Some help me understand how to sleep train!

[TedTonks]

My baby is 5.5 months and hasn’t slept well since he was 8 weeks. He does a good 3-4 hours to start and then wakes every 45-60m in the night. We have a decent bedtime routine with him but he just doesn’t know how to get himself to sleep!

So we’ve decided to sleep train - sounds like it’s normally done in 3 (torturous) days but I don’t fully understand how it works…

do you just do it for their bedtime (7-8pm) or do you also do it for every night wake? When people say ‘oh it took 30 minutes on day 1’ do they mean for every wake or just the first put down?

please help a very tired mumma out!!!

I would suggest doing it for day time naps first before night time wakes. This will allow them to learn to self-soothe and sleep for longer stretches in the night as they learn better habits during the day.

For night time wakes you want to wait till post 6 months+ before night sleep training because by that time you can have a greater confidence that they can metabolically fast through the night. Even then I would suggest slowly weaning off night-feeds I.e. gradually reducing time/amount a little each day - as opposed to a cold turkey approach.

Of course you want to have a consistent routine, so bed time has to be same time every day (e.g. 7pm) etc. Monitor naps and ensure they aren't over sleeping. Make sure they don't have any naps too close to bed time. I think at that age we made sure DC was sleeping past 4/4:30pm.

Here is a good video by two Doctors on sleep training:

I made also made a post on things to consider yesterday: www.mumsnet.com/talk/sleep/4740462-6-month-old-sleep-reassurance?reply=123826596&utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

Good luck

There are multiple ways to sleep train. Cry it out and controlled crying are usually the quickest ways but usually involve the most distress. If baby is feeding to sleep and waking up for milk you could first try night weaning and for some babies this I all it takes to get baby sleeping through. Or you could use a stay and support or gradual retreat which might take a few weeks but usually causes less distress.

Check out "no judgement baby and toddler sleep training" on Facebook. Lots of great advice and plans for successful sleep training. Also outlines different ways to do it, check-ins etc if that's preferable xx

Sorry, realised I should have been much more specific! By ‘Sleep training’ I mean cry it out.

I do understand there are more gradual methods but this feels just like prolonging the process and is more for the parents than baby. (Btw I do know CIO is HARD - I’m actually planning to go out and leave DP to it - he is completely impervious to crying).

but thank you for the responses so far!!

What are your baby's current sleep cues?

I would recommend Pick Up Put Down. Cry it out is teaching your baby that their caregivers will ignore them and their needs.

Leaving your baby to cry is cruel. They don't learn to self soothe, they learn no one cares enough to come to them and they shut down.
Have a look at gentle methods to help your baby, but sleep is a developmental milestone and you really can't teach them to do it.
Have a look at the no cry sleep solution.

I don't think cry it out is recommended at this age, your baby will be hungry in the night at this age still surely?

There are lots of books that explore different methods. Controlled crying you go in at regular intervals such as 1 min, 3 mins, 6 mins but don't pick up.

I don't know anyone who did cry it out.

@doadeer yes he will still need to wake probably twice to feed, I’m just hoping to cut out the other 10 wakes! He just rouses in the night and can’t get himself back to sleep without rocking or feeding.

not sure how doing controlled crying is any different to CIO really? Other than that it draws out the process! Although happy to hear of your experiences with it :) how long did it take?

@zurala no it’s not and no they don’t. Thanks for your input though 😘

Pick up put down teaches them to go to sleep without being rocked or fed but without leaving them the cry.

I promise the 'no judgement baby and toddler sleep training group' on fb has everything you need to know! Wish I'd known about it with my first. It'll take you through CIO if that's what you want to do, info on night weaning or how to sleep train whilst continuing night feeds (as sounds appropriate for your wee one), wake windows, regressions etc etc...everything you could think of. Sorry posting about it again but it's the absolute best advice on sleeping training I found and I can't rave about it enough.

@RandomMess we did originally consider this method but it seems to take much longer and I would struggle to keep the consistency :) i also have wrist Injury and so struggle with picking him up as it is! I do appreciate it is another method that works though

@Greentomatoes21 thank you, I don’t have fb but I’ll get my partner to check it out! Or just let me on his account :) sleep training with night wakes sounds perfect!

@TedTonks delegate it to your DH then.

Honestly cry it out is cruel and should be an absolute last resort.

PUPD worked very quickly with my DC, no crying involved.

If he's dependant on rocking or feeding to get to sleep, cutting those out should solve the problem without leaving him alone to cry. For example, my baby was waking up for the dummy multiple times a night. I got rid of the dummy and he cried for about 10 minutes. I patted his bottom and shushed him while this was happening and he eventually fell asleep and then slept through more or less (waking once for feeding). Don't think you need to solve this issue with CIO, he might respond well to a gentler method and it won't necessarily take longer.

@RandomMess how quickly is ‘very quickly’? Did you have to do it for every wake and nap or just bedtime? How long did each session of PUPD take to work?

CIO is not cruel though

@naomiembrace thanks for your response :) I’m not really 100% what the issue is! I guess it’s mainly that he just wakes so often? If he just woke to feed and still needed rocking back off that would be fine but he wakes basically every sleep cycle after midnight

Mine was younger it took 24 hours. I did it for every sleep but I had never fed to sleep either she just loved being held whilst sleeping.

We can agree to disagree that CIO is cruel especially at 6 months when they don't even understand that they are a separate entity to their primary care givers.

Get the Ferber sleep training book.

@RandomMess well 24h is amazing! How long did each session take? I’m just thinking he only normally naps for 30m and so if it takes too long to PUPD then he’ll just get overtired and it’ll never happen. Or does that not happen in practice?

we aren’t planning to try CIO for a couple more weeks (when he is 6m) so I might give this a go for a couple of days in the meantime.

@TheShellBeach i shall - How did Ferber work out for you?

@TheShellBeach also, I don’t really understand how it works and differs from CIO? Cause my baby will still cry and scream even if we go in and pat him occasionally? I’m not sure how it makes it any gentler?

Brilliant!
After two nights, DD slept through.
The first night was awful, I won't lie. But the second night was much easier, and on the third night she just went straight down and slept all night looking.
It was controlled crying.
She was 18 months old. I wished I'd done it earlier, when I saw how easy it was.
Don't let anyone tell you it's cruel. DD doesn't remember it at all and we still have a great relationship. She's an adult now.

That should say "all night LONG".......

I just went in at ever increasing intervals. So to start with, I went in after one minute and patted her and told her "bedtime, you need to go to sleep now" and went straight out of the room again.
Then I waited two minutes (by the clock) and did the same again.

And then three minuites............and so on...........but I never stayed long enough to say anything other than "you need to go to sleep now, darling" and I was back out in the hall, timing her again.

I think it took a total of two - three hours from beginning the sleep training on the first night, until she gave up and went to sleep. So maybe I started at 7 pm and she was finally asleep by about 9.45. When she woke in the night I did it again, but she seemed to realise that I wasn't going to pick her up, and it only took about half an hour before she was asleep again (I started with the one minute again, then up to two minutes, then three etc. etc.) She woke up once more and I did it again.

On night two, I expected it to take three hours but it only took about forty minutes. She woke once, briefly.

On night three, she just slept through.

I highly Recommend the Precious Little sleep book, it's really good. I'd love to know what evidence you've looked at which says it's not cruel - there's a vast amount which says it is... I do understand how awful sleep deprivation is, but I could honestly not leave my baby to cry.