I'm not going to sleep train... am I crazy?

[MashNpeas]

I'm seriously considering shunning all sleep training methods.

And no I'm not a smug mum of a wonderful sleeper I just haven't come across one that I feel comfortable with.

Baby is nearly 5 months old, will either bf to sleep (for bedtime sleep) or will be rocked and walked around. Wakes up 3-4 times between 7-7am and will usually feed back to sleep in the night. Baby can't self soothe and relies on us both (DH or me - baby doesn't rely on bf) to get to sleep (both to start sleep and if wakes up from a nap)

Baby will tend to nap well if our day allows a longer nap from approx 9.30-11 and again from 2-4ish... sometimes with a very short catnap in car or pram too. Some days naps are a battle and lack of naps make bedtime hard work!!

My question (for those who've stuck if our this far) am I naive in thinking baby will grow out into being able to self soothe or am I going to be rocking a three year old in my arms?!

If I am naive what is the gentlest methods you've found (for my angel PFB whom I want to cuddle forever )

Can't help with any long-term advice but just wanted to say my 7m baby is exactly the same, right down to every detail, and I'm also not planning to sleep train!

I’ve never done any sleep training. My children go to bed around 7ish and go to sleep with minimal fuss.

The question isn’t will the child be self soothing at 3

But will they ever be able to self soothe....the answer is of course yes.

you are looking at your tiny infant and thinking a 3 year old is too big to be rocked in arms (they aren’t - sleepy 3 year olds aren’t much more capable of emotional regulation than sleepy 5 month olds) The answer is yes, you might still be helping your child to fall asleep when they are 3/5/10 years old - in different ways to babyhood, but helping them all the same. But also that yes, they will learn to do it themselves eventually, as we all do.

@ChanklyBore interesting points. Should I / shouldn't I sleep train? (Genuine question despite it sounding weird written down) none of my friends have babies so MN and google are my only sources of information so I'm keen on opinions :)

@TheNewYear my friends 9 month old has always been able to doze off on his own despite a very similar experience to my 5 month old - were your children always 'good' sleepers / settlers or dud they grow out of needing help?

@ShinySloth it does sound idyllic doesn't it, shunning 'training' lets hope we have a smooth transition!

I still snuggle my three year old to sleep. Takes all of 5-10 minutes and having had two before I know independence is easier to train into them when they're much older. Rocking is much shorter term as yes they get too heavy. But nothing to stop you snuggling them and making them feel safe. For me the solution was always a full size bed as early as possible so I could lie down with them and sneak out when they fell asleep. I don't plan on having any more dc but after 3 my motto is the less crying the better when they're v little. Whatever it takes for a peaceful night.

Chamkly sorry but I disagree with you.

I was never taught to go to sleep as a child. My mother told me stories, sang, co-slept, rocked cuddled etc and I could NEVER get to sleep by myself - no one taught me how and I don't think we had much of a bedtime routine. My poor DH was bewildered by me wanting him to tell me a story in bed when we first met. I'm almost 40 and still struggle to fall asleep at night (hence posting now).

I've sleep trained both of my dc who are now (mostly) able to fall asleep by themselves at a reasonable time. I also take time to teach them how to fall asleep by themselves eg explain some relaxation techniques as I believe if you don't learn as a child to fall asleep by yourself, it's much harder to develop that habit as an adult.

Keep doing what you're doing. If you reach a point where you want to change it, deal with it then. Don't worry about it. My experience was it took a while for mine to self soothe but they got there eventually and although some nights were frustrating (lying in the dark silently!) it worked for us and that's all that mattered xx

@SarahCarer snuggling to sleep sounds perfect and I'd do that endlessly... however baby is firmly attached to the standing up rock to sleep at the moment and my arms and back won't last too many more months!! Did you have to transition into the lay down snuggles from the stand up rock?!

Three DC, never sleep trained. Just helped each one fall asleep in the easiest way for them. No battles, no issues. All sleep through in their own beds. Go with your instincts and do whatever feels natural to you

Both of mine were terrible settlers until they were verbal enough to have it explained to them (around 2-2 1/2). They were bf or rocked to sleep up until then, or co-slept.

Once they had enough language we did some daytime pretend sleeping- a game of going to sleep, me leaving the room for 2 secs then coming back with delight & praise, gradually lengthening the time I was gone.

By 2 1/2 they had both reached the stage of story, kiss goodnight & go.

So yes it is possible!

