2wks into sleep training and still crying. Does this stop?

[strugglingwithsleep]

We have been doing sleep training (CIO) with our 6 month old son for two weeks. He slept through the night from day one, but continues to really scream and protest before each nap and at bedtime. In the day he will very reluctantly nap for 30 minutes and then wakes and immediately gets upset again.

We're very grateful to have him sleep overnight but it doesn't feel sustainable or fair to him to have hours of crying every day to achieve this.

Has anyone experienced this and found that eventually there is a turning point and the crying reduces?

I am new to mumsnet and may have posted this in the wrong place, apologies if I have!!

Please no comments about our decision to sleep train, we thought very carefully about this.

I understand that you feel you have researched sleep training but very robust evidence around infant sleep suggests that sleep training doesn't actually work.

What has most likely happened is that your little baby's brain now thinks that going to bed is a very stressful experience and that's what he's trying to communicate to you when he cries.

I would dial things back, cuddle your baby and try to make bedtime an enjoyable experience again for all of you. Cuddles, singing, stories and calm sleep.

Have you looked at the evidence around sleep on BASIS online? They have some excellent explanations about why babies sleep the way they do and some great tools for parents.

This is the saddest post ever. I beg you to reconsider. Your baby depends on YOU to feel safe enough to sleep. It's in their DNA. You're trying to fight the natural urge to be close to a parent.

why are you forcing him to nap? it doesn't sound like he is tired. It sounds like you are putting him in his bed and leaving him there until he makes himself exhausted with crying about being left.

of course he wakes up crying. He doesn't even know he has slept. From his point of view, he has just been left, and has cried and cried and cried until you have come back.

Babies choose if and when to nap. Not parents. he doesn't sound like he needs it. Some babies don't. Mine had stopped napping by this age.

How long is he crying before going to sleep at night? If it’s only a few minutes and more of a grumble than a properly upset cry then some babies just do that as a way of getting to sleep- my DD always did. I probably wouldn’t force the naps tbh. If you can get a longer sleep in the pram or the sling I’d do that. I’m all about independent sleep at night but still encouraged on the go naps as it’s move conducive to living life and getting out!

christ, your poor baby.

Please research the attachment theory , babies who cry themselves to sleep eventually stop because they have given up hope of someone coming to comfort them 😢

How long after waking are you putting him down for a nap? Is he self settling?

If he’s waking up crying after 30 minutes, it sounds like he’s possibly over tired to me.

Hmmm I would stop and reconsider in a few months time.

For context we did a modified CIO but my son was much older, nearly 17 months old waking 6 times a night, eating well during the day etc. We were (are still) also in safety critical jobs so functioning at work for 10 hours on no sleep was becoming dangerous, and this was with him Co sleeping with us also!

When I say modified CIO, we went in every 1 minute, then 3, then 5 and never let him cry for more than 7 minutes.

This worked within one night and he now sleeps through the night with no fuss before bed but until recently as he's nearing two, he's getting FOMO and getting cross that playtime is over.

If your baby is overly fussy at nap time it's likely they're not tired and you're trying to get them to nap at a schedule that maybe isn't right for them on that particular day.

Our son will only nap on a walk in the pram or on the boob or of were already planning a journey then in the car. We haven't tried CIO for naps as it just simply did not work for him. So whatever the weather, we're out with the pram after lunch. If he naps, great, of not, we've got some fresh air and I've got out for a bit.

I think 6 months may be a bit too young given the context you've provided, and would definitely suggest pausing and trying again in a few months time.

Another option may be the gradual retreat?

We would never leave an adult crying on there own and wait for them to cry themselves to sleep so please don't do that to your baby.

I would suggest a good night time routine. Bath, lots of playtime with bubbles and toys, into bed with a story and cuddles. Give him his milk, turn on the night light or music and say goodnight. If he's upset, go back in, cuddles and say goodnight. My children like music or audiobooks to settle to when they go to bed. I also don't enforce naps, if he's not tired he's not tired. If you think he's fighting a nap then settle with milk and cuddles.

