Don't understand how people sleep train

[EdithGrantham]

My DD is just over 1 and sleeps in her own cot until the first wake, usually around 2-3 hours, then is in bed with me breastfeeding on and off all night. I'm relatively happy with this setup but would ideally like a longer stretch at the start of the night.

I'm not overly keen on the idea of full on sleep training but would consider it if I thought it might work. The problem is if I send DH in to settle at the first wake or if I try to settle her without feeding she usually just gets more and more inconsolable to the point of throwing up so obviously we don't try it too often!

Has anyone had similar and found a way to settle without feeding?

I should add, she's not as bad if I'm out, DH walks her round the house to show her I'm not there and she settles more easily, not without a fair few tears but DH has said it's doable.

I think if you wanted to do it, you need to stop allowing the breastfeeding off and on. Maybe do more set feeding times in the night and offer water at other times.

And it may take your DH doing a few nights in a row to break the cycle she is used to

At 1 she doesn’t need to be BF or having a drink in the middle of the night.

To give her the foundations for a solid nights sleep, you need to put in place the following:

• A designated “sleep place” ie her own cot or your bed - but not multiple places to sleep
• A dark room
• Enough protein during the day that she doesn’t wake up hungry during the night
• A comforter that isn’t your breast - could be a teddy, could be her thumb. Currently she needs to suck on your breast to sleep, this won’t be a hunger thing, it’s a comfort thing. You need to break that habit.

This is going to be about breaking the cycle of what she’s used to. Returning her to her cot, or not making your boobs available if that’s what you want.

Mostly, it’s about being consistent, explaining to her what you’re doing, getting through the few nights of hell while she adjusts, and then benefitting when she does quickly adjust!

Thanks both. To answer a few points; I've tried offering water instead of boob but again she cries to the point of being sick.

For DH to settle her a few nights in a row I would have to be out and that's not feasible really as I am in bed by the time she's waking up.

Both her and our rooms are dark.

She eats a LOT of protein in the day and amount eaten doesn't seem to change her night wakes anyway.

It's definitely a comfort thing and I'm happy for her to feed for comfort the majority of the time, it's just that first wake that I could do with being a bit later.

She was sleeping 6 hours straight at one stage but that was very short-lived, didn't do anything different then to now so don't have anything to replicate to gain the same results.

Realistically I can see us just riding this out as I can't be dealing with the 3 hours broken sleep I get on the nights we've tried to change things compared to the 8 hours broken on a normal night. Just wondered if there was something I hadn't thought of trying!

Also OP, you do need to stop the BF on and off all night sooner rather than later as it will wreck her teeth. you need to brush her teeth after milk, if it sits on teeth all night it will cause decay.

As pp said, these are cycles that need to be broken

As others have said, consistency is key - ride out a few rough nights and your DD will settle into a new routine.

Do you have a spare room you could sleep in to let DH take charge for a few nights?

That’s not true with breastmilk! There’s actual protective properties in breastmilk against decay! yes cows milk in a bottle can damage teeth, but most damage comes from diet or antibiotics in pregnancy.
my daughter has just turned 2 and we cosleep, has had access to boob when she wants, when teething or ill it was alot! She’s now going 9-6am no boob, her choice! Sometimes has some water. They grow out of it - I could never sleep train either and I love having her in with us, and she will until she’s happy to sleep alone (shes alone until we go to bed at 10/11). They all do it eventually, until then I am enjoying the cuddles!

This isn't true. Lots of studies that show that breastmilk doesn't cause cavaties in the same that bottle feeding does and can in fact protect against them.

If you're relatively happy with the current set up then I'd keep that. My almost 3yo bedshared with me and bf through the night at that age. his sleep improved significantly at around 13/14m and then again at around age 2 and he was then sleeping through consistently (still with me). he seems to have healthy sleep habits, goes to sleep easily at night, asks to go to bed when he's tired, loves to snuggle in the mornings and not get up 🙈 we've always done what's made everyone's lives easiest with bedtime, and for us that was feeding to sleep, bedsharing, feeding during the night.

also his teeth are fine and he still occasionally bf during the night.

Do what's right for you OP, it may be sleep training of some form or you might just continue how you are.

habit stacking might be worth looking into though if you want to try something, I think maybe Lindsey Hookway talks about that on her Instagram.

We are a bit further down the line but similar situation. Generally toddler sleeps 8-2 or 3am. Sometimes longer. That first sleep has lengthened over time and toddler sleeps in the cot for it then comes to my bed.

We were in a very similar position at 13 months. We changed nothing and at 16 months and bar a little teething episode she's started sleeping 8-2 and then in with me and after a comfort sickle she's back asleep til 7. Like you we couldn't let her cry as she got more worked up and was sick and to be fair I got way more sleep her in bed with me and helping g herself to boob than I did trying to get her to resettle multiple times without it. If It's working for you I'd ride it out a bit longer.

