Behavior Balance has arrived!!!!

[HolyCalamityJane]

Hi All,

On some of your kind recommendations I ordered some behavior balance for DD aged 5 which arrived today by courier (very exciting!!!!) So just after a little advice really will the 1 spoonful be enough to begin with or should I start with 2 and move down to 1. How quickly should I expect to see a difference in behaviour. Is it better to give in the morning before school. Unfortunately there were no guidelines with it so any info or advice that you have is greatly appreciated. Thanks

OMG have just tried it it is foul that is going to be a tough sell

This is on the website:

Directions for use
Under 6 years: 1/2 tablespoon
6-12 years: 1/2 tablespoon, twice daily
Over 12 years: 1/2 tablespoon, 3 to 4 times daily

I wouldn't double the dose at the beginning - I think you only do that for Omega. Plus this already contains a lot of B6.

Did you manage to get him to take some?

I mix ds' into a smoothie to disguise the taste, innocent pineapple and mango works best, it seems to be a good strong flavour to overcome the yuckiness. I often have to offer something nice afterwards like a chunk of nakd bar or similar as a reward. I give his with breakfast as its usually advised to take most supplements with food to improve absorption.
Some people say there is an adverse reaction at first (although not in our case) so I would start with a smaller dose. Also, smaller doses will be easier to disguise in the smoothie and then you can build up gradually hopefully without her noticing.
For us we started to see a difference very quickly, within just a few days of taking the full dose, but the effects also built up over a period of weeks if not months. We would never be without it now!

Hi yes managed to get some into DD snuck it into a glass of Ribena whilst she wasn't looking didn't seem to notice so that's good am having more trouble getting the Omega 3 into her it has a strawberry flavour had been putting it into her juice but it sits on top like an oil slick think I will need to sneak it into a petit filous.

That's really encouraging Pop did you find that it made your DS calmer and did it improve his social interactions? I am recording everything in a diary have given DD's diet a complete overhaul so am hoping to see some improvements. She started her new school 2 days ago and has been impecably behaved so far so am feeling positive (it must be all down to my delicious salmon fish pie )

How much is it and where do you get it from please? X

Behaviour Balance

We are now a week in with the super healthy food, Omega supplements and 2 days on behaviour balance and already have seen amazing difference in DD's verbal skills. It is truly amazing. Thanks to everyone on Mumsnet for all the advice about this.

Thanks indigo

So glad you're seeing results already. We started the behav bal in July and within a few days noticed he was more relaxed, more compliant, his sleep improved and my mum noticed he started to actually reply to her and make eye contact when she spoke to him (he wouldn't acknowledge before). 6 months on and he talks to her willingly and will even sit on her knee and give granny a cuddle now not to mention continued progress in social skills and emotional regulation. It is a long way from a complete solution but there has been such an improvement we can hardly believe it.

By the way, have you made sure Your omega 3 has high levels of EPA? I've been giving my two omega 3 for about 2 yrs and only just realised that the brand I was using had only dha no EPA at all so was basically useless!

can you take omega alongside behaviour balance?

CS - Yes, you need to take omega as well as behaviour balance.

Preferably Vegepa as it's the only one with the right amount of EPA and no DHA.

The latest studies seem to be suggesting that DHA reduces the effeciency of EPA......

thanks have ordered that

Was going to start a thread, but will post on this one instead. Sorry - will be long.

I am trying to do a complete overhaul of Ds2's supplements and need advice about fish oils. In the fridge I have the following:
Bodybio Balance oil (blend of sunflower and flaxseed oil). It has an omega 6 to omega 3 ratio of 4:1.
Nordic Naturals Cod liver oil. Has an omega 6 to omega 3 ratio of 1:3
Vitamin A drops. ( I know you're not supposed to give Vit A with cod liver oil, but these were recommended by a reputable nutritionist who has a clinic for autistic children, and he said it was OK because the Vit A was in palmitate form. Have no idea if this chimes with current research - it was quite a while ago)
I also have Equazen eye-Q chews, which Ds1 (dyspraxic) takes. These have a 1:3 ratio as well.

i also have Behaviour Balance liquid. Ds2 had some very positive effects from this in the first few weeks of taking it last summer, but then his behaviour started to deteriorate badly. He became very emotional and aggressive, which is unlike him. When I removed it, his behaviour improved. Of course, this could have been because it was interacting with some of his other supplements or for one of a thousand other reasons!