We never did any sleep training and DS was the worst sleeper on earth until he was about 18 months. Then it got better all by itself and now that he's 2 he sleeps through. I really believe that sleeping through is developmental and kids will get there in their own time, but after months or years of broken sleep it's easy to despair. So do what's right for you, but your baby will get their on their own eventually.

I never sleep trained. You don’t have too.

I have 2 DC my dd slept like a dream within the first 7 weeks... my ds who is now 5 still likes me to lay beside him when he goes to sleep and he does sleep through the night now but he didn't until he was 4.

To save myself the stress, I chose to just do what was easy at the time and kept reminding myself that one day he will be 18 and I won't be able to get him out of bed.

Sleep training means many things. There are many methods. They are all aimed at babies but many people will say not at babies under 12 months. I wouldn’t tell you what to do.

By the time I was at the end of my tether, none of the sleep training suggestions were even possible, so I didn’t do any by default. My children sleep well and have no problems going to bed. But it did take years to get there. I have a teen now - they self settle. I mean it, they announce they are going to bed, give me a kiss and I don’t see them to morning. I have a reception age. That one doesn’t self settle. I have to enforce a bedtime, take them upstairs, brush and wash various parts, sit with them, read a story, kiss various proffered hands and feet, supply a drink and a favoured teddy, stroke the face and sing the goodnight song, be in earshot for call backs after goodnight is said. I am regularly on hand for middle of the night noises, bad dreams, pains, coughs - and yes I rock the child back to sleep or stroke the face until they go back to sleep.

I think there are too many shades of grey but that whatever you do you have to parent them at night as well as during the day.

Keep snuggling your baby, you’re doing fantastic. I never sleep trained my eldest and he sleeps like an absolute dream (10yo). I’m not sleep training my 9mo because he’s a baby, he needs me. He’s never done this life thing before and he will know that we’re here for him always.

The 10yo got into my bed a fair bit until he was 3ish then started sleeping perfectly and has done since.

I was a CIO baby and I’ve suffered from insomnia since practically birth, even with my mum giving me Phenegern.

Also The Beyond Sleep Training Project on Facebook is incredible for advice, support and facts I wish I’d found it sooner

Did you have to transition into the lay down snuggles from the stand up rock?! I didn't stand up and rock for long because my dc were big and heavy. We tried different methods. First dc we sleep trained with cc/cio which is a big regret and she is still an anoxious sleeper. Second dc was a dummy and snuggles and that helped a lot. She's out like a light now and loves her bed. Third dc was bf to sleep until 2 and then snuggled. I guess the transition from bf to snuggled may have been similar to rock to snuggle. He just cried a bit. Two nights of 20 minutes crying each night. Mind you he was older. I think the thing is that as long as you're snuggling them while they cry you know they're not fearful or un comforted even if they're crying. Because they are safe in your arms. I think at each stage I just did what wax easiest until it became uncomfortable and then we needed to make a change.

The gentle sleep book (Sarah Ockwell-Smith) gives a good overview of the evidence in favour of NOT sleep training, and what expectations to have due normal infant/toddler sleep.

We didn't - we did end up cosleeping though so depends on how comfortable you and DH are with that? My DH was v pro as it meant we got more sleep. Came to a natural end while still a toddler!

I didn’t sleep train either.

DS is 6. He woke for a feed several times through the night until he was about 3. He was fed to sleep at bed time until he was 3.

DD is 2. She woke every two hours until around 22 months. She stopped feeding to sleep at around a year (by herself).

Both sleep through the night now. And go to sleep by themselves with no cuddling or rocking.

Do what you are comfortable doing.

I’ve never sleep trained either of mine.
Dd (now 3) decided she was ready to go into her own bed at about 2.5, made the transition no bother, then stopped waking at all a couple of months after going in her room. She’s pretty reliably sleeping through.
DS is 2, and has started spending most nights in his own room, but is still fed and rocked to sleep, and wakes at least twice a night.
It’s not a major issue for me.
I figure he will sleep through when he’s ready.

I didn't sleep train either of mine. The 8yo slept through from 6weeks (8pm-7am) puts herself to bed and only ever needs us in the night if unwell.

The 4yo has never slept through the night, needs someone to stay with her to fall asleep and needs someone in the night when she wakes up 🤷‍♀️

Horses for courses, they all sleep through eventually and they all go to bed on their own eventually.

I suspect the previous poster who asked her DH to read her a bedtime story is in an extremely vanishing minority!

So the simple answer is sleep train or don't, do whatever suits you!

Lots of mixed responses thanks, I think I will stick to my instincts and carry on soothing baby to sleep in the easiest way for my baby :)