Non-Violent Resistance by Haim Omer. Has anyone read this???

[Swanhildapirouetting]

A friend was recommended this to deal with her 13 year old's violent rages. I've read it, just out of interest, as a counter to The Explosive Child.
He also talks about dealing with OCD children and self-imurement.
He seems to discount all "pathologies" ie: autism, or OCD and say that it is the family dynamics (specifically parental authority) that needs to be sorted.

Any thoughts? I've been thinking a lot of about control issues, child trying to control me, me trying to control child and how it all stacks up.

On the whole it seems an excellent book, promoting reconciliation, security, ending violent attacks on family members, shouting screaming, preaching, escalation...but I just wondered whether there is something flawed about his approach to child's intrinsic reasons for being violent etc. He is anti a pyschotherapeutic approach to individual child and focuses on parent more.

What, you mean hostages and prisoners on suicide watch?

See this does not appear to have any ability to work in practice.

My ds has learnt (almost!) to compose himself in public spaces/ clubs etc. he holds a lot in. My general clue to this is that we have to get straight into the car when I collect him, when we've finished. That's his time to cry, get frustrated and let it all out. It's not the time for me to reason with him or give him suggestions. I just can't imagine then sitting on him for an hour whilst he proposes a solution.

A big part of his SN is that his processes need to be when he can emotionally process them. The main reason for his breakdowns are because of the rules/ expectations placed on him.

Placing more is as counter productive as you can get.

Excellent post polter

Loads of temper is pretty accurate

Thanks PolterGoose. I had to, and then share it because I know how something like this could have hurt me if I had read it two years ago when I felt depressed, alone and confused, not understanding what was wrong with my boy.

You're not kidding, youare!

My ds's rages were definitely expressive (although he tries to control things in other ways). And he felt miserable about them, and so scared to loose control of himself - not satisfied!

In our house, the child with ASD is the least prone to angry outbursts. For the other three, the Dawn Huebner book has been helpful.

I'm sorry that discussion of this book has made everyone so upset. I think I haven't explained the book properly, partly the reason I wanted to ask the opinion of others. He certainly does not advocate demanding solutions from a child who is in middle of behaving violently or sit-ins there and then. There is no force or bullying of any kind.

Knowing what I do about autism (and dyspraxia) I do think he is wrong to assume that the parents can "make it alright" by just making the child feel safe, without knowing any more specific techniques to handle triggers and outbursts, or underlying reasons why they might be set off in a sensory defensive child who found it very difficult to cope with social situations. On the other hand, you could say that is all part of the parent showing the child they are safe, and that the parent will protect them, and that they don't NEED to use expressive or instrumental violence to release their frustration, because the parent is going to give them the power to function. You could say that the parents show by various actions and reactions their children that they will care for them and make them safe, and that in itself is what is stopping violence. Just like another poster's example of child having a tantrum and understanding it, yet helping them see it will not do.

HOWEVER, in some families, violence whether expressive or instrumental can destroy some of the bonds that allow the parents to cope with their children at all. I suppose he is saying you have to start by tackling that, because it is intolerable, and the parent has to say at some point, I'm your parent I love you I'm on your side, but I do not accept this violence. I am not responding to it at all. It cannot make me do what you want me to do, whatever that is.

Thank you everyone for your comments I have gone back and reread the book and put it in perspective. Ds2 has meltdowns but it was dd's behaviour that was the concern to me - because we were at the stage where whatever we did to please her she wanted more, and we didn't know quite want she wanted from us. And she was hitting us and her brothers to release tension. She is NT and happy at school, but evidently not so happy in her family set up. We certainly haven't done any sit ins on her. We haven't needed to, BECAUSE the moment I said that I would not allow her to hit her brothers or me and nor would I allow her brothers to hurt her feelings, and also that I was very sorry for any times where I had allowed her brothers to hurt her feelings, and I had not given her the attention she needed (because of ds2) it was like a weight was lifted. I felt confident, she felt safer. And I know how to handle situations from now on. If ds2 says something inappropriate to her, I no longer think he can't help it, I intervene and remind him that he is not allowed to say something inappropriate. And vice versa if she hits him. It is about stopping the violent reactions through parental presence, which in our case was lacking, as we got more and more overwhelmed by firefighting.

My sibling and DS's violence have only ever been the "flight" reaction when totally overwhelmed. Nobody can be reasoned with when in a state of terror, the survival instinct is just too darn strong.

