And most importantly, now that i've started it all up again, how do I stop it in it's tracks before it gets out of hand?

I can't get over how spoilt she is. I would be mortified if my DD treated her step mum in this way. I know a certain amount of it is about being a teenager, but I have spoken to my mum and she said that I was always grateful when I was bought or offered something. I can remember going shopping with my mum and longing to go to the more expensive shops but pretending to be sooo grateful for the top from C&A (what ever happened to C&A..?) thats he got for me.

A certain number of unwashed clothes go both ways, somewhat inevitably! They often arrive with dirty laundry - not a full bag, obviously, but something that hasn't yet been turned around in the laundry cycle at their mother's. That's fine. We have very few issues with laundry, apart from the odd request for a single pair of jeans to be washed/tumbled overnight (a lot cheaper than a double wardrobe).

They don't take their clothes to school - DP goes to fetch their bag/returns it by car, either first thing in the morning on his way to work or on his way home from work. We have things like pyjamas and socks/pants here for them always.

Their room looks just fine - when they are here it is full of their clothes and when they are not it is easier to do the cleaning!

Hmm, I guess you're making sense. I don't think it would work practcally for us though as DSD walks from her mum's to school (30 minutes) and then is wither picked up by DP after school to come to ours or gets the train dependant on work scheduales so couldn't lug that great bag about. If she came for a whole week at a time and then went for a whole week it would be fine but because its one day on, one off and then all weekend then sometimes half the weekend.. etc etc it just wouldn't be practical for us. Sadly.

Update DP and I spoke last night and he said he feels strongly that as his ex gets such a large amount of money to look after DSD, and everything we buy her ends up back there, he would prefer for the clothes DSD wears to have come from her Mum's and for her to just have the basics here like PJs, bras, pants, socks and other bedroom nicnacs, books etc.
He said that he loves that i'm so keen to make her feel like this is her home but there is such propaganda from her mum about how she is the true parent and our house is just somewhere that DSD visits, I am fighting a losing battle and he doesn't want to see me upset.

So I will retract my offer of buying clothes for DSd based on the fact that she didn't comply to the sensible list request nor did she show any gratitude. And we will give her a budget to go and buy PJs etc this weekend.

I feel very but I have to respect his wishes and i know deep down he is right.

Does your DSD like having to split her life between two homes? That sounds pretty hard on her.

Sorry if this sounds obtuse; but her parents live seperatly, what is the alternative?

Having one home as her main home. That's what most children from broken homes have.

You didn't answer the question though. How does your dsd feel about the situation of having to split her life between two homes.

Well regard sseperating her life between two homes, probably the same as any kid from a broken home. Wishes her parents could be together, but pleased she has a new sister and two nice step parents on either side - so makes the best of it. As I said, there is no alternative for children whose parents are seperated.

Do most children have one main home and just have occassional visits to their other parent? Not around here they don't. Most of the people I know who have seperated have made sure their children are at home with either of them.

DSD has told me she lives the 50/50 nature of the split of her time because her mum is very full on and tires her out and irratates her after a few days, and her dad is much more strict and not so much fun so he bores her after a few days. Is that what you mean?

oops loves the 50/50

Did all those men do 50/50 childcare before the split then? Because that's the only reason I can see for that sort of arrangement.

Generally children need the stability of remaining with their primary carer, if that's how the situation was previously.

I was wondering if she still saw her mum's as her main home because she keeps taking her belongings back there.

thunder that depends on the children, their ages, the new arrangements and the parents. Just because there was a SAHM and dad was someone who tucked the children into bed at night when they were 4, doesn't mean that they wouldn't be happier living with their dad at 8.

And there is an oppposite arguement to the taking her belongings to her mum's house that she needs the reassurance of having lots of her own stuff their with them to mark their space out. If she already feels "at home" with her dad then she might have less of a need to do that.

Or it could be that its easier to move stuff from her dad's to her mum's in a practical sense. Does she get dropped off there rather than having to carry bags around school all day?

