DS under the table - how can I help?

[appropriatelyemployed]

DS is at a new school. He's been doing really well but the pace of integration has started increasing and he's been in the classroom more and more.

Schools do seem to measure their effectiveness by this so I have to tread carefully so as not to look like I am suggesting that this is not a good thing. However, DS seems to be having quite a strong reaction to it.

I was in school yesterday to meet the new S&LT and he ended up under the table he uses with his LSA. In fact, the LSA (who is an experienced teacher) actually came to get me to get him out.

When I picked him up at the end of the school day, the same thing had happened. The LSA thought he was being a bit silly. She asked me to speak to him about it.

This is not an easy thing as he doesn't want to talk about anything that upsets him. He tells me that this has happened before.

Anyway, because the LSA had asked me and because DS was saying he was going to go back under the table today, I have had a talk with him this morning and stayed in school for about an hour. He says he is being asked to do too many 'jobs' and he is finding the whole classroom routines etc tough. Unfortunately, every time his LSA said ' well you wanted to go into the classroom yesterday', he says 'you made me'. It feels like basic Aspie non-compliance and struggling with someone else's routine but also that he finds the classroom tough.

He just won't say these things at the time and so I do get dragged in.

School are very good but it is a difficult line to walk between helping him and accomodating problems and facilitating non-compliance. He does have to do things he doesn't like at school.

How do you cope with this? I did a sticker chart for him and offered him 'ticks for toys' and said I would come back a little earlier at the end of the day to see how he is getting on.

The services we have supporting him are USELESS - rubbish beyond belief. Ed Psych came in and did not even give any guidance. SLT didn't even seem interested in this sort of stuff. Who would think could help on this and set up proper support? I would pay.

did the LSA tell your DS she thought he was being silly?

i know very little about ASD, but even i know that confronting refusal with an argument is going to get her nowhere!

how long has he been in this new school?

I would look at behavioural management people.

it sounds as though your ds is doing well, but is getting overwhelmed. and then once he is overwhelmed, he finds it hard to articulate what he wants, the TA/teacher/others in school are still measuring him by his 'best' (which no one can maintain all the time) and since his behaviour is falling far short of that, branding him 'silly' and 'capable of more' wihtout actually addressing the issue (ie modifying their responses to his behaviour, or trying to help him work through his behaviour)

a behavioural management consultant would come in, look at the triggers, and work out ways your ds can deal with those triggers (and ways the staff can support him to deal with the resulting behaviours).

it might be worth investigating.

Thanks. His TA is very good and wouldn't say this to his face and she is very calm and patient with him.

Yesterday, the trigger seemed to be being asked to wash his hands when he didn't want to.

I know he doesn't like to do things he doesn't want to do but I know he also gets overwhelmed.

He cried when I left him this morning. I think he does feel it is difficult to make himself understood although he would be the first to say this school is much better and they clearly want to help.

Silverfrog - who would you suggest in terms of behavioural management?

Perhaps he could have regular breaks?

Thanks - he does have break cards and is allowed to take them when he wishes.

Does he use them?

Hereiam - well apparently he only used 2 out of 4 yesterday according to his LSA yet DS had been saying he needed more breaks. So that is an interesting point - maybe it's his way of accessing a break?

Leningrad - he's 9.

Ds has been given a variety of cards over the years, none of which have been very successful. He either doesnt understand how or when he should be using them or does not want to hold up a card in front of the whole class.

I would say that hiding under the table is a massive clue for his LSA, far greater than a showing a card, that he needs a break!

For example ds has had an 'overwhelmed' card which he was to hold up, which would signify that he needed a break, the only problem was that ds did not recognise when he was feeling overwhelmed and would resort to usual running away and hiding!

Perhaps his LSA could demonstrate to him that hiding under the table is a time when he should be using his card.

One of the problems yesterday was that he got upset when his LSA said that the under the table bit would count as a break as he didn't want hiding under the table to be a break. He's a complex boy.

That makes no sense! he was punished for needing a break, no wonder he is confused about when to use them or what counts as a break.

Why on earth didnt she tell/show him that now while under the table would be a good time to show his card?

that's not 'complex' to me, that's common sense - he needed a break so showed in his best way, that he did. she should have helped him access his time out, surely?

But she did and she said let's have a break but he wanted to stay under the table and for it not to be a break!

Where does he take his break? Hopefully its away from the classroom, otherwise its pointless.

He plays with lego usually at his table outside the classroom.

maybe he needed more time?

i don't know, i can't say (not being there and all) but it does sound like he was having a tough day and he needed to retreat.

i know with DD, going over a 'bad day' until she is ready has no effect at all, she has to have at least 24hrs gap to get over it, then she's ready to talk

Well there seems to be some confusion, to your ds anyway as to when to use the cards, as he has said to you that he needs more breaks, but only used 2 out of 4 cards.

Have to go out now, will give this some more thought and let you know if i can think of anything

Thanks guys - much appreciated!! I think you are right about leaving a gap before discussing it and also about there being some confusion about breaks.

Given it a bit of thought, well as much as i can by trying to relate it to my own ds, as unchartered says its hard to know without actually being there or knowing your ds, but here goes!

With my ds, as i said he found it really difficult to recognise when he was feeling overwhelmed, in some situations he knew and would use the card, in others he didnt. Maybe your ds is having the same difficult ie being able to apply his knowledge (of using the card) to a different situation?

For example ds learned to use his card in the classroom, but could not transfer this knowledge to the playground where he had most of his difficulties with feeling overwhelmed, if that makes sense? Feeling overwhelmed, is well overwhelming! and logic goes out of the window. Then if you add to that the different degrees of being overwhelmed, when ds felt the most overwhelmed, was the time he was least likely to use his card.

So if you ds is saying he needs more breaks and is not using the cards he has, perhaps the use of the cards requires more work. Maybe your ds needs more help with recognising the feelings associated with being overwhelmed.

Hope my waffle makes some sense!

Yes, that makes a great deal of sense. Thank you for that. I appreciate it and will talk it over (or write it down) with DS - if he'll let me!

Also just had another thought, is your ds required to give any explanation when he uses the card or is it just a case of his shows his card and is given a break? When we took away the need to explain anything, this helped too, as ds had great difficulty explaining why he was feeling overwhelmed.

Apart from avoiding things he doesn't like is there any other reason why sitting under the table is a problem?

If not, perhaps he can have 'sitting under the table' cards which he can either earn for 10/20 whatever mins of work, or he can start off with a number if them, but any left over at the end of the day can be exchanged with you for computer time/trampoline time/money even, whatever makes it worth it for him?

Great ideas - off to get him now. Will talk it over at school.

Thank you so much

Of all the things he coukd be doing, sitting under the table must be the most rewarding/motivating for him. Unless it is a problem for anything other than people's sense of weirdness, then allow him to do it, just not for free!