So - deep breath - which of these should I give, and what dosages? Robin Pauc recommends at least 500mg daily, and probably more to start with, at a ratio of 3:1 omega 6 to 3. But am I right that Indigo's post suggests that this has been disproved by recent research and children should not supplement omega 6?

Am soooo confused. Ds2's visual stimming has returned with a vengeance and this was something that went away to a large extent when he was on fish oils.

I wonder if Robin would advise you over the phone?

I can't remember what ratio of Omega 3 / 6 you need. It's in one of his books - but I leant it to BlueShark and can't look it up :)

But the key thing is that you need EPA not DHA. I suspect bodybio is all DHA and no EPA - because I think the EPA comes from the fish. So I'd ditch this supplement.

I'm fairly sure Robin said don't take cod liver oil.

How much EPA and DHA is in Eye-Q?

The only supplement Robin recomends is Vegepa. And that is because it's the only one that contains no DHA.

So

1. You need an Omega with high levels of EPA and low or no levels of DHA.

1. You need zinc, magnesium and Vitamin B.

Behaviour balance contains zinc, magnesium and Vit B - but in quite weird ratios. I also saw an initial improvement with DS2 on BB - and then he got worse. So I stopped it.

If you don't want to use BB, Robin recommends Saludynam and Kindervital. Mainly I think because they don't contain any artificial sugar.

I found those taste foul, so went with our regular tesco brand multivitmain and Osteocare

The amount of zinc and magnesium in Osteocare actually seem the best.

I also found this very interesting article:

KPU is a condition which is being found in about 98% of Autistic children. The child loses through the urine very large amounts of Zinc, Vit C, Silica, B6, Biotin and Manganese.

That is fascinating Indigo. Ds2 wees a HUGE amount - during day and at night ( still wets bed) so I wonder if he's losing even more?

I have always thought that EPA was omega 3 and DHA omega 6. So armed with new knowledge ( for which I thank you) I've had another look at my supplements.

The Cod Liver has more DHA than EPA and obviously no 6s at all. The Bodybio doesnt say, but I'm sure you're right about it having no EPA because it doesnt contain fish oil. The Eye Q has 186mg EPA and 58mg DHA in a dose, with 200mg of omega 6 as evening primrose oil. So although thats the best as far as EPA is concerned, the balance isnt right according to Pauc. Have just looked up the ratios in Brain Food, which arrived today from Amazon, and he definitely says 3:1 of 6 to 3. You are right that he doesnt recommend Cod liver oil - talks about Vit A building up to toxic levels in children - yikes!

It's so difficult isnt it - the nutritionist we used to see has an excellent reputation ( was recommended by someone on here), is involved in current research etc. Yet his advice is completely different!

I'm going to read the book and make a decision after that. On the Tinsley House website he says that his programme works for dyspraxia, dyslexia etc, (Ds1) but hasnt been shown to have such an effect on severe autism (Ds2) - something to do with spindle cells?? So will definitely implement with Ds1. So much easier with him as he can actually TELL me what makes a difference. Sigh....

That is a strange coincidence - I know the writer of that article! She runs the equine therapy stables we take the boys to.

Sphil - yes TH is not for kids with Severe Autism.

However, if your child developed normally till 4 months, then it might help.

Certainly can't sing his praises highly enough. Had a huge breakthrough with DD yesterday (according to her teacher). Will start a new thread about it once I've spoken to her about it. :)

And it has certainly helped DS1 who has mild ASD.

See, given that the professionals say such different things I reckon the best course of action is to follow the advice of those, like you, who've actually seen results with their own children. The whole biomed area is so fraught with uncertainty and lack of consistency this seems the only way to proceed.

Ds2 did develop normally as a baby and although he has huge learning difficulties compared to Ds1 they had many similarities when very young. Unfortunately Ds2 has had more 'triggers' - early severe infection, antibiotics and steroids - as well as inheriting Dh's allergic profile, which Ds1 has missed, and imo this is why he's more severely affected. The Pauc book ( have only read intro and skimmed) makes so much sense where DS1 is concerned - his diagnosis is dyspraxia, but he has some elements of dyslexia and mild ASD traits too. Am very excited about trying the programme with him - and the diet will be easy as he already eats pretty healthily and is very interested in food/ prepared to try new things. Unlike Ds2! His diet is almost exactly the same as the one Pauc says to 'avoid at all costs'

Just marking my place, supplements are on my list of things after we move.

Bda - my youngest 2 swallow the vegepa.

It comes in a 'chewable' - but it's not to my taste :)

For DS1 we cut open the chewable capsule and mix it in with his other multivitamin :)

Does the chewable taste very fishy Indigo?