Lecturing either of them is never going to be the solution. Empowering the people around them with the knowledge to help ensure that they never reach that state of blind terror not only works but enhances the self-esteem of the carer. They have two very different conditions, I suspect some forms of epilepsy require a similar level of informed assistance on the part of the carer or perhaps drug treatment, as my sibling has also required from childhood on.

Telling someone already suffering from extreme anxiety that "it's not acceptable" is so counterproductive as to be cruel, especially if you embed it so that it becomes the automatic, consistent response. That risks violence becoming directed towards the self - essentially causing the individual to become potential self-harming even suicidal. It may be OK for for some forms of anger management, but I've never had to deal with this so am not sure.

I think this sort of over stereotypical simplification can be very dangerous, especially as there are many evidence based alternative approaches, which especially if used from as young an age as possible can be incredibly effective. Polter's distinction between the types of violence resonated very strongly with me.

You don't lecture them. You don't give consequences of the usual sort, punishments or rewards or outcomes. You don't even say words like "acceptable or unacceptable" (sorry I got that wrong...that's what I used to say, and it definitely didn't work, you are right there You just keep intervening by being there or bringing another highly regarded adult into the room. You remind the other child you are protecting them whether from insults or blows by just saying the words I will not allow you to hit x. You exude confidence that you want the best for them, and that you are an adult and will protect them, but from now on it is your duty to stop the violence in the house. You only say that once, at the beginning. You stop reacting to violence with submission or threats.

I think most of the people on the SN board who experience violence are very very good at defusing it, because they don't react with submission or threats, and they are just "there",and they do provide a parental presence. I know that that is probably why ds2 isn't violent and why he does trust us. And if he was upset and angry about something, school friends food he knows I am on his side and will support him. And that makes a big difference to his reactions.

I was only trying to unravel in my mind, what aspect of this v thought provoking book, made sense and WHY it made sense, and why it didn't make sense. It has been reprinted by Cambridge, and I don't think they publish crackpots.

I don't know why I used that phrase it is unacceptable bochead it must be some sort of Freudian slip, because I associate that phrase with humiliation and shame, telling the children off when I am very very angry with them, or being told by other grownups that something I have done is unacceptable. It is a horrid phrase, bureaucratic and contemptous in equal measure. I think you can say you can allow them to be anxious just not to hit people when they are anxious, and that if they are anxious you will help them and find some other way for them to express their anxiety, just not by hitting you.. That would be the long term goal. But if they started hitting you at the beginning you wouldn't say anything, you would just leave the room, and come back another time.

If your child was in a playground and he hit other children, and the school complained, your natural instinct would be to ask for 1:1 help in the playground rather than just accepting it or punishing him/her. You wouldn't expect the child who was hit to just be left unprotected. Or you might expect them to provide some other form of adult prescence in a nurture club or an activity, alongside the children. You would "intervene" not just say, he can't help it. You would understand his reasons for hitting out but that doesn't mean you wouldn't intervene.

julia don't you think the control issue is about how if it is only way you get a response, anger will become a way to control people. Everyone wants to be in control surely, so if one method doesn't work you will choose the one that does, even if it has a negative effect. If it releases tension you could say that anger and violence had a positive feedback loop for some children. The calm after the storm and all that. We certainly have that sort of mood swing going on in our house. Screaming following by smiles and cuddles

But I've seen ds2 looking in the mirror when he is screaming at us. It is as if he is almost aware of his angry powerful self. It is very upsetting and unsettling. Btw I thought this before I read the book..

zzzz The book is proclaiming Non Violent Resistance. In this case to violent and self destructive children. It is not specifically aimed at children with SNs, just at families with violent children. I don't think he mentions autism once. Although as I said in the post he mentions OCD and children who are on medication for ADHD and anxiety which he never disputes (the medication I mean)

My sibling doesn't have autism, and frankly she can be exceptionally dangerous if handled wrongly, as she's incredibly smart and creative.

Is the book just trying to say parents shouldn't lose the plot no matter the provocation, but should remain calm during violent outbursts?

Violence is a form of communication, just as any other behavior is, and in children especially is often a cry for help, where the child has no clue as to what form that help should take. I think if adults could remember this, it would help them investigate the reasons behind the behavior in the first instance, rather than as a last resort after their own repeated angry responses have failed to induce the desired effect. I've often thought this should be a compulsory part of teacher training too.