Parenting ASD children...

[IndigoBell]

Hi Guys,

I'd like your advice and experience about parenting ASD children.

I strongly disagree with the reward / punishment philoshophy of parenting NT kids. I think punishing bad behaviour only teaches them

1. Don't get caught
2. Mum only loves me if I'm good.

(Ideas courtesy of unconditional parenting)

I also strongly believe in treating all of my children like people who deserve respect, rather than like children who should do whatever I say because I say it.

I even more strongly don't believe in punishing my ASD sons because all it seems to do is cause melt downs - and I'm not convinced it teaches them anything.

So my alternative is to just explain to them what they've done is wrong - without any punishment or consequences.

However with ASD children explaining doesn't have much effect on their behaviour.

But if neither explaining nor punishing works - I'd rather just stick to explaining.

What strategies have you guys had the most success with?

(I'm talking 'normal' bad behaviour like fighting with siblings, swearing, not sharing, addicted to PC, refusing to go out etc.)

Do Social Stories Work?

(BTW I know nothing really works. I'm just trying to gain more ideas by discussing things with you helpful ladies....)

hmm, well, my style won't work for you.

I use ABA with dd1, and it is all reward based.

as you say, explaining doesn't always work (actually, explaining rarely works with dd1 in the middle of a situation), and somethig needs to be done.

I'm not sure that I would have been an uncoditional parenting type even without autism, but given the way dd1 works, then it is certainly out of the window.

dd1 is at an ABA school, and we have reorganised our lives around it.

it works for her. obviously not 100%, but then I am not aiming to have a perfectly behaved robot

I can't help either, I don't parent that way.
What we do works very well for us; warnings sanctions, rewards with a good understanding of what is AS and what is choice.
My AS DS is 15, my NT DD is 19.
Hope you find someone on your wavelength.

My son doesn't have the language for explanations. He now responds appallingly to aba table work (extreme challenging behaviours which spill out of the session) so we don't do that anymore.

Having an understanding of reinforcement has been very helpful. He loves being told off in a short, snappy way - finds it hilarious and will repeat the behaviour to get told off again. So I have to be very aware how I present 'no'.

Whatever you use I would recemmend getting a really good understanding of reinforcement so you can understand the behaviours the effect your response has.

Have you looked into Floortime? You might like the Floortime approach.

Oh 'don't shoot the dog' is a great book about reinforcement.

The challenging child is a flootime approach to behaviours in NT kids. You may find it helpful - or anything else by Stanley Greenspan. Google dir floortime.

Ds is never punished because he can never see the link between him doing something wrong and my removing one of his possessions (put like that neither can I )
His limited understanding means explanations are like peeing in the wind so don't bother with those either.
What has worked for us is to teach an alternative acceptable behaviour and encourage and reward him for choosing the alternative.
So for example when ds used to enjoy throwing any moveable object at me I put velcro targets on the wall, basket ball hoops and baskets and beanbags around the house.Then I had a switch recording of me being hit by something he'd thrown (he loved the OW)
To get the OW he needed to throw at the target or in the hoop or basket. If he threw at me he got no reaction.It took a while but he got it and would put down a toy to get a beanbag to throw at the target.
Being creative has meant that the extreme challenging behaviours he had at dx have all but disappeared now.

Creative asdx2 - I like it.

Sometimes roping in other people can help. I had great difficulty going out as ds1 would run off or twist and struggle to get away with me. We constantly got stuck unable to move.

I paid 2 people (one ds1 didn't know, 1 he did) and we pounded the pavements. Ds1 next to me, the other 2 in front. Every time ds1 tried to march ahead I said 'walk at my speed' and my 2 helpers sort of herded him back to me. We did the same for 'stop'. And now - in open spaces with no compulsive objects- he's pretty good. I can take him up to the moors alone now which I just couldn't do before. He obeys 'stop' 99% of the time now so if I have help he can scooter with his brothers.

We try not to do rewards and punishments.

Just pointing out what has just happened without apportioning blame can help some children learn social norms "Daisy is crying because she lost her toy" [which you grabbed]. "I have to help cheer Daisy up". And then leave child to consider whether it was a good idea to grab the toy or not as one goes off with Daisy to find more toys and cuddles and bandages and whatever else is needed.

