4-5 month olds sleep club, - come and join..........

[SnowlightMcKenzie]

Hiya,

There have been so many threads lately about babies who were beginning to sleep better, but suddenly hitting this regression to newborn hell.

So I thought I would start a support thread for us all to compete whinge about how little sleep we are all getting, and tips on how to cope.

Baby Starlight was up just twice last night, but the previous night it was 6 times, and because of that I kept putting off going to bed at all last night, so even though it wasn't too bad, I still had hardly any sleep

wishing you all good sleeping for tonight - especially you Leonie. I know what you mean about crying all the time! I seem to get on with it for a couple of days, then it all builds up and I have a huge weepy fit, and then ds does a better night and I feel optimistic (before the despair sets in again!). I think Pantley is good for reminding us about what progress we have made - even if its just tiny tiny steps. For example, at the beginning of January ds wouldn't sleep in his cot in the day - only sling, pushchair or lying down with me. Now he does 3 naps a day. OK, so they never last longer than 40mins, but it means I can have a sit down. Would it help to write everything down so that you can see where things might be improving? Or at least to then make a plan about what you could tackle? Have no idea if that helps, but feel your pain.

Well DD has surprised me twice this week - on Tues I was in London all day and she wouldn't feed properly (never does in public due to being far too nosy) so expected to be up a couple of times in the night but she didn't. Then last night she went for her normal 6.30pm nap but didn't wake up, not even when I changed her nappy and clothes, and managed a dream feed too which never works. Thought she'd get up mega-early but no, got up at 6am, I'm totally amazed.

I think that I am due an awful night and it'll be tonight, another day of not feeding properly, uhhg. I've noticed this week that she's really cut down on day feeds as well as night feeds, maybe she's finally over the growth period, please to God let that be the truth!!

i'm hoping for the same lollipop as ds2 has been more settled this last few nights although i expect to be up a few times tonight as he has not fed as much as he slept through a feed last night and later today.

leonie - i feel for you and have been there myself in pyjamas, looking like shit on the sofa crying as i have had soooo little sleep. lack of sleep makes it so hard to function and my relationship with dh has been put under huge strain by it recently. i know it will get better once i get more consistent sleep. All the symptoms you describe (crying, depression, forgetting stuff etc) are symptoms of sleep deprivation and once you get some sleep they WILL get better. You obviously had it really tough with dd1 in terms of sleep but that doesn't mean that dd2 will be the same. When did dd1 get the melatonin and was she 'worse' than dd2 at this stage? Your hv is probably desperate to help but sadly, there are no magic cures and ime they don't like not having the answers so they give any old advice. cc does work (i used it with ds1 at 5 months but i knew he was ready for self-soothing iyswim and it barely took 10 mins for him to drop off to sleep) but if your heart or your head isn't in it then it won't work and it will just upset you and dd2. I tried it with ds2 recently and gave up as it was too hard just yet - maybe in a month or so..

sorry mammoth post and i hope you get more sleep tonight

leonie you poor thing, I know how it is with the crying, have had a few moments of despair myself. How old is your dd2? My ds is 23 weeks today and I think in the last 2 weeks we are moving away from 5 wakings a night (night being 11pm -6am) I hope! We found keeping ds nice and toasty really made a difference. We are using the dummy now which works a treat (most times) in the wee small hours. Also , we are giving ds a muslin to suck which he seems to like

Last night ds was asleep in bed by 7pm then fed at 10.30pm, I put the dummy in when he next woke at 1.12am and he next woke at 5.58am. This is by far the best night we've had. However, I was really tired today. Obviously my body is in shock from more than 2.5 hours consecutive sleep

I look forward to the day that I can post and say that ds and I had a good night, but it's not happening yet! Up more than not again last night, and I was so tired that I fell asleep (as did ds) feeding him in an uncomfortable position with my neck all cricked up against the headboard sometime after midnight (feed started 11:50 after me going to bed at 10:30), and woke at 1:20 to move him back to beside me in bed.

He went to bed at 8pm tonight, and I could have cried 20 mins ago when he woke up, but after 3 or 4 mins he resettled, with just a bit of shushing from me. Wonder how long he will last for now.

