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Here are some suggested organisations that offer expert advice on special needs.

Original poster

I have in my hand a piece of paper...

161 replies

inappropriatelyemployed · 13/12/2013 18:23

Ok, I don't want to rejoice as I feel brutalised but I have an amended statement in my hand with an out of school package on it for DS.

SEVEN months after he left school.

They say they have agreed direct payments too - well we'll see.

But thank you all. Thank you Wet and Agnes and Star and Towie and Senmerrygoround and so many others who have been kind enough to support me - always. I am so sorry if I've missed your name out - I am full of cold.

You are special, special people.

OP posts:
StarlightMcKingsThree · 19/12/2013 18:57

I'm ashamed to say I can't find the reference to this but I remember reading that 1 in 5 with AS or HFA had either attempted or succeeded suicide under the age of 25.

If you were talking about 1 in 5 girls, or 1 in 5 Muslims I suspect a lot would be being done to understand and address the cause.

Suicidal thoughts are not a symptom of ASD but a symptom of helplessness and/or mental health disorders.

Xmas2013MN2976 · 19/12/2013 19:11

Excellent post Wet. Absolutely hit the nail on the head.

The figure for young people with ASC and secondary mood disorders is very high Star, in fact more likely than not. I went to a conference were they put it at around 2/3s of children. That is diagnosable mental health conditions.

LAs don't have any provision because they think all these kids are ok in mainstream and if they 'drop out' they will argue the parents are electively home educating.

I heard today of somone whose son at 15 has just got a place at a residential special school but that even this school doesn't know if it can 'manage' him - and that is as high as the expectation goes. This child is incredibly bright but has complex ASC. Undiagnosed, he ended up out of grammar school, moved to another secondary, couldn't cope, was at home without any education provision. Now won't leave his room and even 'specialist' schools can't cope.

And that is the drive to have the kids in school. In a system which doesn't cater for them and in which there is no flexibility.

Even though we have our out of school package, I am in no doubt that the LA are itching for a return to school (any school) at some point. But why if there is nowhere for him to go? Why would they rather pay 60k a year than allow him to be educated creatively and flexibly for less than half the cost?

wetaugust · 19/12/2013 19:33

I've heard that depressing statistic too Star

I often wonder whether it's the lax discipline in schools these days that makes it so difficult for the academic Aspie. There is so much noise, bad behaviour, bullying, classroom chaos etc that goes unchecked that it becomes a very hostile environment in which the academic child cannot learn.

That was my DS's experience. My other DS called the school "a zoo" - which is probably an apt description.

Compare that with the grammar school I went to where discipline and respect were ingrained in the whole school ethos.
You did not dare be late for school, fail to do your homework, mess about in class, disobey, deviate from the school unifor, bully another child etc. You would have been OUT straightaway - we saw that happen. As a result I can honestly say there was no bullying at all and every class was totally conrolled by the teacher who we were too scared to cheek.

I look back now, with my subsequent knowledge of ASD, and I can name at least 4 girls I was at school with who were definitely quite a significant way along the spectrum - and noticeably so. They were left alone. One went to Oxford.

That's all DS wanted - to be left alone and to have an environment in which he could learn.

It doesn't seem a lot to ask - but he was denied it.

I worry about you people on this board who are dealing with crappy primary / junior schools. You wait until you see just how truly crappy the average comp is Sad. If I had known DS was an Aspie I would have home-ed'd or sent him to small private school. Sending him to our local comp (no grammar schools in our area) was like sending a lamb to slaughter.

ouryve · 19/12/2013 19:56

Wet - unfortunately, there's a lack of provision for academic children with aspergers/ASD who do have behaviour problems, too. This is just one aspect of the quandary we're in as DS1 approaches secondary.

Donki · 19/12/2013 19:56

Anybody know anything about Breckenborough?

Donki · 19/12/2013 20:03

Anybody know anything about Breckenborough?

Donki · 19/12/2013 20:03

Anybody know anything about Breckenborough?

Donki · 19/12/2013 20:06

Ooops!
Haven't got the hang of the smartphone yet Blush

ouryve · 19/12/2013 20:11

And yep, I know all too well how crappy the average local comp would be for DS1. As for the one down the road that triples the value of houses in its catchment because of its reputation, it wouldn't touch DS1 and his problems with a bargepole and I know a few people who have moved their children out of that school because of bullying which has gone unchecked.

Our village primary is not perfect and he really struggles there, but he is treated with understanding and compassion and, I can safely say, love. Other children there know him and actually like him. The ones who don't know him well enough to keep their distance and wouldn't dare goad him. That would all be gone in the local comps.