Yes, if that was the case I can see what you mean.
But no, in this case it has been 50/50 since they split when she was 6 years old. She is now 13.
I the beginning it was hard as although DP did all the weekend childcare as well as the bedtime routine and got her up, fed, ready for school etc. her mum was there from 3pm until 6pm when her dad got home form work. So I guess you could say she was primary carer.

DSD does see her mothers house as her first home. It's not their old family home though and she spends only half of her time in it so I find it hard to imagine that after all these years that she would think of it as her only real home without some persuasion from mum.

Not really. Children need security and stability. If a parent feels a great need to share in childcare then he will have done it before the split not after. What happens in these 50-50 splits where men who take on their children half the time without having demonstrated prior commitment to hands on childcare generally hand over the care to another woman to do it for them, as their wives/partners did it before. Given that the OP is shopping for her DSD's clothes at her dad whilst her dad doesn't want to spend anything that sounds exactly what has happened. What sort of a father expects his new wife to pay for his own child's clothes instead of doing it himself?

Also the idea that a child is marking their place at home is risible. Even her dad thought she was a visitor at his house, expecting her to bring her things with her. Children keep their stuff at home as does everybody else. Or is your own home empty of your belongings because you feel at home there MrsHoarder.

Sorry your post isn't clear Scothmeg. Who was your DSD's primary carer before the divorce. I take it she didn't go to school from day 1 of her life. There must have been someone looking after her.

I have an ex-DSD (is that complicated?) and I was always shocked at how differently she behaved to me when I was that age with regards possessions. It is partly the times and partly teenagers. Here's what I had to do when I was 14 - oh and had a job from age 12 - half a saturday.
a) Make a budget detailing all the things I would spend the money on and this included clothes AND shoes
b) write it all down - all broken down by type of thing (stationary, clothes, books, haircuts)
c) Have a long (tedious!) discussion with parents to explain about it and how I would make it work + what i would contribute myself.

Having done all this, they gave me the money without a murmur. It was £25 a month!!!! About 20 years ago...

thunderbolt - he doesnt expect me to buy her clothes. He expects his ex to buy her clothes, with the money he gives her each month. It is me who wants to buy DSD things for when she is with us.

You are right, it is strange when a dad who has had no interest in child care suddenly wants 50/50 after a split - and I suspect in that instance it is to do with minimising CM payments.

But as you can see from my posts that isn't the case with my DP so I don't see the relevence here. He pays over the odds in CM, not taking in tot account any of the days that DD is with us. The only motivation for her being here 50/50 is that he wants to be close to here. Besides that fact that even if he didn't, his ex has made it quite clear that she couldn't cope with having her DD any more than she does at the moment nor would she want to so this is all academic. There is no alternative to 50/50 care in DSDs case.

DP and I would have her here 100% if that's what she and her mother wanted.

I said in my post that her mum is technically her primary carer. From when she was born until she went to school she was at home with her mum and she would do all of the day to day care.
When she started school, dad would get her up, feed and dress her and take her to school. Mum would fetch from school and have her from 3 - 6 when dad came home and would do story/ bath/ bed. At weekends they would spend time as a family. Although DP did ballet & swimming lesson duty.
At 6 years old, they split up and residence was se at 50/50. It has been this way for the past 7 years.

Can "primary carer" not change through a person's life? If your mum was a stay at home mum for 5 years and then went to work a 60 hour week and dad became a stay at home dad for the next 8... would Mum still be the primary carer? Would the children suffer because they didn't have the same person by their side their whole life?

tee-hee Polly - that is exactly what my DP wanted to do. DSD's mum made alsorts of remarks about him being a sarjeanet major and me being his lieutenant and after a while he was so put down by the jibes that he changed his mind.
I thought it a bit full on to be honest - I'm rubbish at budgets even at 29!