Leonie - that your hv recommended cc this early. I did it with dd, but she would spend hours screaming at me during the night several times a night, so I figured that I had nothing to lose and everything for us both to gain if I could reduce the crying to just a few more days worth. Even she wasn't this young. I simply can't imagine doing it with ds, as he is such a different character - so much calmer, and doesn't generally cry a lot as long as he gets a bit of attention. I can at least see a point where he might self-settle and sleep through, whereas there was no light at the end of the tunnel with dd.

I really should go to bed myself now, but I've only just finished writing thank you cards (for friends that I am seeing tomorrow morning) for dd's b'day presents, and I'd like at least a few mins of MN me time.

yes the cc suggestion seems a bit harsh - I tried a bit of shush pat around 4 weeks ago out of sheer desperation but gave up after 4 days as I realised it was making me MORE tired as took more effort that just feeding ds and I thought he was too young really. Felt cruel not to bf him.

We are already having problems tonight - ds up again now after waking at 9 too - he has a cold, a really tiny pathetic cough (cute!). I bf him at 9, dp is putting the dummy in now

leonie have you got a supportive dh/dp who can do some settling? my dp did the settling at 9.30pm last week as ds was getting into a habit of waking every night at that time and we knew it was not hunger. Seems to have stopped waking at that time now.

probably had the worst night ever last night . we had to go out at our normal bedtime as BIL over from Spain for 24hrs and we really had to see him. both boys was grouchy and unsettled even though i took their PJs with us and changed both boys into them before we left so they could sleep in the car on the way home.

DS1 slept in the car and we just lifted him into his cot so he only missed out on about 2hrs sleep. he is grumpy this morning but is in his cot napping at the moment.

DS2 slept until 1am and has been awake ever since. he is knackered (and so am I). he is lying beside me now wingeing away unable to switch off. he's not hungry - just tired. I had about an hours sleep all night and am so tired its not funny. to top it all we have a consultant appointment for DS2's heart this afternoon the other side of the city so will get stuck in traffic with the two kids being grumpy in the car.

oh dear fled what a nightmare is someone going with you to the appointment? do you feel okay to drive?

last night started well...DS in bed around 7pm and not a sound from him till midnight was just like the old days! he muttered at 12, i fed him, he went back down without a peep...then his nappy leaked at around 1am and soaked everything in wee, meaning he was wide awake following a change and had to come in with us as no clean grobags. all gets a bit blurry after that. DP took him downstairs at around 5am and returned him, asleep, at 6.20am.

he's in fine form though

thanks cyteen. my friend who's a cardiac nurse is coming with me (he will understand the terminology better than me) as DH cant get the afternoon off work.

at least your DS will settle with your DH. DS2 only wants me. My DH is a poor substitute. anyway DS1 has had an hour's nap and is now wide awake and DS2 has had a massive poo so maybe he will settle now.

fled that just sounds horrendous, hope you can rest a bit this am.

We also had awful night. Ds asleep in bed at 7.30pm.

Then up at 9.30, 10.30, 1.20, 1.50, 3.30, 4.30, 5.30, 6.45 etc. He's grumpy, I'm shattered and poor dp just about managed to drag himself to work. He called me at 9.20 after I;d just managed to fall asleep - to tell me how tired he was

Leonie I really feel for you. It's really rubbish. Can anyone help you?

My DD is 20 weeks and several times over the past few weeks I have 'mother sowed it' as DH puts it. (lain on my side an dlet her suck away) That's not going to kill you, sleep deprivation is.

DS is also sleeping really badly and is very overtired. Yesterday I had a very teary day but feel a bit more positive today.

Problem is I tried shushing DD to sleep last night a bit but she woke DS with her crying so just quiet feeding for me I think.

Have started to keep a sleep/daytime activity/feeding log because a nursery nurse is coming at the beginning of March to come up with ideas for DS and I'll quiz her about DD at the same time.

Things are getting better though. Now it's 3-4 wakings a night, calmer daytimes and a happier baby so we may be turning a corner.

Good luck at your appointment, fled

Can I join in please? I've been directed here from Chat where I was having a moan about the endless sleepless nights with a 4 month old baby and the long days with a toddler who is getting the short end of the deal with an exhausted Mum. Three weeks of growth spurt so far and counting...

