Baby who never naps, can I have some advice on the sleep thing, what can I do now which might pay off later?

[tenacityflux]

Hello, my DD is 11 weeks and hasn't ever slept well, I know she's very little but I want to try something to get us into good habits. So far we have been trying a bed time routine which seems to combine lots of ideas I've gleaned in wide eyed frantic sleep deprived internet searching - I find I need a quiet evening to function, so we bath her at 5.30 to 6.30 (Not for an hour but just at some point during this time) and then she has her feed - she is breast fed the rest of the time but for some reason will never feed at this time, she gets upset and comes on and off the breast - so although we always try she usualy has a bottle of ebm and if she's really hungry, her only few oz of formula. Then I walk around winding her and telling her a story and put how down awake, with my hands on her and on her side and a musical toy playing. One time she went to sleep in ten mins, but the usual thing is I sit with her until she cries and keep my hands on her, if she doesn't calm down I pick her up and sooth her and put her down, when she is eventually quiet I sneak out - I hate her crying but I have my hands on her and I never leave her until she is asleep - I'm hopping she will eventually link the music to sleep time and be able to go to sleep without much more. Tonight she was hard to settle and woke up twice more but that is ( I hope) unususal - she is then usually asleep until midnight when she wakes for a feed and I then take her into my bed where she sleeps and feeds the rest of the night. I Know I should probably try and make her settle again at 12, but my DH has a driving job which means he has to get up early and he needs to sleep, so we've decided this is better for now as I would rather he got sleep and didn't cause a motorway pile up. But during the day, DD will sit happily in her day bed looking at the world for an hour or more, yawning away, but won't ever sleep, just eventually cries. I feed her lying down sometimes but she rarely falls asleep feeding, if she does it's for 5 mins tops; the only way she will sleep during the day is the baby sling - and then she will complain about being put in if she's tired and fights sleeping. Everyone says napping is essential but I don't see how I can get her to nap without her screaming, and so far even my hands on screaming technique hasn't come close to getting her to nap. I'm hoping that she she's bigger/eating more she will gradually push the midnight feed back, especially if we move her bed time back a little, but should I continue having two day time sling naps with her to get her used to the idea that napping is good? Sorry this is such a long post, and very me me me, but I feel like such a novice!

WHEN are you coming to visit?

Oh, the shame. 2009, I think. Actually, come to think of it, we'll be in the W End on the 10th Jan - sort of post new year party starting in the afternoon, but we'll prob come through for the day. You around then?

Am going to bed - tenacity, things will get better - I hope it's very soon, and that you get some sleep. It all looks much more grim when you're exhausted.

i will indeed be around, probably wrangling both dds on my own as dh will be at the football. wanna play?

tenacity, don't forget that all those people will want a shoogle of the baby on christmas day, so hopefully you'll get time for a smooch and a glass of wine. it's hard going at the moment, but i do repeat the mn mantra that habbibu told you. 'this too shall pass'...

oh, and it's not for silent reflux but infacol is for colic and comes with a dropper that you can pop in their wee mouths. sometimes if dd2's going OFF on one i just give her it to shock her into chilling out and getting back on the breast.

First time I've be able to get online - I was so hopping to be all cheerful tonight as in the end, I went to bed with her at 11 and we had a really good nights sleep, she only woke twice and for 10 mins - and today was ok, she had two naps in the sling and we played and it was great until the evening, when I put her to bed and she was quiet, so I popped down stairs to see my friend who has come round (not such a Billy no mates then!) and had been sat down stairs for two hours - came back up and like a fool, rocked the baby who was sitting quite still - then 45 mins of hysteria and screaming no matter what - finally I put her in the sling, she fell asleep, and so I went to unwrap her and put her to bed, but the second I moved her away from me, she screamed and went hysterical again, 30 mins; even left her in her crib for 10 while I cried into my soup, but nothing - then I put her in the sling again and she was awake, I fed her and she finally fell asleep on the sofa - until DH came in and tried to get her back in her crib...now he's rocking her. I have managed to train her that she can only sleep in the sling, or on me, what can I do??She put on 7 oz in a week, why last week would she go to her crib for 5 hours an now she's awake instead - she's been awake for six hours, this can't be right, can it?

OK - first, get it out of your head that you've "trained" her to do anything - this is quite insidious once it gets into your head. Babies are flexible little souls - they have their likes, but as they get older you can introduce new things. At this age they change ALL THE TIME, the little darlings, and if the same thing happens for 2 days you cling to it as a sign of stability but ooooh nooo.

ATM she wants to sleep being held - dd was the same. There's nothing wrong with rocking/cuddling/feeding her to sleep just now - that can all be changed later. The trick, I think, is to cuddle them until you think they're in a really deep sleep and THEN cuddle for 5-10 mins more. This stops you tricking yourself that they're more asleep than they are, iyswim?

Then make sure the bed is warm - heating it up with a hot water bottle ahead of time helps - lower in gently and stay close for a wee while. Sorry if this is all old news to you.

The 7oz makes me wonder if her sleep patterns had a brief change because of a growth spurt - they'll change again soon.

fwiw - dd was a shocking daytime sleeper at that age, but now, aged 2, sleeps 11+ hours at night, and 3 in the afternoon.

It will pass, I promise...

My dd3 never napped in the cot either - she would sleep in the pram or sling but put her down and all hell broke loose. She will now nap but she's 20 months tomorrow! For nine months she's lived with your heartbeat - it's not surprising she wants to be close to you. You are doing a great job - please don't feel you're failing. Have you tried background noise - radio?

tenacity - sorry to hear you have been having such a bad time. it reminded me of my own non-napping DS. SO SO SO many times I had to put him in the sling to get him to sleep at all in the day. ds is now 10mo and his favourite place to nap is still the sling but to be honest with you I wouldnt do anything differently if I had my time over again because it really saved my sanity - and it made ds happy.

is he propped up in the sling? if he sleeps semi-upright but not lying flat, then maybe he does have silent reflux. some babies with reflux do put on plenty of weight because they are always trying to have a little snack because the milk neutralises the acidity - but they never have a full feed because then they get more reflux.

Am not a BF expert but would be careful about block feeding unless you have been advised to do so by experienced bfc as block feeding reduces your supply.

my friend is a gp and her EBF baby was refluxy and she said he was a complete nightmare until they got him on omeprazole which is much better than gaviscon anyway. could you negotiate a weeks trial of omeprazole with GP? if it is reflux, omeprazole should make an obvious difference where gaviscon might not.

Oh, great name, Sally!

I must confess I threw the No cry sleep system across the room today, mainly because it still says things like 'when your baby goes down for a nap...'and mine doesn't! Ho hum, tonight she has gone to sleep, but then I also had three glasses of wine at lunch.....a connection me thinks?Oh no, she's just woken up after half an hour.......