3 month old will only nap on me but sleeps ok at night

[Carbis]

Over the last couple of weeks, I’ve been trying to get my baby into a bit of a nap routine but he fights it every time. I’m quite happy to let him sleep on me but people have told my partner that this is a terrible thing to do. They don’t seem to offer any solutions though!

He used to sleep ok in his Moses basket during the day but now won’t sleep in it at all. He just lies there kicking his legs and smiling and after a while gets upset. So now I take him out in the sling in the morning and he’ll usually fall asleep at some point. At lunchtime, I take him up to our bedroom to feed him and try to put him down for a nap. Whenever I put him in the cot, he wakes up immediately and cries his little heart out. I’ve tried resettling him in the cot to no avail. After a few attempts of picking him up and putting him down, I’ll let him sleep on me otherwise he wouldn’t sleep at all. He sleeps fine in it at night time. The afternoon nap is the most hit and miss of all.

Am I better off letting him sleep on me for a bit and then putting him down, because at least that way he has had some rest or trying to put him down repeatedly at the start? I suppose what I’m really looking for is for someone to tell me that sleeping on me isn’t the end of the world.

@burritofan - it’s really interesting that the thing I’m worried about (feed to sleep) is what loads of people just do! I’ve just messaged a mate to ask her what she did...fed to sleep for 15 months. Maybe it’s loads more common then I thought!
It’s such a personal thing isn’t it? And whatever works for you!

.....why is it a terrible thing?

Obviously because it’s a rod for her own back and he’ll still be napping on her when he’s 19. Duh...

He will grow out of it. Very quickly. Don’t worry about it.

Btw I’d leave it for nursery to sort out . They are geniuses at getting kids to nap- how on earth do they get 15 toddlers to nap all at the same time? He will sleep completely independently at nursery no problem.

Another tip- Potty training is also much easier at nursery- Peer pressure and “we’re all going to the toilet” works far better than anything else.

@ELW85 It's funny to me that feed to sleep gets bad press when it's what babies were designed to do! When she was tiny and a colicky nightmare I was desperate to feed to sleep but she would just scream; the only thing that worked was DP putting her high on his shoulder and SPRINTING back and forth – they don't teach you that at NCT...

When DP puts her down for a nap he obviously can't feed to sleep, he walks with her in his arms instead. She's starting nursery next week and they've said they will cuddle to sleep. You don't have to force independent settling if your baby isn't ready.

@bluebluezoo @burritofan - I guess I just don’t know how to figure out when he will be ready for independent sleep! It’s a minefield!

And sorry for hijacking your post, OP!

No worries @ELW85, that’s what these forums are for 😊

His nighttime sleeping has gone out of the window now! Last night he woke 5 times and was awake for the day at 5am but in the end of just cuddled him to sleep until he woke again at 7. He is much quieter and less active in the mornings now. The poor little guy must be exhausted!

I’ve been persevering with the naps, yesterday he managed about 3 hours of daytime sleep which is unheard of. I got that through a combination of walking with the sling, bouncer, crib and Moses basket.

I used a dummy for a few minutes for the crib nap after spending 30 mins to get him to sleep by other means. A few minutes with the dummy then I took it out when he fell asleep.

@Carbis - that’s awesome progress in such a short space of time! Shame about night time but it’ll correct itself again.
DS has started sucking his thumb in the past couple of days so I’m hoping it’s the start of a self soothe capability...he’s still asleep on me as we speak though.
I really need to try harder with putting him down!!

It’s so hard to put them down! I think it’s ok to enjoy the cuddles but I’m just trying not to do it for every nap.

Every day is different, I’ve had to hold mine to sleep for both naps but have managed to put him down and for him to stay asleep.

@Carbis - good effort! DS has been really unsettled today but the aim was to try to get out of feeding to sleep this week. Next week I’ll try the put down and a bit of independent sleep from awake I think 😬

I thought I’d pop back on with an update in case anyone goes through something similar.

I think I’d been expecting too much in terms of routine because I had read that babies his age should have 3 naps a day, including a long one at lunch. I guess he just wasn’t / isn’t ready for that!

I’ve started using the Huckleberry app to time his naps and it’s a game changer. I’ve come round to the mindset that any sleep in the day time is a win. I’m less worried about the unattainable long nap in his crib at lunchtime and going for shorter naps through various means - sling / bouncer / Moses basket / crib for the time being.
He’ll have a nap about 90 mins after he wakes and then usually another 3 throughout the day. That doesn’t always work but I’ve found that by being more flexible, he is more well rested and happier. He is also (touch wood) sleeping better at night.

@Carbis - couldn’t agree more. There’s a lot of pressure on should be nap consolidating etc but that happens any time up to 5 months I think.