My DDs are at such adorable ages, and I wish that I had the energy to actually appreciate them! I said on my other thread that I can completely understand how much grandparents love their grandchildren now, as they get the energy and the cute at the same time!

starlight - are we leading parallel lives?

leonie - it sounds really tough and i wish someone could take the kids for you even for an hour or two so you could get a bit of rest. have you had any support from local national autistic society or other nhs/council orgs. could they help out with some childcare?? i may be lcutching at straws here btw.... please don't worry about crying/shouting/throwing things, i have to resist this urge too and i am wracked with guilt if i shout at ds1 due to my lack of sleep.

i bought a bf necklace today and it has been a godsend in getting ds2 to concentrate on feeding rather than looking around the room all the time. he was a nightmare to feed this am but since i got the necklace he has had three good long feeds with little fussing so i am hoping i have topped up the tank enough f or him to sleep longer tonight.....

Oh God, a friend of mine has just asked my opinion on whether she should give her not quite 4 month old some baby rice as she's waking up in the night and she never has before and she's taking loads of formula in the day and blah. Oh piss, I hate weaning discussions, no better way to give someone the hump! I have given her the longest reply in the world, I hope she doesn't get a nark on. She is clearly just starting the 4-5 month HELL that we're all in, poor bugger.

DD messed about at EVERY feed today, I think she probably had half the amount she should, I am going to be a wreck tomorrow, I can't see her going through tonight, no chance, arrrgh!!

Randomly Mrs Tittlemouse I've decided you were my parallel life person!I think you have 2 years between your DDs?

Leonie, in that case send DH to sleep elsewhere so he can let you nap etc on his days off and then latch on and sleep. Also, I have a friend who can put a DVD on for her toddler and doze on the sofa.

I decided to focus on DS' sleeping because I actually find that harder to deal with than DD's. I think because she's in with me our sleep cycles are in tune. Anyway, lots of fresh air and running around with plenty of food.

Anyway, I'm off to bed. Sweet dreams everyone!

What an utterly pants night, again. Ds woke for a feed 10 mins after I went to bed, fed for 15 mins, slept for an hour, fed for 15 mins, slept for an hour and so on until about 4am, when he switched the pattern to feed for an hour and then sleep for 10 mins . I'm really feeling it now after 2 weeks of mostly hourly wakes.

That's right skimty there's two years between mine. How lovely to have another parallel person! Shame that it's partly due to complete exhaustion. My DH still isn't convinced that we're not doing something "wrong" - he finds MN quite reassuring though, which is good, as we have lots of RL friends who had gentle, quiet, contented babies.

I think that I would cope better if I could get some rest in the day. DD2's daytime sleeping is getting worse and worse - is anyone else going through this? At the moment I'm lucky to get her to have 45 minutes of sleep total during the day! I used to complain about DD1 who needed to go twice around the park to go off to sleep, at least once she was off she would sleep for an hour. DD1 is typically 15 minutes, I'm "lucky" to get 30.

fled hope everything went okay yesterday

Leonie where abouts are you?

I am going to get drummed out - DD slept from just before midnight to just after five last night (and more amazingly, I slept too, rather than waking up every few hours), then had a feed, then back down until eight (when I was so elated from the best night's sleep I've had in months and so overexcited about giving DH his V-Day present that I woke us all up plus my boobs were about to explode).

Night before last was horrendous - bit hazy now but think she was up about six times, sometimes only ten minutes after I'd put her down. There is absolutely no pattern at all - both of the last two nights she's been overexcited and refused to sleep before we go to bed. We just seem to be alternating good and bad nights for no apparent reason, which means hell tonight but (fingers crossed) she should be okay tomorrow after DH and I leave her with granny and go out for our first meal together since she was born (can't face dinner out on V-Day, restaurants full of couples and single red roses on every table are too freaky).

Ooh, enjoy your meal out Anglepoise

Good night here - DS went down without a murmur again, 7-midnight Then fed at 12.10, fast asleep in cot by 12.30; fed at 3.50am, fast asleep in cot at 4.20; fed at 6.30am and I suspect would have gone back to sleep had he not done the most enormous toxic poo