Mumsnet/KIDS support session on challenging behaviour: Thursday September 20, 9pm

[RowanMumsnet]

Hello there,

We're pleased to announce that the third support session with members of KIDS staff will be held on Thursday September 20 between 9pm amd 10pm (in the hope that this will avoid most kids' bed-times!). The topic will be challenging behaviour. (You can see the first session here and the second session here.)

KIDS is a national charity working with disabled children, young people and their families across England. The KIDS representative at this session will be Kim Steele (KIDS Development Coordinator for the south-east).

The idea of these support sessions is to complement the advice and support that Special Needs posters already give each other with the insight and experience of people working for an organisation in the field. We hope that the session will pull together perspectives and advice from MNers and from KIDS staff, and that the thread will serve as a reference point for posters looking for advice about behaviour.

It would be great to have as many of you as possible join us 'live' on Thursday evening, but if you can't make it, please also post up any advance questions for here.

We'd really appreciate your feedback on these sessions, so if you can find the time to fill in a survey after the session, that would be great - it's open to lurkers as well as posters - to everyone who has seen the thread.

Thanks,
MNHQ

So what happens when the SENCO and Parent Partnership exhibit far more challenging behaviour than your child?

Okay. Thank you. So how do you identify the triggers before meltdown mode?

So Kim what do you do when you have a child who is extremely challenging and his life is limited and none of what you say in your last post works?

bochead - in our practice 95% is de-escalation and 5% is restraint - this is only ever used if there are no other options. We are team teach tutors and we teach our staff this apporach and evry memeber of staff have to evidence that they have tried all de-escation starategies before restarint is ever used, they are trained in restaint as a last resort. Parents are able to attend team teach, we are only able to teach employees but we are aware that team teach is delivered to aparents by principal team teach tutors. There is a cost to this. Team teach is used in a lot of our special schools in our area.

Hi Kim, How about a child with HFA who is completely unable to function in a school setting of any kind, both mainstream or special, yet displays virtually no negative behaviours at home? His anxieties are so high in the school settings that he cannot be managed without daily meltdowns, aggression and restraint. No therapies or tools that usually work for autistic children work for him. He is out of school at present as he was coming home with abrasions and bruises all over him from being restrained. The things I do at home do not work at school. Nothing works at school . I believe his negative associations to a school setting are now so high they will never be able to change. He is so intelligent and I think he is not reaching his full potential but I don't know what to do next. We feel paralysed. Any thoughts?

Kim, replacing meals with snacks would probably work from a calorie point of view, but praise as a reinforcer just doesn't work well since ds has asd and various other bits. He finds snacks very reinforcing in themselves so I'm scared we'll struggle then to ever move back to meals (with the consequent carnage for family life and eating patterns / cooking / washing up etc).

Ooh, another question. How you you KNOW that 95% is de-escalation? Do you keep data? Is this relating to time spent on a behaviour or something else?

starlightmckenzie - I may suggest in this sceniario I would approach the head teacher or the local authority. You do have a right to see the behaviour support policy within the school and any child care setting.

Maria, does he like anything like marble run?

How about a piece of marble rum for each bite, with a 'good' piece for every 10th bite?

life limited in more ways than one, medically and socially.

devientenigima - you may have alraedy tried this but have you contacted social services for additional support because it sounds you need specific targeted support from them. You have a right to ask for an assessment and they are there to support you.

he has a social worker and a package in place such as respite but he can't leave the house or car.

should add he refuses to go to special school and has a tutor provided by the LA. He is violent and aggressive and has hit many without warning or remorse including doctors, teachers, nurses etc

he is 2:1 care as well as 24/7 supervision and apart from a few hours per week the rest of the time I am on my own, it's so lonely and isolating and even more so due to his needs and behaviours

Local Authoriy, are you kidding? I'm aware that you know Herts pretty well and therefore MUST know that they are worse than terrible. We escaped. DS is in an excellent provision well away from them in a school that invite parents to make suggestions to the behaviour plans for the children. DS is now exceeding by far the expectations set by the woefully inadequate providers in that Authority, mostly due to a true partnership of the school and parents.

Interesting support thread. Lots of questions and about the credentials and intellectual discussion of approaches but half the questions from those who are struggling not answered so far. Professor, beautifulgirls and pipinjo might like an answer...

akaemmafrost - it sounds like you and your son are having a very hard time, I am going to be honest it is hard to give advice because we dont know the full situation and we would not want to misguide on such a complex situation. I would suggest trying to get the key worker to come out to your home so that they can try and build a positive relationship before they try and introduce school again. This can be fundemantal for transition back to school.

It's interesting that you assume I'm talking about a boy!

I wasn't thinking about my own dc's with regards to my questions about schools and behaviour - rather the issue of how behaviour is dealt with in mainstream schools generically.

Mariamma - ok appreciate that - maybe try and have a now and next this could be in ppicture form or PECS or objects of reference- now is dinner and next is an activity he really enjoys if he finishes his meal. This can be done in small steps he may sit at the table for a couple of minutes and eat a little and next time he sits for a bit longer. Positive reinformenst is importatnt and reward with something he enjoys.

latedeveloper - thank you and appologies we missed the first few questions our system took a while to catch up

beautifulgirls - it sounds like your young person has limited concentration span and the school should be working with her to support this, so may be not staying on the same activity for too long and keeping it short and managable for your young perosn, moving on and then progressing using positive reward for concentration.

My DD goes to Special School and accesses KIDS after school. I'm very grateful for the service. The only thing I find difficult is that so often the children seem to be able to do whatever they like, and therefore behaviour at home can be more challenging than it should be, because Mummy has to be the big bad one who says no sometimes.

How do you positively deny a child something they want?

professorpoopsnagle - If I am honest it is hard to advise because we do not knwo your young person as an invidual however you could do a simple social story to reinforce cause and effect, sit with your young person and show him faces of differnt emotions and going through what they mean, 'what makes you happy' when you are happy what do you look like?' what makes you sad' and explaining to himthat when you hit and kick xxxxx is sad because you have hurt him. having visual pictures can help support this. Also may be looking back at the last few months and seeing if there have been any events or changes that could of induced this behaviour.