NOW CLOSED: Is it still a home if you don't own it? Make your voice heard and discuss this topic with Barclays - £150 John Lewis voucher up for grabs

[AnnMumsnet]

Hello - you may have seen that this week Barclays have a big campaign to get people talking about home buying and money topics.

Yesterday we discussed "When are you too old to ask your parents for financial help?".

As stated before - the team at Barclays say "We want to know what Mumsnetters think about home buying and money dilemmas.

So our second question is "Is it still a home if you don't own it?""

Please share your thoughts on this thread - there are no right or wrong answers and the question will mean different things to different MNers.

Add your thoughts below and you'll be entered into a prize draw where one winner will get a £150 John Lewis voucher.

Look out for one final thread on Thursday where we'll be asking one more question.

Thanks MNHQ

PS Please note your comments along with your MN name may be used on the Barclays pages on Mumsnet and elsewhere.

People are too unnecessarily fixated on the ultimate prize of home ownership, often at any foolish financial price.
Life in general has changed in recent generations and people are more mobile than ever. Being a family "on the move" and needing to relocateoften abroadfor my husband's job every few years makes home ownership downright foolish. But that doesn't mean our rental properties were any less of a home than our owned ones. Home is where a family dwells, no matter how it's funded.

From the comments, there are clearly different types of tenancy and security (I don't mean in the legal sense) which have an effect on how you regard the house you rent.

We sold our house nearly three years ago and rented, hoped it would be for a few years, but then the Landlord lost his job and needed his house back so, out of the blue, we had a month to find somewhere else to live. We'd only been there five months. We found another house to rent, and moved again, and although we secured ourselves with longer tenancy agreements, I was always half expecting them not to be extended at each annual renewal.

The thing though that I found most affected how I thought of it as home was the fact that I couldn't put my stamp on it. They had just done it up and it was immaculate, so I was constantly aware of marking the carpets or the boys (yes - three boys in a rental !! ) bouncing balls off the walls etc etc. Every wall was the dreaded magnolia, and they didn't want us to put up loads of pictures. We had to ask permission to get a dog (they said yes ) - but having to ask for something like that ..... No, it didn't feel like home in so many ways.

We finally bought our own house again this summer and my first job was to paint the boys' rooms funky colours and put loads of posters up for them. I now drink RED wine again with no fear of spilling it on the carpet, cos they're MY carpets. Marks on the walls .... just touch them up. I can plant what I like in the garden. Yes, this is home.

Your home is where you call home few people in fact own unless you have no mortgage the bank owns it! Banks are worried if people stop buying houses as it generates a large amount of revenue by lending you the money. Don't be fooled they will take it away as easily as they give you the loan if you don't pay!
So a home is where you make it rented or mortgaged!

I think it's your home if you feel it is.

I've owned a home and I lost it when my business went under. I've been in private rented and the landlord wanted it back. I now have a HA home. I decorate it how I like and as long as I pay my rent and am not a nuisance, I have a home for life. I don't have to worry about repairs, buildings insurance, etc. I feel very lucky.

Caution - unpopular view alert

People say they own their home when they are paying the mortgage but imo, until you pay off your mortgage, your lender owns your home as much as you do anyway. You could call them your landlord. Except you've got to do all the repairs etc yourself...

This idea of owning your home = an asset. imo, people have been trained to see home ownership as an asset when in fact (i think anyway) it is a liability. It takes money out of your pocket. You don't own it for 25 years, you have to pay all manner of insurances on it, the deposit ties up your capital, you have to maintain it, etc, etc

At what point does all that expense become an asset? It ties up your capital, reduces your available cash and you have to work harder to keep chucking money at it.

If you can't make investments that generate enough cash to pay for your home and the associated costs - it's not that much of an asset

Your assets are the things you have. Your liabilities are those things you fork out for. You tell me which section a house goes into

I would say it completely depends on your landlord, the condition of the house and the minimum period of your tenancy. And your mindset.

great post HEC

Yes anybody can own a house but its who lives in it that makes it a home. You wouldn't say I'm going back to a house would you, you say I'm going 'home'.

You do get to have a house at the end of 25 years though. After 25 years of paying rent, all that tenants have to show for it is that they've bought their landlord a house.

Having a mortgage is not the same as having a landlord. A bank won't tell you you can't have pets or put pictures up or paint the rooms how you want them. A bank won't give you notice to leave even if you have kept the place immaculately and not fallen behind with your payments to them. They won't send around cowboy builders to do botch jobs and fuck your house up for you.

Probably more people would be more OK about renting if they were housed by the LA or an HA; it's not ownership on paper that matters but security and self-determination about your home environment.

I've never felt that any house I rented was home.
But I think it depends on how long you are staying for and what your landlord will allow you to do

I'm a landlord also and some of my tenants have definitely made it their home without major works.

Everyone is talking like no one has ever lost the house that they have bought with a mortgage.

Thanks Hec for pointing out that people lose such homes all the time.

A house is home if you make it a home. Doesn't matter how it's decorated or who actually owns the bricks and mortar.

It matters when your landlord evicts you, which they can do for no reason. It matters quite a lot then.

It matters when you wind up moving, and paying the cost of moving, two or more times in a year, when you can't find another home in the same catchment and have to move your kids' schools over and over again, when you don't have a working boiler and your landlord refuses to fix it or drags it out so have no heat or hot water (and it's illegal to withold rent in such a situation).

Yes, people lose mortgaged homes all the time, but I doubt it happens or has potential to happen twice or more a year.

Well, if the laws in your country allow your landlord to evict you willy nilly when you have a lease? You and your country have much bigger problems than whether or not your rented property is a home.

