AAAAAaaaaagggghhhhhhhhhhhh

[Jimjams]

Just got the report for ds1's statement review on Friday from the school and have 2 words to say F* Off!!!!!

There I feel better now I HATE all this shit. Especially all the political shit.

The thing is that whether or not there would be a place for your boy at a special school, you & dh do have choices as his parents, jimjams, negligable as these can sometimes seem, I imagine. Basically, since you think this school is the best place available for him and have chosen that he goes there, he has every right to stay there and have his educational needs met there. If the school felt they couldn't meet his needs- which I am sure they don't, just hypothesizing- they'd have to convince you of that or argue that he is seriously interrupting other children's education- which clearly they can't or you would know all about it already.

I think that maddiemo may well be right in both her guesses, actually- it could easily be politics to blame for the restraint stuff and a quest for continued support funds at the root of the negativity. Hope so. Really glad the LSA was able to reassure you a bit anyway.

Haven't read all of this, SN has exploded with activity today! I think the restraint training is standard for anyone working in special settings, don't know about M/S. The staff at my son's school have certainly done it. Sorry, will have to read this sometime, off to NAS conference tomorrow, lucky me

There are 2 special schools we would consider. One is for communication disorders- but I'm not sure whether they tend to specialise in higher functioning children who can't cope with m/s school. The people I know who have managed to get thier children in there have had to battle for over 2 years and have the m/s placement completely broken down before getting a place (for example someone I know's son had been in m/s for 3 years, hadn't learned anything, had escaped from school twice and was in a room separate from his classmates for 98% of the time- he was refused and refused and refused.) The other school is an SLD school changing to being more autism based. The children I know who go there are more severe than ds1- although that doesn't worry me especially- it'sa good school and I think they do adapt quite well to differing needs, but I don't know anyone who has gone there from m/s - normally they are in specialist schools, or MLD schools. Also it is of course full afaik.

I do think that a properly supported m/s environment is the best place for him at the moment- given the choice of schools in this area. But I think maybe they need to talk to me more. They forget that I have worked with him as well- I know the difficulties with working with him- I'm running the home ABA programme at the moment ffs!

had another look at the SALTs report and she has written under recommendations that we all (inlcuding me ) need to meet to discuss behaviour management so that he is given a consistant response. I do think at this stage that they need behaviour management training not restraint training (if they use restraint on him I can guarantee they will end up with more problems).

Hi Jimjams,

I am writing with regards to your earlier comment as stated below:-

"To give another example of the situation here there was a boy in last night's paper who had been expelled for scary outburts- he was statemented and described as "mildly autisitc with learning difficulties" NO chance of special school".

Am saddened though not totally surprised that such things happen. Unfortunately this sort of scenario is far from uncommon. Were you aware that no stats are kept on such children who are excluded so the true number is not known? I know of another family who is in the same situation with his infants school (school have set out to permanently exclude on grounds that school cannot "cope"). She is going to remove her son from mainstream and place him elsewhere. All this particular school wants I feel is no SEN problems. Staff also had little to no training in working with such children (particularly the dinnerladies).

I do hope that a future meeting re Behaviour management training is constructive and that they listen to you, make them listen!!.

I wish you and your family all the best. IPSEA could also advise (www.ipsea.org.uk).

I rang ds1's private SALT to talk through my issues with her. The thing I thought was wrong with PECS is wrong so she will talk to his NHS SALT to warn her- and she will tell the school.

Re the headbutting- I told her and she said "oh dear" this is what she meant when she told me they were escalating the situation- as she saw an incident. Apparently his LSA (who is leaving on Friday btw) wanted him to do something - he wouldn't so she kind of restrained him and he flipped his head backwards. She said she was quite shocked and this is why she had recommended in the report that they need to talk about behaviour management with me and do what we are doing at home etc. Anyway she then offered to come to the meeting on Friday- I said yes please - and so she will be there as well. I'm really pleased as I can hand all this over to her- they'll listen to her more than me (I said that to her and she said "well of course you're just a mother you've lost all brain cells".

We talked through the restraint training request and she felt that they were just over-reacting to their mismanagement of his behaviour.

