Baby's who don't sleep well - do they grow out of it or do you have to use controlled crying or similar?

[Magscat]

DD is 7 months and has never slept through - she did 2 nights of just waking 10.30pm & 6am once but that's the closest she's been and that was 2 months ago. Then she got a cold and was really hopeless for a while - every 2 hours.

She is mostly breast fed but now on 3 meals a day (and ocassionally a bottle of formula instead of ebm if I've not been able to express enough).

She goes down well at about 6.30pm but she's usually exhausted as she doesn't sleep much in the day so she only feeds for about 15 mins. She then will wake once in the early evening then typically again at 10pm and sometimes 1am, 5am or like last night 10pm, 12.30, 3am, 6am.

Am thinking of doing cc but not sure I really believe it will work so probably won't have the resolve to carry it through.

Do they ever grow out of it ?? Any ideas ??

PS - I have an older child but he was an angel from about 7 weeks!

My ds did grow out of it without controlled crying. DH and I did every other night away from the crying and waking on a matress in the sunroom so at least we would get a proper sleep every other night. And it could have been coincidence - but that's when his sleep got better and a week later we were back in the same room for good.

I don't think there's anywhere I could go and not hear her if she cried - maybe the kitchen, but don't fancy sleeping there!

Perhaps I need to send dp in with a bottle and that would be enough. At the moment it gets me down because I'm b/f so I'm doing all the night time waking - feeding her every time - & working full time as well.

Thats alot of waking when you work full time. Perhaps try and not feed her every time... the 10pm is a popular evening feed and the other round 5am or whenever she wakes up. She will protest at first because she expects to be feed but perhaps you could stay close by to reassure her by touch and voice she might start to get the message.

I think sending your dh in with a bottle might be worth trying as she will be expects bf from you.

They do grow out of it. Mine did not sleep through without bf till 15 months. She was on one a night from 1 year old.

I'm sure I;ve made it worse by feeding every time but the problem is with working FT, I just think to myself 'I can feed her & be back asleep in 20 mins' whereas if I don't, she won't stop crying for ages, ds might wake up, no-one will get any sleep anyway and I'll be more tired in the morning than if I just feed her.
THe tiredness means the short term answer wins out!

you could try sending your dp in with just some water in a bottle and let him settle her.
she WILL want feeding if you go in because you're her mummy and she can smell you and she knows you're where the milk comes from!
give it a go on a weekend perhaps and see how you get on!

LOL Tipex - I know what you mean about not knowing what to think about when feeding at 3am!

OK. I have a few days off soon so I think I will be talking nicely to dp and trying to resolve to at least not feed every time she wakes up.
Might even get some ear plugs cos if dp is doing the night time stuff then he'll be a zombie in the morning and we still have 4 yr old ds to entertain & he has the energy of a duracell bunny!

We take it in turns to get up in the morning so I get a lie in one day a week !

She does take a bottle but not brilliantly well so if she's tired/upset she might take a few ounces in the night but then cry & want b/f - I guess it's comfort at that point and I need to just stop doing it.

You sound abit undecided Magscat. Best to be consistent with your decision whichever you go... If you are staying with current situation. Or if you wish to reduce the feeding and wakings - how many feeds a night you are willing to do, at what times (approx) and how you respond to her. She needs her cues.

I think 2 weeks is a good time to try something new if she is still protesting after that then you know its not working!

I think what I'll try to do is give her a bottle plus any b/f she wants when she wakes between 10 & 11 & then (assuming she's fed well)if she wakes in the next few hours try to settle her without feeding. If she goes from 11pm til 5am regularly that would be a good start & then I could try pushing the 5am later.

Thanks for all your support and sympathies

My dd s 18 months and has only slept through twice, please tell me they grow out of it? Im pg and dont want to be up all night with 2.

Jess has only just started sleeping through about 3/4 times a week in the last few weeks.... shes 12.5 months. Last night she went down at 8.30pm, woke at 3am and again at 5.30am and slept til 8.15am

My ds was a poor sleeper at birth. He barely slept for the first 9 months, then started sleeping 12 hours a night but that wore off and we were back to CC. Now, at almost 3 he will sleep in his bed all night with the occasional waking up so there is hope.

Magscat you're really brave, working full time with broken sleep! My 10 mth Dd wakes up more than ever, not sure if it's because she's teething, but is fine most of the day. She's a very happy baby most of the day, but difficult to settle and wakes frequently wanting comfort bf. I think she's saving all her upsets for the night time. i often feel I'm going crazy.

I tried to do CC but couldn't go through with it. Now I'm trying holding her but not feeding her every time & letting her cry. I've studied re-evaluation counselling which says that when we're hurt we need to discharge the hurt by crying, talking, shaking etc. The world is so new and shocking to babies they need to cry a lot but as parents we want to stop them crying so feed them, give dummies etc.

If you're sure she's not genuinely hungry or has any other physical needs, could try just being with her while she cries. This is different than CC as you or your Dp stay with her while she cries, so she feels loved not abandoned.

This is the theory but can be hard to do when you're shattered! The idea is to be comfortable with her releasing her emotions.

I'm still working on this one and it's not easy but less distressing than CC. I've found if my Dd has a good cry before bed she sleeps bit better.

Another possibility-is your Dd eating enough solids in the day? i suspect mine is filling up on milk for comfort & doesn't eat enough.