Private MS isn't an option (that pesky behaviour thing again, never mind the finances and transport). He needs to be out of MS, but not written off.

ouryve · 19/12/2013 20:13

It's fairly "local" to us, Donki. PM me.

wetaugust · 19/12/2013 20:54

Our local zoo was the 3rd best in the county Sad

Original poster
inappropriatelyemployed · 19/12/2013 21:09

Wet for my son that sort of draconian three-line whip system would be a nightmare. He would live in fear of getting something wrong.

All the schools he has been to have been very hot in discipline - I think many schools are these days, much more than they were in my day! I have spent long periods in the classroom with him so I am not just guessing that behaviour is good,

He can't stand being around other children, he can't stand constant demands from people and he has a fear of doing things wrong unintentionally and upsetting people and getting reprimanded. He needs to do things differently and he needs great pastoral care and understanding. He needs not to be laughed at or sneered at.

I don't see any of this being accommodated in a grammar. We have a grammar here and it is full of tossy haired entitled little, middle class loud mouths.

Not that I hate grammars or anything!!

OP posts:
wetaugust · 19/12/2013 21:18

Interesting IE. Your DS appears to have a sensitivity that my DS lacks. With mine, as long as you spell out the rules very clearly, he'll adhere to them, but he'll also expect others to adhere to them too. The difficulty starts for him when someone breaks the rules - he can't cope with that. We get endless questions on why did they di that?

Grammars these days are very different from my day - so probably not a good example to use except to explain just how disciplined it was. Stand up for teching entering or exiting the room etc. Single file, no running - very draconian. The last person you would approach with a problem would be the teacher - as they scared the wits out of you.

We had one bulimic girl who was allowed to opt out of sport and one girl had a breakdown in her mock O levels and retook the year. Apart from that everyone was just the sam and just got on with it.

DS would have loved it.

PolterTurkey · 19/12/2013 21:20

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

wetaugust · 19/12/2013 21:28

I'm actually surprised.

Back in the (Dark Ages) you didn't get allowances made for very sensitive children or flexibility or patience.

You got shouted at a lot so the game plan was obviously to avoid being shouted at - so you automatically behaved to avoid being shouted at.

So what happened to all those children who couldn't / wouldn't conform?

Because I only ever saw one girl respond cheekily to a teacher and she was expelled the same day.

PolterTurkey · 19/12/2013 21:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

wetaugust · 19/12/2013 21:44

Believe me - it was a lot easier to conform at my school than not to Sad. Probably accounts for why so many Aspies join the military. The place I worked at was crawling with them Grin

StarlightMcKingsThree · 19/12/2013 21:55

Just got through letterbox mis-delivered letter with minutes of Annual Review.

It's okay. Better than LA led me to believe. Outlines our concerns but still carefully weighted in favour if continued placement.

No list of accompanying docs and believe LA not received our parental report.

Less upset with school but still want him out ASAP.

MariaNearlyChristmas · 19/12/2013 22:07

Any idea when the 'real AR' date will be?

wetaugust · 19/12/2013 22:08

'out'? Star?

Out to what sort of provision?

StarlightMcKingsThree · 19/12/2013 22:10

What do you mean Maria?

wet out to HE pending placement.

MariaNearlyChristmas · 19/12/2013 22:20

AR meeting isn't 'the AR' for tribunal purposes. It's just advice prior to case officer sitting at her desk and thinking what to write. Which can be ages after, but somehow, is 'the AR' proper Confused

MariaNearlyChristmas · 19/12/2013 22:23

School will always be fairly happy with what they offer to miniStar. They're used to doing 'focus on the positives' for a dc, and the approach is bound to influence their self-assessments.

MariaNearlyChristmas · 19/12/2013 22:24

Plus they're SLT-focussed and he has lots it nice SLT issues for them to feel empowered about helping

ouryve · 19/12/2013 22:29

DS1's another one who wouldn't cope with disciplinarian teachers. He had one of those and it completely broke him.

Wet - where did the children who were expelled go?

In the 80s, I used to play in a county band. We did a lot of school summer fetes. One regular slot was at a "correctional school" which was pretty much like the most grim example of a PRU you can imagine. It was a last resort and children didn't tend to move on. Not to a mainstream school, anyway. I strongly suspect that, in the 80s, DS1 would have been a few upset chairs and gobs of spit short of ending up somewhere like that. My brother managed to stay in MS, in between the fixed term exclusions, but left functionally illiterate.