Up until a year or two ago, I would have agreed that a home is where the heart is. I had rented for 5 years and loved my "home". The landlord allowed me to make improvements at my own cost and I did just that as I felt that although it was his house, it was my home

Then I discovered the Landlord had been made bankrupt and we had to move pretty sharpish.

We then bought a property - I now feel that this feels more like home , I pay the mortgage (cheaper than the previous rent) it's mine. No-one can kick me out at a moments notice

But people are just pointing out what they feel are the barriers to somewhere feeling like home. Overwhelmingly, people seem to be saying on this thread that the laws are in favour of the landlord (though I'm sure there's loads of landlords on Mumsnet who would disagree).

A great shake up needs to happen with the laws with regard to making private renting more stable. I imagine it's already happening to an extent - for example, the laws have changed around tenancy deposits. Landlords now have to insure their deposit with a scheme or they risk having to pay their tenant 3 times the amount of the deposit. That is fair, given that some landlords used to with hold deposits with no good reason, and there was no way to really dispute this.

I think there was also talk of landlords having to offer 2 year leases as standard (with a break clause) - but maybe I made that up.

Barclays say - "thanks for all your comments so far. The question today is designed to get folks talking about differences between how renting and owning a home (with or without a mortgage) can make you view your home/ where you live - your responses clearly demonstrate, as stated in the OP, that we are all different and have different experiences as well as views. There are no right or wrong answers and we are after debate and discussion with these threads".

ouryve asked how responses will be used by Barclays and they say "this Mumsnet activity is part of a wider national campaign to get the nation talking about home buying issues, we'll look at the themes and views to help shape our banking and support."

thanks, MNHQ

Yes. I've never felt more at home than I do in my current (rented) place. I've lived in my 'own' home, too. The liberating thing about renting is that I don't pour energy into decorating. It's a good lesson in making peace with what's here.

In theory a home is a home whether rented or not. We used to consider our uni digs home too even though we knew it was just temporary. We were fortunate that our landlord had been happy to allow us to decorate if we wished to and we used to make the effort to keep the garden nice too. But I used to always feel a little nervous in case something got damaged. Once we were in a home we owned then I just felt more relaxed and it was lovely to be able to decorate and do things exactly how we wanted. The house next door has just gone up to let and the price they are asking for is way more than our mortgage but I suppose it is so hard to get onto the property ladder that landlords can charge lots. I really think it is hard for those starting out. We have friends that have always rented and just because they are relaxed and happy about renting their place always feels like home and we had no idea for years that they didn't own it.

I own a leasehold flat it sometimes feels like I have all the worst bits, the burden of a mortgage and all the responsibility of maintenance, but still have a freeholder (landlord) so it isn't really mine

It is still my home though

Is apartheid still wrong if you're make money from it?

For me home is definitely more about being with the people you love, I have lived in 3 houses in the last 4 years and all of them were home because we were all together. I know you can't always paint walls or change furniture in a rented house, but you can use photos, personal items, cushions and blankets to transform a room. For my children I have found that with familiar toys, bedding and favourite blanket a new house becomes home almost instantly.

I felt really at home in my last (rented) accommodation.It was great - a tidy little semi in a decent-ish area. It takes a lot for me to feel 'at home' - as a child we were moved around a lot and as a result I have found it quite hard to settle. I always seem to be thinking ahead to the next move.
Last year we got an offer we couldn't refuse from FIL who offered to move out of DH's family home in order for us to move in and do as we wish with it. In theory it was an amazing idea and I really looked forward to being more settled without having to adhere to the usual landlord rules. In this house we can pretty much do what we like, decorate as and when and generally enjoy. In practice however, I couldn't feel less at home. It doesn't feel right and now we don't really have the option to move without causing a huge family ruckus, whereas if we had rented and hated it we could just move after the lease was up. I suppose we have a bit more security, but I didn't have a great relationship with FIL anyway and now that he is expecting me to be eternally grateful and I am not, it's just making things worse.
The whole house needs blown up and started again - it was FIL's family home for 25 years and he is a terrible hoarder - it's taken us this long to do the basics. We don't have a kitchen because he refuses to do it up (we have a sink and an oven, but workspace is null and void. Flooring is up in the kitchen so down to bare boards which catch on feet and is covered in nails. No doors downstairs because all were dangerous and had to be removed (we have 2 small ds). Everything is desperately needing renovated beyond what we initially thought. It's awful. It's going to take such a long time to do it, so we are currently stuck in the position of trying to do stuff and trying to save up for our own place.

Blech.

Anyway. Yes, a home can be a home whether it is rented or not. But only if you are happy in it.

Yes.

We owned a house in the UK (well, the bank did...). We moved over to the USA this year and are renting. Does it feel any less like a 'home'? Not at all. My husband and my daughter are there, and it's still my refuge at the end of a tough day.

The old saying is true 'Home Is Where The Heart Is'.

The actual bricks and mortar,ownership, fripperies etc don't count for anything without a family to make it a home.

I've never owned my own home, I wish I could but sadly its not an option at the moment.
I don't personally feel its is "my" house, but its home iyswim? The way I see it is, four walls and a roof isn't home. Its bricks, mortar and tiles.

Home is where my family are, where my belongings are, where my memories are.

I say this, of course, as someone who has moved 5 times in the space of the last 6 years!

I don't feel its my house as its owned by someone else, so I'm hesitant to do any major stuff to a house that's not mine except slapping some paint on the walls. But then, the traditional thing of buying a house and paying a mortgage off is becoming less than commonplace for most anyway.