For a couple of awful nights with sleep training our kids have slept beautifully from about 6 months, one will come to us around 7 am, but if we told him to stop he would. I’d balance the ‘cruelty’ of a couple of bad nights against the whole family sleeping well.

That’s true and not. If children are grazing at bottles, it’s worse for teeth with formula compared to breast milk. But if they are only having cow’s milk three times a day, grazing on breast milk is significantly worse for tooth health.

anyway, they’re not going to settle for you smelling milky, so either stop bfing or send your husband to settle them. (Or just ignore them).

I could be completely wrong, but I thought sleep training is usually done with younger babies- around 6 months?

Do you actually want to change the setup or do you just feel it's something you should be doing because that's what society says. It doesn't sound like you are sure.

I had similar with my baby - I didn't try to train him because that would have meant distress and less sleep. He does sleep through now most of the time (except when ill etc)

Gg

Thanks for the further replies, good to hear others did nothing and sleep got better on its own. That's been my approach up until now but now I'm back at work it's not as easy!

I'm not sure I've been clear with just how distressed she gets, she wakes up crying then will literally scream for 10 minutes, even whilst being comforted and then she throws up, not just a little bit but the milk feed she's had before bed and some of her dinner. Then she obviously needs a full pyjama change which wakes her up and annoys her even more and it takes 2 hours+ on and off feeding her to comfort and get her back down to sleep and she is just generally unsettled then for the rest of the night. I can't see how denying her comfort or doing that 3 or more nights in a row would be kind or helpful

I'm happy enough with co-sleeping for the most part, I definitely get more sleep than if I had to get up to her in the night. I've looked into tooth decay and the evidence isn't strong so for now we'll keep going with feeding for comfort as well.

I was just wondering if anyone had been in this position and found some magic trick, to comfort without feeding or to lengthen that first stretch of sleep.

She was very unsettled all last night and I think she has some painful gas so I'm going to ask the pharmacist what they recommend, from what I've read you can give infacol or similar but I wouldn't know what dose as it's usually used for much younger babies.

When she initially goes to bed, does she fall asleep on the boob? If so, then that's why she grazes all night as its the only way she knows to get back to sleep.

So id start there.

I recommend reading Dr Ferber’s book. Even though you probably won’t want to do “the method”, I found it really useful in understanding more about the mechanics of sleep, which might help you decide how to tackle it.

Is dc getting enough sleep during the day? Waking up after 2-3 hours sounds like they're not falling into a deep sleep which can be a symptom of not having enough sleep during the day.
If you do want to change this then you need to stop breastfeeding. Your dc doesn't need the food.

Thanks for the further advice, we won't be stopping breastfeeding but thanks for the suggestion.

She falls asleep either on the breast, or being held/rocked, sometimes in the cot with a hand on her chest or back depending on her preference for the night.

Definitely getting enough sleep in the day as we follow her lead for this, she's always been lower sleep needs so "wake windows" never worked for us.

She falls asleep either on the breast, or being held/rocked, sometimes in the cot with a hand on her chest or back depending on her preference for the night

Then this is exactly where I'd start. Keep the overnights as is for now, and work with her and dh to get her to the point where she will lay awake, full, in her bed and fall asleep herself. It will take time, lots, and gradual steps. But it will be so worth it, and when she is used to falling asleep independently in her bed without you, she'll then do it in the middle of the night too.

Just wanted to say, don’t stop breastfeeding to ‘fix’ a sleep problem. You may well end up with a baby that doesn’t sleep and a sense of regret about doing something you weren’t ready for. They grow out of it. Good luck.

There are two different things happening. 1. She's used to being in with you 2. she's feeding through the night out of habit

I would feed her in her own room, however often she wakes, then put her back in the cot. It will take a few nights, at least, for her to get the hang of it.

I didn't find anything worked until I stopped breast feeding. She just wouldn't accept any other comfort, so I continued co sleeping until I was ready to stop breast feeding.

You're doing a great job breast feeding OP, well done

What some people dont seem to realise is that whether your 1 year old sleeps in their cot for 12 hours solid every night, or whether they sleep for 2 hours, cry, come into bed for a quick breast feed, sleep some more, quick feed again on repeat, your baby HAS been sleep trained!
Sleep training is really just a description of how your child has learned to sleep (or not) throughout the night.

It’s interesting that I’ve never read a thread on here where a parent is asking for suggestions to help get their children out of the habit of sleeping for 12 hours almost every night.

Lots of babies need to be taught how to sleep well.