I’ve been working on naps today and knowing that LO has a feed to sleep association I’m trying to wean him off by setting a proper nap routine with white noise etc and then feed til calm but put in crib awake, pat shush to sleep. It’s worked so far today but if I’m honest I haven’t got a clue about how to stop the feed element and when the other associations will kick in, and then how to get rid of pat shush.

@FATEdestiny sorry to hassle you, but do you have any thoughts on my approach/if it’ll work?!

@ELW85 well done on the progress you are making. I’m doing similar but have swapped feeding for rocking when I can. I know rocking is still a big sleep association but it feels a step closer. I plan to move to just holding him, then shushing and holding his tummy, then gradually removing that too. It’s going to take weeks but I feel like we are making progress already which spurs me on.

@Carbis couldn’t agree more, I think to avoid tears it’ll be a longer transition but they’re so young that it’s best to do it over weeks than upset them.
DS still gets a bit upset when it’s just me holding him (instead of food) but I’m literally giving him a couple of sucks till calm, then in his crib, pat shush etc. I’m just hoping that over time, he’ll understand the routine of sleeping bag, white noise etc and won’t need the couple of sucks then can do less and less of the pat shush etc. It’s all progress though...right?! 😬

I’ve been working on naps today and knowing that LO has a feed to sleep association I’m trying to wean him off by setting a proper nap routine with white noise etc and then feed til calm but put in crib awake, pat shush to sleep. It’s worked so far today but if I’m honest I haven’t got a clue about how to stop the feed element and when the other associations will kick in, and then how to get rid of pat shush.

@FATEdestiny sorry to hassle you, but do you have any thoughts on my approach/if it’ll work?!

Sounds like an excellent, gentle plan to me and super progress.

I'm not sure what your expectations are in terms of how much time you're willing to take to achieve independent sleep from baby. The idea of gentle methods is that you don't keep the status quo, maintaining progress towards independent sleep, but with a long-term view. The faster you progress towards independent sleep, the more distress it's likely to be along the way.

Don't get into the mindset of "this works, so I'll carry on" (which means maintaining the status quo). Instead have an aim and make small steps towards that aim. How quickly you make those steps depends on your parenting style and the balance between wanting baby to sleep independently verses the level of crying and distress you will tolerate to get there.

The small steps are likely to be the same, but if you make a change before baby is content with the last one, then baby is likely to cry. But if you wait until baby is content with the last bit of withdrawal, then make progress to withdraw slightly more but make it only a small change, then you can do this without any distress.

To set some expectations, if you keep making tiny progress towards independent sleep but without going to fast to distress baby, you're likely to need to invest some time to being present to settle baby to sleep until around 12 months old. But with ever-reducing dependence on you so that after the first year (ish - depending on child development) you could expect to be able to put baby down and leave, without any tears.

Of course you can make progress much faster than this and no judgement from me if that would be better for your family, but your expectations need to be set that this would not be a no-crying journey to independent sleep.

Suggested steps @ELW85:

• Feeding to light sleep, holding in your arms until deep sleep, putting in cot
• Feeding to light sleep in arms, putting into cot and dummy/swaddle shush/pat into deep sleep whilst in cot.
• Feeding to light sleep, lift and wind to wake slightly, putting into cot and dummy/swaddle shush/pat into deep sleep whilst in cot.
• Feeding until sucking slows but not asleep, Lift to wind, so wake slightly, into cot to shush/pat to sleep
• Feed baby upon waking up (not when going to sleep) - this is an important step. Then when going to sleep, make it a top-up small feed of a few minutes. The idea being that it's not enough of a feed to put baby to sleep. Into cot when calm, in-cot settling
• At sleep time, follow pre-sleep routine ending with a cuddle in the quiet/dark for a few mins until calm, but not asleep. Once calm, into cot for in-cot settling. Be willing to lift and cuddle again until calm, then put down once calm (not asleep) and repeat
• Do pre-sleep routine and straight into cot for in-cot settling with pat/shush. Pick up and cuddle if upset, until calm, put back down and in-cot settle when calm.
• In the cot, stay silent (don't shush) when baby is not fussing. Also still your hand (but keep it on baby's body, just not moving) when baby is calm. If fussing, be willing to go up the steps until calm - so re-start patting. If that doesn't work restart shushing. If still not calm then lift to cuddle. The aim always that as soon as calm, go back down steps - so put back in cot, stop shushing, stop patting - but keep hand on baby and stay close until fully asleep.
• Over time, it will be less often you have to go up the steps. It may still happen every now and again that extra TLC is needed, but less and less frequently. The aim is so that most of the time you just (a) follow pre-sleep routine (which doesn't involve feeding), (b) put in cot with your hand on babys chest (c) keep your head close to baby's in the cot so that you can read each others signs.
• Next set of withdrawal is physical distance. So hand on baby in cot, but stood up rather than with face very close. Still stay until fully asleep. Still be willing to go up steps if baby is distressed, but go straight back down steps as soon as calm. So if baby cries, move closer say shush, if that works, withdraw back to standing. If it doesn't, start patting. If that works still hand, if not start patting and shushing while physically close face-to-face. And so on...
• Once you can stand by the bed with hand on baby to settle, start lifting your hand off when calm. So stay standing close and watching carefully. AS soon as any fussing, hand back on. Once calm, hand by your side. Stay until alseep. Be OK with going up/down steps as needed
• Staying until deeply asleep is important, so you can catch even the tiniest negative emotion from baby and settle quickly in the light sleep phase. But over time you'll less need to touch baby, just be close. Hand on chest when first put into cot, to settle. Then remove hand once settled and wait until asleep. Go up/down steps as needed, but always withdraw down a step once calm.
• Stand not face-on to cot as you wait until baby is in deep sleep, then sneak out very quietly.
• Stand not face-on and a step away from cot as you wait for baby to be asleep.
• Stand by the doorway as you wait for baby to go to sleep. Again through all this, go down steps if needed. So if upset, stand next to cot again, bend close to baby's face, hand on chest, shush/pat and so on. But every time, withdraw one step at a time once calm. So by the time baby is asleep, you are stood by the door waiting.
• Stand outside of door, but in view with door open.
• Stand outside of door put 'pop to do something' quickly every now and again, coming back each time. Stay until deep sleep.
• Close bedroom door but wait directly outside, open door and check the instant you near any sign so baby knows youre there. Up and down steps as needed, but end with you waiting outside a closed door and listening very carefully for any sound.
• Close bedroom door and hang around upstairs for 15 minutes, incase you are shouted-for by baby. Then finally...
• Do your bedtime routine, put into cot (standing up) fully awake so baby lies down themself and you leave and close door, and that's it.

Yey! You can get there. About a year (give or take) if you take it nice and slowly without any distress.

Again, can’t thank you enough for all of your help @FATEdestiny!
Couple of questions if that’s ok?

• DS is 13 weeks, I’m hoping to get this nailed by him being 7 months as he’ll be going to nursery; do you just suggest cutting some steps?
• given his age and the age I want to have this in place by, do you think I’ll have to start all over again when he goes in his own room?
• I’ve tried this on a night and am almost at the point of getting him to fall asleep on his own. Days are totally different. Will it matter if the day progress doesn’t match the night? Or if the routine is slightly different?
• am I aiming to pat shush etc until fully asleep or drowsy to give him the chance to fall asleep alone?

Sorry for the grilling!

Something I was told that really helps me is you don't you any teenagers napping on their parents or being rocked to sleep. So, I would do whatever you feel most comfortable doing now and cross the next bridge when you get to it as babies change their own mind and habits. A dummy is personal preference as that has the potential to cause problems with teeth if not used right, I didn't use one but have a little doll that my DD sometimes takes to bed with her.

Enjoy the cuddles, I miss them!

- DS is 13 weeks, I’m hoping to get this nailed by him being 7 months as he’ll be going to nursery; do you just suggest cutting some steps?

You don't need him fully independently sleeping ready for nursery. Nurseries fully expect to need to shush/pat (or whatever settling method used) their baby's to get them to sleep. It's what the staff in the baby room spent the majority of their day doing!

What you do want to have achieved by then is to separate feeding and sleeping. Because, while nursery staff are very experienced at getting babies to sleep, what they cant do is breastfeed baby to sleep.

- given his age and the age I want to have this in place by, do you think I’ll have to start all over again when he goes in his own room?

IMO best to get baby sleeping independently in their own cot before moving to own room. I would have the "big cot" in your bedroom to do this, so baby is used to it. I also wouldn't move to own room until night weaned and consistently sleeping through.

I'd wait until the stage where you dont need routinely need to touch baby to settle, before moving the cot to the nursery. And also when sleeping through (or you'll end up cosleeping by the back door when you're too knackered to deal with night wakes)

- I’ve tried this on a night and am almost at the point of getting him to fall asleep on his own. Days are totally different. Will it matter if the day progress doesn’t match the night? Or if the routine is slightly different?

Two different focuses for daytime and night time. Focus on in-cot settling at bedtime and night time, so that this is being learnt.

Daytime naps at this age are all about getting the most sleep possible. So you want baby to go to sleep as easily and possible, as regularly as possible (with short awake times) and also - important skill to learn - to learn to link sleep cycles and sleep for longer. To do this you need to be able to resettle baby back to sleep upon waking.

All of these are best done in something that moves, ie not the cot. I favour a baby bouncer, but a pram would work too.

