School problems (already) advice please

[Jimjams]

Have some fairly trivial school problems I've just been made aware of.

1. The teacher is inisiting ds1 sits on for the whole literacy and numeracy hour (please tell me there aren't two of these a day- is it one hour of the day?) which is all well and good, but he's not going to understand a word of it. The govt apparently says he has to "have access to the entire curriculum"- well yes but if his language skills are below that of his 21 month old baby brothers then sitting in a room of other children doing literacy and numeracy is not the same as having access to the curriculum.

2. there is a handdryer in the toilets which he is terrified of. He has now wet his pants twice becuase of this (and it also means he won't go in public toilets if he sees a handdryer). It was suggested (by his nursery manager) that as he is going to the toilet seperately the handdyrer is switched off at the wall when he is in there so it can't go off accidentally- but no go- the teacher won't have it.
3. I haven't got a home-school link book. I need something as I have no idea what goes on in there (obviously ds1 can't tell me).
4. Other minor stupid things like he'd just learned his LSA's christian name but has now been told he has to call her Mrs X. He can't say anything remotely like Mrs X. it doesn;t really matter because he only ever said it when he was saying goodbye anyway but I think its kind of sad he now can't say anything. I don't really mind about this but I think it just demostrates they don't really understand how far behind he is.

Now I think the literacy and numeracy hour would be a good time for him to do his one-to-one work with the LSA- surely there's a way that can include literacy anf numeracy.

None of this is major as he only attends 5 hours a week at the moment. Just wondering how best to go about addressing concerns. I don't want to go in like a bull in a china shop within a couple of weeks of him arriving. I think the very good autism outreach worker is in tomorrow and I'm hoping she'll sort out something about the hand dryer (whether its a phased introduction/desensitisation to it or turning it off) and also the literacy/numeracy hour.

I think overall I'm just worried as I think the school are expecting too much. They are expecting him to be able to behave like a normal kid, when he can't. Of course its all early days- did anyone else have these sorts of problems initially and how did you go about sorting them out?

Brilliant news about the hand-dryer! I don't know if this would be of any interest to your ds (I know you said mouse control was a problem), but we've got a CD-Rom of Green Eggs and Ham that my ds used to love when he was your ds1's age. You'd be welcome to it if you think your ds would like it, just let me know. It's got the story on it and a few related games.

Davros, that's a fantastic quote, I'm going to pin it to my wall!

no time to read this properly now, jimjams, but really hope the school is responsive to your needs. I know it's early days and they are learning about your son.

Just to say, I think it's perfectly reasonable to ask for a home school book with daily input ffrom you and the teacher. My son was one of 6 or so children in his class to have one last year. It helped so much to have that line of communication open, even if all the teacher or I wrote was an 'ok'. It also gave us both a place to mention 'issues' without having to always call for a meeting, saving everyone's time and temper.

I'll read this thread properly when I have more time.

no time to read this properly now, jimjams, but really hope the school is responsive to your needs. I know it's early days and they are learning about your son.

Just to say, I think it's perfectly reasonable to ask for a home school book with daily input ffrom you and the teacher. My son was one of 6 or so children in his class to have one last year. It helped so much to have that line of communication open, even if all the teacher or I wrote was an 'ok'. It also gave us both a place to mention 'issues' without having to always call for a meeting, saving everyone's time and temper.

I'll read this thread properly when I have more time.

Good news today. I've spoken to the nursery manager today and she's had a chat with ds1's LSA and nursery key worker. They've drawn up a list of the things that are working really well (eg he's coming out happy!) and also problems with the litercay/numeracy hour etc. They're going to discuss this with the autism outreach worker tomorrow (hooray so I don't have to get involved yet). I'm also sending in Davros's ABA book and a folder - at the moment it just has the "copy me" stuff in with a request to introduce relevant activities into his one to one time (at the moment just copy me). His LSA seems very good so that's great.

The bst thing has been the school agreeing to start him on just 5 hours a week- means the nursery can be involved in the transition and I don;t have to be the one saying "um you're doing that wrong" iyswim.

The nursery manager feels that the biggest problem is that the school have had AS kids before and they are exepecting ds1 to be like that when he's not really (I get the impression he's a lot more compliant than the AS kids they've had , but has a lot less understanding). Need to ensure the handryer issue is finally sorted as he's started refusing to use the toilet at home.