We do a lot of structural discipline. Rather than fighting the losing battle of saying 8 million times "don't climb on the kitchen cupboards. You are too big now, it isn't safe", we firmly stuck holly sprigs to the edges of the cupboards. It's a non-verbal guarantee that the above-my-head cupboards won't come crashing down with surfing children on top. We also made other places available for climbing (there's an ancient, solidly built, built in wardrobe that is now a jungle gym). We really do a lot a lot a lot of structural discipline.

we try to keep life as unhurried as possible. A lot of discipline issues melt away for us if we can spend ten extra minutes somewhere. This is where I often fail miserably am a perfect zen mother.

This is why it's important to remember that if you've got a child on the spectrum, that your experience is unique.
Explaining reasons why does work well with my son, as does getting a couple of warnings before acting on them. The sanction has to be something that matters to him personally to be effective.
However, he has no learning difficulties or comorbids other than those linking directly to his Asperger's. So I wouldn't say to another parent that they were wrong to say
'However with ASD children explaining doesn't have much effect on their behaviour'
With some children it doesn't. With some it does.
Asdx2, that's excellent problem-solving

Punishing bad behavior does work. It works as a deterrent to future bad behavior. This is the point of trying to modify a child's behavior in any way. At some point, you have to enforce what you want.

I generally take things away that Ds1 really likes. I take away his computer time, or his Wii time.

This does work to modify his behavior and he does not feel unloved because I said no to him playing on the computer.

It does work as a deterrent to bad behavior, as I can threaten him with removal of computer time and he will start to comply.

Glad to know that I'm not alone!

And Ds1 also has no learning difficulties with his ASD, although he does have ADHD as a comorbidity.

TBH the ADHD is why I am extremely firm, and it's why explaining sometimes just doesn't work because by the time I have said 6 words, he has interrupted me with unrelated questions about the light switches.

Ds1 is very clever, and has started saying "And what will be my reward?"

And I answer him with "Your reward for taking the bins out is that we won't have a smelly kitchen" or "Your reward for not hitting your brother will be that I won't take away your computer time" or "your reward for brushing your teeth will be that you have some teeth left because they won't rot in your skull"

We're very much like Colditz with DS1 (also ASD and ADHD and very challenging.) We try to make punishments logical. messing about in the bathroom when it's time to get ready for a bath means he gets a quick, unpleasant (to him) shower, rather than a nice relaxing bath. Bad behaviour after bathtime means he runs the risk of losing out on his bedtime story. His antipathy to DS2 has been quite strong lately and if he's cruel to DS2, he has a sock taken off him. It doesn't seem logical, but he hates being without socks and is even more distressed by losing just one. He doesn't care that slapping or pushing DS2 might hurt him but does care very strongly about being left with a bare foot. Warning him that he's in danger of losing a sock is usually enough to get him to back off when he's facing off with DS2.

DS2 (4, ASD and non-verbal) needs a whole different approach. He's not nearly so difficult, but he has his moments. The other day, he decided it was funny to come and slap me across the face and knock my glasses off. Of course, he loved the reaction of the first time, so every time he tried it afterwards, I said "no, that hurts" firmly, turned him to face away from me and held his hands. I made a point not to give him any eye contact after the initial "no." It was effective with DS1 at the same age and younger and (fingers crossed) DS2 hasn't slapped me, today.

I used to fine mine 10p an item of clothing left strewn around the house. 20p an item if it was removed and then thrown at someone else.

There is very little ds1 cares about - nothing material really which is why we have problems with reinforcement. At the moment he is desperate to stay the night at my mum and dad's but I can't really take that away as it's too distant.

It'd ok starlight he still requires a hand on him at all times near roads and is loopy near lamp posts/ doorbells/ letterboxes etc. Mobility safe for a while (it's been awarded indefinitely thank god anyway).

saintlydame we pounded the pavements. Ds1 next to me, the other 2 in front. Every time ds1 tried to march ahead I said 'walk at my speed' and my 2 helpers sort of herded him back to me. We did the same for 'stop'.

I did the same to get him to stay with me and to come back when called. He's very reliable nowadays in fact his anxiety means that he sticks to me like glue. Ds was a lamp post worshipper but he can admire them from afar now rather than hugging and licking them.