Budgeting isn't a punishment for her - it's actually a kind thing to do all round, for her and for all of you! Maybe you can 'fess up to being rubbish at budgets too and do one of your own with her....

thunderboltsandlightning - your posts on 50:50 are full of sexist prejudice!

thunder I was thinking of the specific case of my BIL (much younger than my DH and I) who is free to stay with whichever parent he wants at a given time as long as he spends at least one night a week with each. Before his parents split my MIL was a SAHM, and obviously primary carer but after the split she had to work long hours (FIL could not support two households alone) and FIL cut back his hours to spend more time with BIL. Incedently for a time BIL had to be nudged to spend time with MIL because he was happier at his dad's.

This is a clear case of the primary carer changing as a family's circumstances change: it was no longer possible for the mother to spend as much time on her child so the father stepped up for the responsibility as any good man should in this situation. I don't think this is unfair or that the child suffers from both parents acting like they are responsible for their child's wellbeing.

When a new stepmother came onto the scene who is almost universally disliked he cut back on his time with them because he wanted to avoid her but moved more and more of his stuff into that house. It seemed to me that he was trying to mark his territory in a house where he felt less secure and happy to be in. Of course I don't do it, but I am not in a position of living between two locations. Its going to always be the case, but neither is your idea of why a child might leave things at one house rather than another

ScotchMeg From a practical sense is it easier for your DSD to move stuff to her mum's house than to yours? Or does she always changeover through school? A practical solution might just be to try and change where/when you meet her to try and make it easier for her to carry a bag between houses. Obviously always having to move supplies for the next 3-4 days through school is inconvenient and makes her stand out more, something that teenagers generally try to avoid!

Its not always going to be the case.

Shouldn't try to write long posts!

change over is usually done through school yes. DSD likes to go in to town with her friends after school rather than to her mum's and DP will either pick her up from there or she will get a train to us so it is a bit tricky logistically.
Although following mine and DP's conversation last night I am going to take a step back from worrying about it too much and let them find their own way a little more.

mrshoarder "he wanted to avoid her but moved more and more of his stuff into that house. It seemed to me that he was trying to mark his territory in a house where he felt less secure and happy to be in." this is interesting. I'm not saying for a moment that DSD is unhappy in her mother's house. But this has made me wonder if rather than the fact that DSD keeps taking things back to her mothers being a sign that she doesn't feel like our house is her home - maybe it's a case of her being so secure here, she doesnt feel that she needs to horad things here? I have heard her speking to friends on the phone and talking baout our house as "home" in a very natural way. She also does this with DP and I. The only person she doesnt refer to this place as home to is her mother. Which i guess is understandable as when she's there, or in "mum-head-space" her Mum's house is her home.

I think kids are fairly adaptable. My DD is 6 and she is quite happy with her 2 homes. She understands there are different rules in both as well and will often remind me when i say "Daddy wouldn't allow that!" that "yes mummy, but there are different rules in each house so yoooou can allow it!"

I haven't read all the thread yet but something just came to me. I lived with foster parents 4-7 and they bought me lovely clothes to wear and when I visited my mother she would send me back in not so lovely stuff that frequently didn't fit right. Why????? Well, I could guess why but ykwim.

to be fair she is at that age where it is normal to feel life is not fair and to try and push the boundaries, so whatever you do, just give her firm boundaries, and dont give in to bbuying her expensive clothes unless a present, once you have bought the clothes for that season dont buy anymore, is she comes with no clothes that is her problem, she will be probably be embarassed by wearing tatty clothes, so when she realises you are serious she will bring some.

unless she is just unorganised and forgets to bring clothes/ cant be bothered to carry a bag to school?

"Mostly at myself for managing this all wrong again"

I don't think you did that, or anything else wrong. You tried to do a nice thing and your DSD is ungrateful. She needs to be taught appreciation, etc. She doesn't have to be rude because she is a teenager. Not all of teenagers are rude. Just as men get away with not doing X because they are men, is bollocks, so is kids being allowed to act like spoilt kids more than once.