It's reassuring to know others don't want to do CC- I've felt under pressure to do it when i've sought advice.

magscat is there any connection with when you went back to work and her waking- do you get to spend much time with her before bed?

Thanks again for the ideas - to answer Salvia's questions:

• No connection with going back to work - she's always been a poor sleeper & I still do the whole bedtime routine with her.

• I think she's getting enough solids - she has 3 meals a day and doesn't always finish - i.e. has as much as she seems to want

• I'm not sure that she isn't genuinely hungry - which is one of the main reasons I don't want to do cc.

E.g. last night she only fed 10 mins at 6.30pm cos she was shattered (only 2 x half hour sleeps all day). She woke at 9.15 and I drained a 5.5oz bottle of formula & had 10 mins breast as well. She then woke again at 11pm and dp spent 20 mins trying to settle her but she was getting more hysterical and really crying even when being held so I cracked & fed her - she fed for about 25 mins. She then woke for feed again at 3am for 20 mins & then woke properly at 6.45am

If she's not had the 9pm waking & had the bottle at 11pm & then only woken at 3am I would have counted that as a good night but I was stunned when she seemed really hungry at 11pm - only 2 hours after a good feed.

She's really happy in the day time though - so maybe like you say -she saves it all for nights!

Magscat, my DS was just like yours. I couldn't go through with CC so we just got on with it and took turns. I'd been giving him bottles of exp milk since he was 6wks so he was used to the bottle and I produced loads of milk so his daddy was able to help.
Two things changed his pattern (not sure which as both happened at same time) We moved him into his own room at 6 1/2mths and he also began to sleep on his tummy. He still wakes maybe once or occas twice a night but can be settled easily and we takes turns.
If you believe in CC and you can do it then I'm sure it works, but I couldn't do it so I knew it wouldn't. Good luck

magscat oh this all sounds so familiar! my ds3 is 10mths old and has a pattern very similar to your dd. He goes to sleep around 7pm but usually falls asleep on me then sometimes wakes a couple of times early evening sometimes has a block of 3hours. I usually b/f him again at 10pm-ish and then he can wake up every two hours. I like you have often found it easier just to pop him on the boob and get back to sleep within 15 mins. I did try not to give him any last night and he cried on and off for two hours until I gave in. I'm sorry I can't give you any ideas but sometimes it's just nice to know your not the only person in the world who's baby doesn't sleep through

Homemamma - she's already in her own room and can turn onto her tummy to sleep if she wants - it hasn't made much difference unfortunately.

Riebee - thanks for the symapthy. It's hard work isn't it?

Tipex - she's with dp half the week and nursery half the week. She has b/f before I go to work then 2 x 5oz bottles in the day. She was having 6 or 7 but cut back loads when she got a cold and is only just now getting back to draining the 5oz. I'm going to send her with 6oz bottles to nursery tomorrow & see if she drinks them.

Tonight I gave her a bottle with a fast flow teat. The plan was to try and get as much down her at 6.30pm before she fell asleep. She drank 5.5oz then was wide awake & would not 'switch off' (although she was tired) until I breast fed her for 10 mins. I tried 3 times to put her down awake and she cried each time and got into the crawling position and I ended up b/f till she was almost asleep.

She just seems really attached to b/f which part of me is pleased about because I believe in the health benefits but I'm desperate to work out what on earth to do to get her to go longer at night without needing me to b/f back to sleep.

My DS didn't sleep through untill he was about 3 yrs old ( I kid you not) . Like you I worked FT and took the route that was likely to give me the most sleep. Exhaustion always wins out.

You can imagine my delight when my DD slept through at 6 weeks old only to find that at about 4mths old started to wake every couple of hours. You guessed it I BF her to sleep and now at 6mths old we are trying the Pick Up Put down method. Have been for a week and it seems to be having an effect (touch wood).

The idea is that you pick up the crying child and as soon as they stop you put them back down in the cot. My DP is doing all of this as we think it cruel for her to smell my milk. SHe is at the stage where DP can get her back to sleep pretty quickly but she is still waking up about 4/5 times. The first night it took 90 mins to get her to sleep.

Like your child my dd sleeps very little during the day and I think herin lies the key to getting them to sleep at night. There has been a couple of threads on this recently where a Dad said that this PUPD method worked for him in three days but the hardest bit was getting the daytime naps sorted.

Thanks Eaney. What I don't understand with the PUPD method is that surely if you out them down every time they go quiet then there's no incentive for them to stop crying - they get the attention & cuddles only so long as they are upset. How does that work?

Also, we were kind of trying that last night (and again after I gave her a bottle tonight) but she wouldn't calm down when either of us cuddled her - I could cope with that but she just cried until I gave in and breast fed her.

My ds did grow out of it without CC, so there is hope!
I wouldn't have tried CC on him before he was at least a year old, I think it's a bit much to expect them to sleep through at such a young age.
I always breastfed him back to sleep, which didn't normally take more than 15 minutes or so, but I admit it was a bit annoying as I had to do it 2-3 times a night. It got better at around 7-8 months, when he learned to crawl, and he turned into a fantastic sleeper when he learned to walk (at 13 months). I stopped breastfeeding a month later, so it wasn't related to that, but I do believe the increase in physical activity was an important factor. He's now 2.1 and still sleeps 12 hours straight every night.

Thank you Homsa - THERE IS HOPE !!!!

Don't worry - I'm not making any assumptions that this is going to miraculously get better any day soon but good to know it just might!