We also talked through the bit where it says that his LSA is isolated etc and she said that was their problem if that was the case (don't think it is such a problem with the new LSA and the new class teacher). Talked about other schools etc and I got the impression she still thinks that mainstream should be able to cope wth him. She said that keeping his attention is hard but that his behaviour is NOT challenging. (Exactly what I would have said if asked).

So thank god for her- she is worth every penny. She understands autism, LIKES autism and has become a friend. Will be leaning on her on Friday....

am I being thick here? but do his school really think he will be given an automatic place at a special school? Not trying to be negative but I and all the other parents of the kids in dd's class had to fight tooth and nail to get them in her special school, tpically this was normal for her old special school too.

if he would get an automatic place, i wouldnt discount it straight away. My dd went to a PD (physically disabled) school first in Staffs. I dont know it was appropriate for her but they had alot of of children with autism (which is bloody suprising really) who used to acheive really well there. Now she goes to a school for children with severe and complex learning disabilities. It is quite a mixed class, i wont lie. there are alot of higher functioning autistic children who require a rigid structure, some moderate auti types (like dd really, and some that have severe physical and learning disabilities. I know i am not being very PC, i am trying to explain as simply as possible. But the reason i liked it was because they get specialist help and they get alot more one to one. They dont 'keep' them there full time, they have outreach places to mainstream school but it is all controlled well by the school without us as parents getting involvedas much, ie. nagging for support etc. She does lots of extra cirricular activities, and they seem to understand what her needs are and it really suits her. this is us.

You have to go with what you think is right. It is a bloody hard decision, dont be railroaded into anything you dont want to do. If you think he is flourishing where he is, they have to respect that decision. you must fell so pissed off though that they go about things in such a manner and it must make you feel very sad. I really hope you feel more at ease with things and they stop stressing you out by it, at the end of the day all we want is for our children to be settled and happy with the right support, wherever that may be. As long as they reach their full potential that is all we as parents can wish for.

HTH, i feel like i have waffled on forever!

just read your last post! glad things are going in the right direction

I do get the impresssion snmum that lots in the mainstream sector don't realise how difficult it is to get a place in special school. maybe they're just slightly out of date. The ed psych told us last yeart that 4 years ago ds1 would have been automatic special school but now things have changed and if a child is "coping" in mainstream (never mind doing well- just coping) then the policy is that they are mainstreamed. Some authorities seem to be implementing this change faster than others but ours is well into it. Our local communication disorder school is REDUCING its numbers despite rocketing numbers of autistic kids and already having 15-20 kids going for each place.

been in touch with the SALT again- she has spoken to the NHS SALT and they are in agreement so she will be representing both of them (Ithe private one). She's going to be doing all the difficult stuff for me. Also she cheered me up as she said that his class teacher was really positive and keen when she saw her . I have a feeling that a lot of the report has originated from the LSA who is leaving in conversation with the SENCO and head?? Not sure- but I do think that the people now involved with him are more positive than reflected in the report. We'll see on Friday anyway. Really hoping to not have to say very much too be honest!

That sounds much more positive. Good luck!

Isn't there a home/school book where kicking/head butting would be recorded ON THE DAY plus an accident/incident form for the same which you have to sign? Restraint is also the last thing you should do with my DS, communicating with him is much better and works, I even have a sheet with hints and tips for people who work with him outside school and this is one of the points. I think it would be extremely difficult for them to remove him from m/s inclusion to a special setting, especially against your wishes (and as there are no places anyway), I just can't see it happening, what with all the other issues like transport etc. A tactic you could keep up your sleeve is ask them to recommend another/better m/s school that would do a better job, that would embarrass them!

One of the things I'm going to say is that I MUST be told if he headbutts or kicks as this is NOT normal behaviour for him. May also point out that his ABA tutor records this every week (for example this week says pinch x 1 along with a list of sniffing books, playing with ears and humming).

I did have quite a long chat with the SALT and she saw the behaviour dealt with inappropriately and escalated. She works with a behavioural approach anyway so we're always working along the same lines. I've also lent the school his ABA video - this weeks session (only 5 mins recorded) he is an angel-VERY compliant- but it shows them what is achievable with positive reinforcement. Some earlier footage shows his tutor using reinforcement to gain compliance (rather than restraint!).