Well he was awake from 2am until after 5 am last night bloody noisy as well (with ds2 awake before 6am), so we're off to the park as I have no energy for structured activities today (and neither does he).

Cautious optimism all round then, jimjams? It sounds as if most of the people concerned are wanting to discuss the best way to go about handling DS's time at school. The nursery manager sounds like a great one to have on your side. Good that he's coming out happy!

Sorry about him refusing to use the toilet at home though - is he using a potty instead? And what does he actually do when he's awake for hours at night?

good news jimjams Hope you get some shut eye tonight though

Unfortunately he outgrew (physically) the potty about 2 years ago so he's just wetting himself again. Aggghhhh

When he wakes he stays in bed, but shouts, sings, shrieks, squaks, talks nonsense, occasionally crys (although not last night). I have to keep checking because sometimes he seems to manage to wet the bed (despite wearing a nappy) and then he won't go back to sleep until changed (although he hardly ever tells me he's wet). As it reaches hour number 3 I do keep reminding myself "this is why we get higher rate DLA". Mind you I'm sure shift workers are paid more

Useless chocolate teapot of a registrar we saw yesterday managed to ignore my question about melatonin as well. Does it work in the middle of the night?

Jimjams , if you need a potty for his size they should available from social services, probably their ot department. We have been trying potties in varying forms at the Bobath Centre for ds2, they had quite a selection. Would it be worth checking out the ss?

Jimjams, pleased it seems to be working itself out but v. sorry about last night. My son used to do that, spend hours just effing around in his bedroom, not "playing"! We had a bad night too but baby daughter's got a little white point of a top tooth showing so I can't complain, she's so sweet.
I was thinking about a little data sheet you could try, maybe in a week or two once things have settled down. You could just choose 3-4 items that you either want to observe whether he can already do or to target to teach, as I already said, e.g. "hangs coat on peg" (my son's m/s school had a photo of each child by their peg), "greets teacher/peer", "something related to using the toilet", "lining up" (if relevant), "finding a/his chair/desk/place when coming to class". Maybe put P+++ for heavy prompt and then reduce the pluses for less prompts?
I may have asked this before, but I wonder if you ever considered having him in a class a year lower than his actual age? Maybe he already is? Some schools/teachers etc cannot get their heads round this idea but its quite a simple way to make things a little easier without there being huge physical differences. Not saying you would want to do it now as a change would not be a good idea as you are getting grips with things so well.

He's only in reception Davros so we can't og any lower ())I do know this school have kept children down before which is partly why I chose it. I reckon he could repeat reception of year 1 and then we could get 3 years out of mainstream before they can't cope with him in year 2 (year 2 seems to be a big one).

Good idea about the target stuff. I'll bring that up when we have the first meeting. If the outreach teacher gets very involved I guess she might do that sort of stuff anyway. Those are the sorts of things on his current IEP at nursery- so hopefully that's the sort of thing they will tranfer across to school.

EEkk the dreaded SS word Lou I try to keep away from them. I'm hoping to get him back onto familiar toilets asap as I worry a bit that if he did start using a potty he wouldn't ever accept the toilet. It would be another pattern to break. iyswim.

I know what you mean jimjams, I did have to take a big breath as I wrote it! The only interaction I had with ss was dreadful, but luckily ds's OT seems to be taking over that part soon, so hopefully I won't need to deal with the place again. I haven't properly read through the thread, sorry. Is it the use of strange toilets that are the problem as well as at night? I was wondering if you could use a portable toilet seat that fits on the toilet needing to be used?

I was going to make some comments on Soc Svs but decided it warrants a new thread but don't have time now to go into my own very little experience. May get to it tomorrow. Good thinking Jimjams about starting in the first class and maybe getting 3 years out of them.

Dinosaur, I saw those posts about Melatonin, especially theh time release one which sounds wonderful. I was so excited I was tempted to get some even though we don't need it (at the moment touch wood!).
I think it would be extremely appropriate for you to have a home-school book if not essential. You can suggest it on the basis that you will be able to tell them how he's slept etc and maybe you can then lead them to give you any information you may want by asking questions in the book. I really can't see why they would object. Let us know what happens.

I'd ask for one dinosaur. All the kids (nt as well) had home link books at nursery.

