SLEEP IS FOR THE WEAK PART 8 -- Pack the bags under your eyes and join us!

[RoRoMommy]

Well...I had to think of something! DH's suggestion "Eyes wide shut--the art of sleepwalking"

i don't know. tiring him out never worked with sleep before. i've tried making him climb stairs to no avail with the sleep. i made him walk half way home from the park today as he's got a new backbending screeching manoevure every time i try to put him in the pushchair. it took me 15 mins this morning to get him in!

quiet around here? everyone is zzzzzzzzz?

Hello all!

Just a quickie, only came in here to look for something and found myself waylaid (you all know what I'm talking about, right? Just one peek on Active Convos and it's all downhill ...!)

Great progress all round by the sounds of things - well done to everyone who's getting some kip

Sorry to hear about the teething ginger and Meg but I hope things settle down for you soon. How's your other half doing ginger?

Haven't seen beal around the boards either, I hope she's ok.

Things are wobbly but tentatively better here - DS has started the last 3 nights in his cot and last night actually lay still for DP to pat him to sleep. I then interrupted by accident at which point DS decided he was actually hungry but until then fantastic progress. The patting thing before was just farcical - one of us loudly 'shussshhhhhing' and patting while DS thrashed around and shouted, hardly soothing for anyone .

Back to work soon, and looking at selling up and renting for a bit to make ends meet ...

Happy sleeping everyone!

If it makes ANYONE feel better I am still being waoken up several times a night by my 3 year old DS. My 4 year old DD slept through from 5 weeks and has never ever woken in the night not even when ill of potty training. Done nothing different with either of them. Same goes for food. He eats like a 'man' (meat, spuds, pastry etc) and she eats everything. I have had to hide the salad bowl in fridge and fruit bowl otherwise she would eat it all day.

Bizarre arent they?. I am beyond the point of tiredness, especially as I work evenings too! The only difference is that I breastfed DS and maybe he got used to seeing me every hour??. Maybe DD are just more independent??.

monkeybutler said: "If it makes ANYONE feel better I am still being waoken up several times a night by my 3 year old DS"

Honestly?

It SO doesn't!

Ooopppps sorry!. I am told DS will get better when he starts school but as a Nov kid he has just missed out last year. he is a big lad (ten pounder at birth) and takes a lot of tiring out. I might get a treadmill nstalled and run him like a dog!. I collapsed at work with exhaustion and had to resign in the end. This was when he was 10 months old and hadnt slept for more than an hour at a time. He is physically and mentally fine and I just thank god for that - it must be so much harded to ave to cope with any disability too. Its had enough managing life in exhaustion with a healthy kid. In the post I was just trying to say it could be worse and is for so many people.

Amber, I feel for your pram tantrums we are having major highchair tantrums at the mo. Not a meal goes by without major moaning and grizzling, and trying to tip plates over driving me slightly insane tbh.

CSB for improved nights

EP at DS's haircut. Doubt my DS will ever need one, he's 11mo tomorrow and still only got a few fluffy tufts!

Monkeybutler, love teh baby treadmill idea. I chase DS from one end of the room to the other several times a day to wear him out... but end up more out of breath myself than he is!

Hello Monkey. Welcome to SIFTW. We're a humourous lot here so don't mind our quips.

You sound like you've had a tough 3 years. Sleep deprivation is no joke and trying to combine that with work is not easy. In fact it was the thought of returning to work that forced me to get tough with DS2. But I know that not everyone feels confortable with that approach or even that it works 100% of the time.

I don't have much advice, but lots of support and encouragement. Keep posting there are lots of regulars here and it's a great site for support.

The only method that I know/have used for an older child is rapid return, but I have only used it after they had been sleeping through and started refusing to go to bed.

Hello everyone else. Good night last night. DS2 fell asleep feeding so I woke him up . Gave him a kiss goodnight in his cot and he fell asleep with a smile. {ahhh}
Woke at 4 for a feed and then 6 for the day.
DD woke at 1.30 because of a nightmare, but that's another story.

IARC: I'm glad to hear you've made progress with patting. I used patting with DS1. I'll try and link the website with the method I followed if I can find it. Word of caution though. He stopped feeding at night, but carried on waking to be patted. In the end when he was 11 months I had to do cc, but it was really easy.

x-posted Meg. Hello.

Ds has decided he wants to use baby led weaning despite my enthusiatic pureeing!!
He gets really cross if we eat something and don't give him some. [smle]

patting method

I hope that worked

Hi Charliemama. Not sure what you mean by 'getting tough'!. I left both my children to cry themselves to sleep from about 8 weeks (like you say most people not comfortable with that). DD took a week and the longest she cried for was 25 mins (on and off and mostly whimpers). Did same for DS, first week he cried solidly throughout the night. Over the nest 12 months I changed his sheets up to 7 times a night where he had been sick through cryng. I laid outside his bedroom door weeping with frustration. he broke two blood vessels in his throat yelling and yelling. He attended several sleep clinics and every 'method' of calming him has been tried CONSISTENTLY.

It is not a lack of 'getting tough' with a child. It does not work 100% of the time. It may have worked for your children but dont assume a childs sleeping problems are the parents fault for being 'soft'. It isnt always a good idea to play I'm a Better Parent with a tired woman.

MonkeyButler I was in no way trying to play better parent. Far from it and I am sorry if I my post came across that way.

I really wanted to express my support and empathy.

