Should we try some sort of bedtime routine now?

[RGPargy]

Any advice would be greatly appreciated - DP and I are exhausted!

DD (3 weeks) has always slept very well during the day downstairs in her moses basket. However for the past 2 weeks or so from about 6pm she just will NOT go to sleep!! She is constantly crying/whinging and if she does fall asleep in your arms, the moment you put her down, her eyes ping open and we are back to square one. At first we thought it was colic, but now i'm not so sure as she doesn't bring her knees up when she cries, but will go stretched out rigid, the reason for which i am unsure.

This is all very well and good whilst it's the Xmas holidays etc, but we are aware that we have neighbours and DP will be returning to work soon too so we have to sort SOMETHING out to stop her crying from 6pm til 2.30am every single night!!

I am thinking that perhaps when/if she does drop off at that sort of time, to put her in her basket and then put that in her cot in her room so that it's more peaceful than downstairs with us and the tv blasting.

At the mo, all i can do is constantly BF her to get her to sleep but my arms are killing me from constantly holding her!!

Any help would be FAB!

TIA

(duty calls, must get baps out for screaming LO again).

might as well get into some sort of bedtime routine with bath, bf in dimly lit room and put to sleep in basket upstairs. I'm sure others will be on with more wise words soon!

We started a bedtime routine at 2 weeks. My sister suggested I take dd to bed at 7pm. I was sceptical, thinking she'd be up all evening, but it worked. We just carried her up in her moses basket to our room. Obviously there were still the night feeds, but her body definitely told her it was nighttime and she'd sleep through till her first feed at 11pm.

At 3 weeks she's still in the throes of cluster feeding during the evening, plus she's due for a mega growth spurt around now . It's a very common phase in bf babies and she needs to feed like that to boost your supply to meet her needs. Your supply probably isn't completely established yet so it's important to let her still feed on demand - which is all evening, if she's anything like my ds2.

Personally, I'd work out a pillow/cushion support so that you can just feed, feed, feed (and let your dp wait on you hand and foot!) and accept that it's what she needs to do for a little while longer.

IME it dies down at about 6-8 weeks and then you can think about a bedtime routine.

FWIW, my friend has never given her dd a routine, which has some advantages, but they have terrible problems getting their dd (now age 2) to bed. She's up with them till they go to bed, won't sleep in her room and often exhausted in the day, therefore taking long daytime naps then raring to go at night.
I'm so glad we started a proper bedtime routine, it means we've had evenings to ourselves and on the whole dd has slept really well.

Just read your comment about arms aching from holding dd. Can you feed her lying down or try rugby hold?

Thing is, she's not actually feeding, but just comfort sucking so i'm thinking about introducing a dummy but dont w\ant to end up with nipple confusion.

soz for crap typiong. am doing it one handed coz she's asleep again for 30 seconds!

Cant feed laying down as i cant get hang of it and she hated rugby when i tried it once too.

Just tried the pushchair. still no joy!

Dummy was marvellous for us. She had such a powerful suck, so we'd feed her then pop the dummy straight in till she'd had her 'fix'of it.
Luckily she grew out of it by 5 months.

Sounds very familiar. Was DD a nighttime baby before birth too?

Get a routine going, at least you will have a plan and feel that you are managing the situation, rather than being managed by a three-week-old. We started bath, feed, cuddles, bed at about 2-3 weeks.

We found that lots of noise, bright lights and fresh air dring the day helped DS to learn the difference between day and night too. TV is incredibly stimulating for an infant btw, even if they are not looking at it. You probably want to keep her away from it in the evening.

You'll probably need to sacrifice a few evenings to begin with in getting the routine going, but it won't last forever. As people note above though, growth spurts can mean that all previous arrangements are off, as we're finding out.

Puffling - i'm seriously considering a dummy. DS had one from a very early age but it still didn't really do much for him IIRC.