Right one for you Davros SALT wants ds1 to go back to basics with PECS whize through early phases and bring him onto higher phases where it will be really useful. I am in complete agreement. I also want LSA to start doing ABA stuff with him from that wonderful book. So all in all he's going to need a lot of reinforcing. All this work in school is done in a seperate room away from the other children. His strongest reinforcer is.... chocolate buttons (well 1/4 because we break them in 1/4s). And yes you've guessed it. School rule of no chocolate. So teacher has suggested we use stickers!!!!!!!!! Help!!!!! Where do we start when teacher obviously has no clue. Aaaaaaggggghhhh We have obviously tried a range of reinforcers. On some days raisins will do (think they're banned as well) but tbh non food items don't interest him remotely.

Going to see whether the autism outreach worker can get things headed in the right direction today. Do you think I could suggest some autism (rather than AS) training for his teacher? Anyway I'm hoping that the teacher will realise that she doesn't really know much about autism and will leave it to the outreach worker to set up and just agree to implement whatever she says.

stickers dont quite taste like chocolate though do they?

Although I've just eaten two packets and now feel sick. Sticker please.

oh bugger. School's answer is still no to chocolate buttons. bugger bugger bugger bugger. Right am going to try and contact SALT for advice. Only other reinforcer I can think of is a toy hoover but they're tyring to wean him off that.

jimjams does a sticker distract him too much? I know my dd when she has one on her top all she does is point and stroke it all day and natter on about it aswell!

Oh god, poor you jimjams. And now another barmy suggestion from moi: you know you can get printer paper that's sticky (either all over the sheets or just as labels)? Well, what if you downloaded pictures from the internet (like you don't have anything better to do with your time) and printed them out on sticky labels? That way they could be stickers of hoovers, toilets, traffic lights, and son on. Maybe if he had a scrapbook to stick them in he might like it as much as looking in catalogues, do you think?
However, chocolate buttons would be so infinitely easier. I can't imagine what the school is playing at, he's not going to be munching away in the classroom in front of all the others, is he, so what on earth is their problem

It's not as if he can tell them he's been secretly munching chocolate either - utterly ridiculous!

Would he understand trading his stickers for chocolate buttons after school? I suspect not but thought I'd suggest it anyway.

Nope he's not remotely interested in stickers. When we're starting something he needs a really strong motivator and we've only ever found that choc buttons will work. Just spoken to nursery manager- she is going to contact SENCO and call meeting between everyone (inlcuding me) and SALT. Apprently she sopke to SALT yesterday about motivators and they agreed on choccy buttons.

this isn't really going to plan. The school are meant to be learning from the nursery, not trying to do everything themselves whilst making a big cock up of it. of course its hard- because I'm hearing everything second hand so I can't kind of barge straight in with my opinion (probably a relief for the school )

Apparently his nursery key worker was almost in tears after today- me too.

Jimjams - I have only just picked up on this thread and wanted to add a voice of support. I work every morning in a mainstream primary school, as LSA to a severely (non-verbal) autistic girl who is also very bright. I first worked with her as a tutor on her ABA home programme, have known her for about three years and supported her through Reception last year. We have just started Yr1.
The school has been fantastic at allowing me to differentiate their curriculum according to the child's needs. I am a qualified teacher, so this may have helped in their acceptance of my taking a lead in planning activities for the child.
Her home programme has now folded due to lack of funding, but when it was running I was able to incorporate elements of that. The one thing we have never satisfactorily sorted out is reinforcers. The school won't allow sweets (the one sure thing, but I understand where they are coming from) and other things work one day but not the next. The parents get very frustrated at times, but because I have a non SEN background I can see how the school feel they make a lot of concessions. Sometimes the piggy in the middle role is difficult!
In reception, our main targets were language and socialisation, since the child was already up to speed academically. This year the academics have kicked in (dreaded literacy and numeracy hours) so I have to adapt things to the child's level of understanding, and have lots of filler items standing by.
The school wanted the child to repeat Reception to further the progress we had made with language and socialisation, but the parents felt she should move on with her peer group, and their wish was respected.
The other LSA's cannot understand why she is at the school - it can be very disheartening after a challenging morning, when I feel she has integrated fairly well, to hear people say "Well, the child might as well not be here". As far as I'm concerned, the jury's still out on that one...
Please let me know if any specific parts of my experience might be helpful to you.
Not turning the hand-dryer off is pathetic

jimjams - really sorry to hear that you're having such a hard time. I always read your posts and don't feel remotely qualified to give you any advice on DS1 but I feel your frustration and it makes me annoyed just reading how bl*y unhelpful the school are being. I fell frustrated and angry for you.