There’s a difference between not immediately leaping to respond at every grumble but if you’re baby is crying and crying it seems like the wrong call to leave them.

if you were crying like that on your own and your husband didn’t respond to you how would you feel? If you wouldn’t expect to ignore an adult in distress, why is it ok for a baby?

6 months is so small still. If you’re committed to sleep train I would focus on a gentle approach rather than cold Turkey.

CIO isn’t sleeping training. It’s neglect. Neglect is abuse.

A few questions

what does sleep all night from day one look like
what is current sleep schedule.
what method are you using. You say CIO but are you checking in.

I went to hell and back over sleep. I still have a five year old in my bed. But she sleeps.

we eventually did ferbur controlled crying when she was about 14 months. It was that or hospital for me.

im struggling to understand what the issue is. If baby sleeps all night. Perhaps they only need short naps?

Oof. I am definitely not anti sleep training. But if you really mean full blown Cry It Out (ie put in the cot and door shut with no returns) at 6 months old…that is pretty barbaric.

Where are you getting him to nap? And how many naps are you trying for? 30 minutes is completely developmentally normal at 6 months especially if your baby is sleeping through the night! A lot of DC don’t extend their naps until toddlerhood.

I’d carry on putting down in cot for bedtime although I personally wouldn’t leave him crying unattended. For naps I’d go about my life and let him nap in the car/sling/pram whatever.

It is absolutely normal for babies to need help to calm down and sleep. He is hardwired to want to be near you, cave babies were not put separately to sleep by cave women, they would have been eaten by a tiger. His brain is no different to a cave babys brain. You are fighting a very natural and very normal response. If he is sleeping through I would count myself very lucky and not worry about how he actually gets to sleep. He's tiny. You may well be setting yourself up for a whole lot of other issues by leaving him to cry and releasing a load of cortisol that is detrimental to his brain development. There is nothing wrong with comforting a tiny human.

How long are you leaving him to cry before he falls asleep? He’s still tiny and needs closeness and comfort. This is so sad 🙁

Are you actually leaving you 6 month old baby to CIO or do you mean controlled crying CC?
Either way eventually he will stop crying as he will realise there is no point. That won't mean he is necessarily lying in bed and drifting off to sleep happily though.

You know at 6 months that baby can still think that they are attached to you? Physically? So when you're leaving him to cry himself to sleep in his bed, he's wondering where his "safe place" or what he's only ever known has gone. It's between 6-9 months they realise they are a separate person. Honestly, I urge you to reconsider. CIO method is barbaric especially for a 6 month old, they are still tiny!

I wouldn't even use CIO on my 14 month old, I'd rather sit and cuddle her and her not cry herself to sleep and wonder why nobody is coming for her than ever let her suffer emotionally like that 😢

I'd say the problem is that his daytime routine isn't in place if he's struggling to nap. What times is he napping at? I wouldn't recommend sleep training until he is getting enough daytime sleep

OP won’t be back 😏

I found BeyondSleepTraining a really helpful resource to understand what I should expect for normal infant sleep and how to manage naps and bedtimes.
Babies are little for a comparatively short time, it can be ever so hard so manage their sleep but they can't help that they need us for naps and bedtime. Please put your baby's needs ahead of peer or family 'normalised' sleep training

but it doesn't feel sustainable or fair to him to have hours of crying every day to achieve this.

It's not 🫤

Please reconsider what you're doing if you're actually leaving your baby to cry for hours. That's so heartbreaking.

You're baby is crying for you and you're leaving them u til they fall asleep? It's sickening

Your 6 month old stopped napping? Sure.

mostly yes. Both of them. Of course I didn't stop them going to sleep in the push chair or similar if they did it naturally. I didn't put them down for a nap though

That's not stopping napping!