Triathlete - I wouldn't say DD was a night time baby as such, although i would feel her movements more when i got into bed and laid down, but she never ever woke me up and i never felt her if i got up in the night for the loo or anything.

Thanx for the hints and tips re the TV and lights etc. I did wonder if that's what was causing her some distress.

We had a bitter-sweet night last night. We spent about 3 hours upstairs in her room calming her. She'd cry, fall asleep, we'd place her in her basket and her eyes would ping open just as we got to her bedroom door, and so the routine would start again. This happened until about 10pm when she finally relented and slept until midnight. She then only woke up because we decided to bring her basket into our room as normal. I fed her and she didn't wake again until 3ish. Unfortunately tho at 5am she woke again screaming the place down - something she never does at that time of the day!! I did have a burger that was made with onions yesterday tho and seeing as onions do her guts in, i am wondering if that's what caused the screaming session this morning from 5am til 6.45am!!!

I think we deffo need to keep up with the routine tho. I believe that kids do need routine so (apart from tonight coz it's DP's birthday) it'll be 7pm bedtime from now on.

GULP

HAPPY BIRTHDAY MR RGP!

Persevere sweetie! It WILL get better.

Daniel seems to fuss between 5pm and 8pm at the moment, but a bath and good feed and long cuddle seems to make it a little more managable.

He crashes at 8pm, and usually dont hear from him again until between 11 and 12.

Then again between 3 and 4am and he then sleeps til about 7am

I know im FF now rather than BFing but as long as Ellie is feeding well during the day, there shouldnt be any reason she cant go 3-4hrs between feeds.

Try the dummy if you want to, cant see she would have too much confusion now, and Daniel didnt at all.... he's had a dummy since he was 2 days old! Admittedly, he only has it in the car seat now though, which meant he didnt have it AT ALL yesterday!

Hello, we started a really gentle routine about 3 weeks ago with ds who is now 9 weeks, and it restored our sanity. We give him a bath each night at about 7.00 and then pop him in his sleep suit in a nice dark room and then I feed him as much as he can handle and we pop him down. He still mewls once or twice and one of us goes in and gives him a cuddle or a rock (we take it in turns at night so at least someone gets a proper evening!!) but he is getting the hang of it and is normally asleep within an hour and then surfaces again about midnight for a feed. We also introduced a dummy once he was feeding okay, and it is a life saver. Will deal with the dummy-fixation in due course if it arises , but he does seem to spit it out when he is tired of it.

A bedtime routine is always useful, even a very gentle one. We just did a relaxing bath, followed by a bit of baby massage, and feeding in a dimly lit room. I had a telly moved into the bedroom so I could keep myself entertained whilst doing all the evening cluster feeds!

Thanx girls, i will deffo keep up with the routine. It might have to be re-started from tomorrow coz of the pub/curry tonight (something mild for me, i think!!) as we'll be in the pub at bathtime and bedtime.

Here's hoping that it works!

Yes, food has a real effect on their happiness. DW can't eat garlic, ginger, anything spicy in fact. We're eating a lot of mashed potato at the moment.

One thing I'm not clear of from your OP and that might be a factor - she's sleeping in the Moses basket during the day, but then you put her in the cot at night, is that right? If so, the cot will seem enormous to her, and probably a very scary place. Are you using some rolled up towels or blankets around her to give her some boundary reassurance?

DS slept in the basket in our room at night, and in his pram, on the floor or in our arms or the sling during the day. THis helped him to learn the difference too. He's only just gone into the cot, and we have put the rolled-up blankets back around him

Hope this helps and it gets better.

Hi Triathlete

No sorry, DD is sleeping in her moses basket all the time. We bring it downstairs during the day and take it up at night. The other night we placed the basket inside the cot as i know it seem very daunting for them to be in such a huge space!

Spoke to my HV today who suggested i check my latch as we could both be being a bit lazy and she could be taking in air with her feeds. I must admit to being a bit blase with her latch lately too - if it doesn't hurt, i just let her get on with it!