I do feel happier that the SALT will be having the difficult conversation. And it is better that she corrects them on their PECS targets rather than me.

God I really hate all this stuff.

Actually I should draw up a form for them to use to record behaviour daily. I'm sure you sent me one in the past Davros - before he started at school. I will look back through my emails.

If not I can send you one or its easy to construct one. I think a form works better as you get exactly the info you want and they don't feel intimated with having to write free form. You can always change and adapt it according to new behaviours etc.

ooooer matron, intimated!

If its handy can you send me one to adapt. I'm sure I do have it somewhere but am useless (brain has really turned to jelly this pregnancy).

Will try to remember, mother and baby group tomorrow Remind me if I forget.

Just read through this JimJams and just want to say - I'm having a glass of wine for you, right now.

Hope you're all okay.

I agree that people do feel it is easy to access special school provision. Also that any special schools can cope with all needs.

One of our local councillors at a meeting said that if a "child can survive mainstream they should be mainstreamed."

Its very sad.

Good luck for Friday.

god don't these people think about what they're saying. I'm sure they wouldn't be very happy if their precious little Johnny was just "surviving" school. Unbelievable.

I was late dropping ds1 off today so had a chat with his teacher and she's really positive said something like "oh I really want to go for this" so maybe the negativity of the report is a leftover from last year..... Ah well we'll find out tomorrow.....

I think it's about time they realised that this is how things are. inclusion means they HAVE to cope with special needs kids. The blame and responsibility for the childs behaviour should not be placed at the Mothers door. If your ds is showing abnormal behaviours for him at school, it is the school's problem not yours. honestly they really F88k me off

and as for special school's, they just cost too much money so why not close them, they are no use to anyone (said in a sarcastic tone)

They have just closed a special school in the town I grew up in and the parents are frantically worried about their kids 'surviving' mainstream. My dd is lucky (!) in that they would not consider mainstream for her and that our local SLD school is very good. However, I've got a number of friends with SN kids who are starting mainstream. My friend's little girl has started WITHOUT support and they are just going to see HOW SHE GETS ON (ie: she'll have to struggle before they help). She's got epilepsy and motor problems and loses her balance alot. My friend has to watch her all the time to make sure she doesn't hurt herself. She is verbal but at the one-word stage. Think my friend is keen for her to go mainstream but would like support. It's such a nighmare situation

ps Mind you, I am in the Severe Learning Difficulties an Autism battle of the schools now! There is only one SLD autistic unit with around 5 places and I've got to argue that is the ONLY provision suitable for my DD!!!

she's at a one word level and in without support??????????? WTF????

It seems to be policy here to send children into mainstream first and only statement or remove them if they fail.
Jakbrown How on earth will she learn without support.
Our other coucillor clanger is that SEN is costing more due to the high number of children surviving difficult births. He then claimed this had been taken out of context when the local rag printed it.
One of the teachers at ds school said she could see the children ending up in mainstream colouring pictures at the back of the class and learning nothing.
Education, education, education.

Jakbrown,

Would like to know what the "thinking" (I use that word advisedly) was behind this decision not to send your friend's daughter into the lions den (aka school) without any support whatsoever as its blindingly obvious from your message she needs specialist support.

Maddiemo,

This scenario is also not uncommon where I live I am saddened to report.

Infact the first Ed Pysch verbally stated to me in the months before DS started Infants that if a request for a statement for my son came across her desk now she would refuse it (how many lives has she ruined - IPSEA actually asked her that!!). His Ed Pysch got changed to another such bod and on her recommendation (as well as complete back up from the school) he now has a statement (he needs extra help in class as was originally dx with speech and language and development delay).

What's really disturbing is that in a list of LES'a in terms of how they are, the LEA that I fall under appears to be no worse or better than any of them.

And that's another thing:-
How on earth are "NT" children going to learn that not all children are "normal" like them and that children with disabilities regardless of their nature need help support and understanding (to name but three) from a mainstream school setting. If such children are not seen to be helped by school how on earth are they going to learn tolerance and acceptance of such people when these kids hit adulthood?. Ignorance breeds fear.