The bouncer/pram allows you to get baby to sleep as effectively as possible but in an independent way (as opposed to a dependant way by sleeping in arms or a sling). It means you are immediately close-by to respond to baby first moving from deep to light sleep (before waking) and use movement to resettle baby back into a deep sleep.

Move to cot naps once naps lengthen and spread out. Once you're getting two 90 minute plus naps, then follow your night time sleep
routine and move daytime naps to the cot. Happens usually around 5-7 month old (and incidentally, nurseries will also be used to managing pram/pushchair naps)

Aside from anything else it's not advised to do upstairs cot naps under 6 months old due to room sharing SIDS recommendations.

- am I aiming to pat shush etc until fully asleep or drowsy to give him the chance to fall asleep alone?

Important point - you only shush or pat baby is fussy.

The moment baby is calm, still your hand so you are no longer patting (but keep your hand on baby for reassurance, if needed) and stay silent. When settled, just be there to respond if needed but don't actively do anything.

@FATEdestiny - thank you!

I find it really odd that he’s inconsistent with his settling acceptance; for example I’ve just walked with him to get him to sleep with some shush/pat, no food involved.
Other times he’ll cry, have 2 sucks on an empty bottle, be calm and then get patted to sleep.
I bought some dummies as I totally agree they’d be the easiest option but he is inconsistent at best at taking them.
I realise it’s probably me that’s doing something different but I’m struggling to identify it!
It might seem strange but he’s never slept in the pram and not the bouncer since he was tiny.
I spend my time in the same room as him anyway so I’d never leave our room (where the Snuzpod is) during his day naps.

Re: the difference between day and night routines, it sounds like it doesn’t matter if naps are achieved differently? What I don’t want is DS to not settle in cot at night because he doesn’t get settled there during the day, if you see what I mean?

There will be inconsistencies, babies aren't robots. You're on to a hide-to-nothing if you're constantly trying to figure out why. There are so many variables, just accept some sleeps will be easier, some will require more work, some will require loads of work.

Possible reasons are how well baby slept last night and the night before, is the timings and lengths of naps have been consistent (which you often cant help), if baby has had enough calories for that day, if baby is not feeling fully comfortable (too hot, too cold, illness, pain, nappy not feeling nice, wind, digestion, reflux...). There's loads of variables.

Just aim to be consistent in your "ladder" of steps you use to get him to sleep, depending on how much help he needs.

Fine to treat daytime and night time naps differently. As soon as you have more than one child, upstairs cot naps with an under 6 month old are impossible. Because when you have another child, you cannot hide upstairs with baby for all their (many) sleeps).

You're over thinking this aspect. Focus on as much sleep as possible in the daytime. To support your night time training, keep daytime naps independent (ie not on you). You can also actively encourage more independence from your daytime naps in something that moves, because you can put baby down fully awake and get him to go from fully awake to fully asleep without you (by using movement). This provides better independent sleep that being walked/rocked to sleep in your arms until drowsy then being put down. As with the premise of gradual withdrawal at bedtime, reduce the amount of movement to the minimum needed to keep baby settled when in the bouncer/pram.

@BabySleepTeacherUK - thanks again ❤️

@darlingsweetpea - I hear you! I just worry that I should be able to put him down awake and I’m not doing that at the moment.
At the very least I don’t want him upset at nursery because he’s only ever day napped on me. It’s so tough! I read something similar to what you’d written but I’m not sure if DS will just decide to sleep in his cot one day without a bit of guidance. It would be great if he did!!

Mine is 18 weeks. I let her nap on me when she needs it, not prepared for her to miss out on essential sleep because people say it's against the rules. So sick of people saying I'll be making a rod for my own back and all that shit. Follow your instincts you know what's best for your baby

Hello all, I thought I’d pop back on to say thank you all again for your words of encouragement. Looking back it was absolute madness to be worrying about that when he was so tiny! And the whole ‘rod for your own back’ thing was total nonsense. He’s the least clingy baby ever! I’d love it if my independent little guy would sleep on me now 😂

Thanks for the update @carbis . I'm going through the sleeping on me in the day phase with my 3 month old at the moment and I'm trying to just go with the flow. At what age were you able to self settle in the cot?

Ah it’s lovely, try to enjoy it 😊 I’m still in the room with him, sometimes rubbing his back or with my hand on his back. I’m completely fine with that as he’s happy and it doesn’t take long. It also doesn’t stop him from resettling on his own during naps or overnight.

The books and other people scared me into thinking he’d never be able to do that unless I left him in his room alone to go to sleep. It’s such a weight off to stop striving for perfection!

I’ve come to believe that everything is developmental and babies will all get there in their own time, it’s our job to be there for them while they do that. I also took my little one to a cranial osteopath when he was about 4 months old and he slept lots better after that (complicated pregnancy and needed a c-section so he needed some of that sorted out).