I will deffo be checking our latch on the next feed. Anything to help with her colic! Thanx for the tip re the rolled up towels. I'll deffo be doing that when she outgrows her basket.

How is it going RGPargy? I could have written your OP, my DD is 3wks and exactly the same, we are similarly exhausted...

really struggling and starting to lose confidence/get down about it.

We are attempting to get a wee routine going too, but the problem seems to be her unpredictable timings, e.g. she had a feed at 5, so I thought great, feed till 5.45ish, get her up 7 for a bath and "final" feed...she is still going now at 6.15...can't settle her, aaargh!!

Hi Caz

There is an improvement since i wrote the OP - the hours that she is screaming for seem to have lessened but it doesn't stop the fact that we feel useless when she's crying in pain.

I gave her a feed, then a bath then another feed this evening and so far she's been conked out for the last 30 mins. I tried changing positions for her (see my post HERE for info) and it seems to have worked (so far).

Keep at it Caz - as DP keeps reminding me, it's not forever and wont last long in relation to the bigger picture.

Good luck and you can always find me on the November antenatal thread if you need some help and reassurance that you're not the only one with a baby that screams all night!

Well, DD woke at about 9, had a feed and a small grizzle/colic event and has now gone back to sleep in her stairs and has been there since around 9.30.

I'm keeping everything crossed!!!!

My DD was a nightmare and I didn't sleep between week 3 and 5 at all. Then I read Happiest Baby on the Block and swaddled her tight! She cried at first then slept for 6 hours BLISS. I BF her and still do at 14mnth. Good luck!!! At 8 Weeks she slet 8 hours!!!!

8 hours???? Blimey!! I'm dreaming of 4 hours at the moment!! We're doing 3 hour stints at the moment.

Yep, was absolutely gobsmacked DH and I woke up with a start thinking she must be dead. No, just happily asleep. I honestly thought it was because she wasn't getting enough of my milk. At about 7 weeks started to express milk when got up then fed her with other boob. DH gave her expressed milk in bottle at night before bed and then I would top up with the boob and swaddle. Zonk! Some babies seem to sleep well and other don't. I promise you it gets better. BF is difficult to begin with spent Hrs obsessing bout latching on and suddenly realised she was a tubby bugger and she was small when born. You want me to post you the DVD at the weekend, got spare someone gave me? Makes so much logical sense! DD was swaddled till 6.5 months. It didn't stop her developing as she could walk (v wobbly) at 9 months. I'm going back to work on Wed for first time and dreading it. HNY

Yeah i can see that would make sense giving the EBM but i'm terrified of causing nipple confusion - i wont even give her a dummy just in case!

I know the sleeping will get better - DS started sleeping through the night from 9 weeks and as DP and I are so laid back we are hoping she will follow suit! I know what you mean about waking with a start too. I do that now when i'm just turning over, just in case!

What DVD is this then? It's been such a long time since i did the baby thing that i feel like a first time mum again!

In a nutshell it's about the fact babies are born too soon and so you need to recreate the womb environment.DD went from EBM to nipple with out murmur (god send we moved house when she was 7 weeks and then lived in building site for hmmm 4 months at least and had to leave her at Nanna's for small time who things BFing is for crazy hippies) spat out a dummy like it was poison.
However the best thing was swaddling with a sheet tightly - stops the whole crazy wavy arm thing small un's can't help but do. EBM was more to get DH involved and stop MiL moaning - she was getting enough from me just liked it too much! Problem is we were just too wimpy to listen to her cry her self to sleep. Oh and I couldn't BF DD lying down until she was about 8 weeks. Might be size?

AVG - wow!! I think swaddling is def helpful, DD's arms seem to be the major culprit in keeping her awake sometimes. Keep trying it with her cellular blankets but they are too small.. also bought these "miracle blankets" specially for swaddling but I am crap at working them! what did you use?

RG - keeping everything crossed for you! we were slightly better last night too, amazing that you can be happy you've had 2 hrs sleep!!