Sorry

Hey Monkey Butler, sounds like you've had a very hard time, sounds awful for all of you. CM wasn't being judgemental at all, this thread isn't about arguments or finger pointing it's about support and you'll get lots of sympathy from some fellow sleep deprived parents here but one thing you won't get is an argument, we're too nice .

Ignore me Charliemama, I am shattered, have to go to work tomorrow. DS has just pooed on library floor and IT WAS RUNNY. Can he go to nursery tomorrow in that case????. DH away all week, no family help and work getting arsey about anymore leave. Sorry again, had a go at a woman at school today for driving on the pavement - would have normally just tutted!.

Have just checked calendar and am also day 26 of cycle - no excuse for being a cow but there you go - off to get some chocolate now. Oh, am also coming off Prozac so that doesnt help matters!

Also has row with MIL this morning about whether she would have DD and DS while I have a smear in a couple of weeks. Obviously answer was no so the DCs will have to stand at end of the bed and watch - how my in therapy will that cost me in a few years!

MB, does he tell you why he's woken or what he wants / needs?

Have you tried him in your bed with you? I'm sure you will have after 3 years you've probably done everything short of gagging!!

MB: You are coping amazingly well under all those difficult circumstances. No apologies needed.

I wish I could think of a solution, but as Ginger said you have provably tried everything.

DS1 started school this year and I really feel the pressure of having to get him to school on time, in uniform with his lunch etc. Then making sure we've read enough books, done the homework in the evenings. Many days I have just wanted to shut myself in a corner and cry and cry, but when you have other Dcs you can't you have to keep going. My Dcs also always pick the times DH is away to be sick and up all night.

Have you got friends who can give you a bit of a break during the day when DD is at school?

I hope the chocolate helps. I discovered giant chocolate buttons which are delicious.

I only lurk on here, so prob have no right to do this at all as you say ginger, this is a suportive thread and not about passing judgement, but i wanted to say I think ginger and charlie are incredible for the supportive posts they've just written to somebody who quite frankly wrote a really rude message. this thread is only ever full of encouragement and support and for somebody new to come on here and be so aggressive is IMHO quite out of order sleep deprived or not. (Yes, I do have a 1yo who wakes 4-5 times every night, yes my GP has prescribed me AD, so yes I do know what it's like too).
sorry ladies, quite happy for this post of mine to be pulled but I think the regular posters on here do an incredible job of supporting not just each other, but helping all of us with bad sleepers who are too shy to join in but like to follow you.

Oh lordy I hope none of this was the result of my rushed comment that knowing my sleepless child might be just as sleepless when he's 3 didn't make me feel better!

monkeybutler, this thread's been an absolute saviour for a lot of us - as you'll know, until someone has experienced the soul-destroying relentlessness of life with a bad sleeper they don't really understand. Here is a place where everyone knows how shite it is - whereas in RL often people say 'Oh yes, I know what you mean, my first baby didn't sleep 12 hours until she was 8 weeks!' or similarly unhelpful things. There's always loads of support and sympathy.

I hope you didn't take offence at my initial flippant post - I was in a rush, and it was just a joke.

charliemama was just explaining her own experiences in the context of the thread (we're all dealing with our childrens' sleep troubles in different ways, and that's fine because we're a tolerant lot). She most definitely wasn't criticising you (I know she wouldn't anyway, she's too nice!).

I hope you keep posting and find the thread useful - I certainly have, it often feels like you're the only person who's suffering in this way so to come here and share my woes is really refreshing. Same goes to you dorasboots - the more the merrier

Thankyou Ginger, Dora and IARC. I like this thread because I feel safe here and I was a bit surprised to have been read in that way.

IARC: When I said cc was 'easy' I meant it was very quickly effective. I have never found it easy to hear any of my children cry. I think because DS1 was not feeding in the night his sleep problems stemmed from wrong sleep associations. He had to be taught to self settle and at 11 months he thankfully got the message quickly. Prior to that I had been up in the night for up to 2 hours patting him. That is why with Dd and DS2 I have been wary of patting them until they're asleep. (Ds2 screams louder if I pat him anyway!!)

FWIW I don't personally believe there are 'hard' or 'soft' parents. As most of you know I have been at rock bottom and started cc because my whole family was suffering. I was also starting to have trouble bonding with DS2. The guilt that comes with parenting is immense. I feel there is pressure to 'get it right' and I constantly doubt what I am doing and worry I have made the wrong choices. At the end of the day we can only try and somehow find a way that suits us and those around us. I have learnt since becoming a parent never to judge, that might be me one day.

Dora, stop lurking and get on in here

IARC how are things now? any better?

Me and DH always seem to be at loggerheads at the moment which isn't helping. We're trying to be patient with one another but after so much we eventually explode. Sick of him being ill and he's sick of being ill. Just wish it'd go away.

Yes Dora come join us.

I'm sorry to hear that your DH is still ill Ginger. I am a terrible nurse when DH is ill I get very frustrated and find it hard to be as sympathetic as I know I probably should. I think it stems from knowing that I don't get the luxury of being sick as the Dcs still want me to do loads for them even if daddy is there. They will actually hunt me down to ask for something when Dh is in the same room as them!!! In moments of exhaustion I have fantasised about getting ill enough to be hospitalised do I can have a rest!!!!

so not do dur!!

Obviously I would have to be hospitilised with something not requiring surgery/not painful/leaving me able to eat and drink etc

Ginger that you are having such a tough time. Is there anything we can do to help?