Sleep is for the Weak! we got too big?!!??!?!!??

[cruisemum1]

can you believe that?! we got too big?
we should surely get an award from Mumsnet?

Slim, lurve the piccies. I've tried adding some but it won't let me for some reason and that's on various occasions.

Amber, well done on the bf support. A friend of mine has just had a baby and while in hospital was told that she wasn't producing milk so to start supplementing with formula. I was a bit as think this is typical of the duff advice women are given at a very vulnerable time. You're doing a wonderful thing.

We go swimming too and it is guaranteed to be the only thing to make her sleep longer. She's exhausted. We do the birthlight swimming where they submerge them. I was petrified at first but the babies are amazing, never cry. We had our photo taken under water last week and it's brilliant. Looks like DD is waving at the camera.

Anyway, here's to some better nights for us all. Sleep tight

ginger, how did the interview go? whats the job for? and the hours?

Worst night ever here

Sleep at 8, awake at (deep breath) 8.30, 10.30, 11.30, 1.30, 3.30, then in bed with us and after that it's a bit hazy... I did get some rest after that but poor DH had DS' legs kicking in his back all night and didn't sleep a wink (he's back in bed now).

Really don't know where we went wrong or what to do next. Just feel exhausted and starting to dread night-times

Morning everyone - any good nights out there?

Meg
You must be knackered. It's terrible when you just don't know what to do next.

3x wakings for us - nothing out of the ordinary. Weird evening thou - spent 1.5 hours soothing LO at bedtime. Wasn't working, and I was starving, so put her down, to get some food. the cries escalate, I heartlessly shove a dummy at her and leave. What do you know - she slept the rest of the night?! This is what confuses we - she's never done well on being left to cry before. It's like I need to read her mind to know EXACTLY what required tonight, which is always dfferent from yesterday.

Slim - what an adorable little man!!

Does anyone think giving formula for bedtime feed might help, or is that just wishful thinking?

Also would it be a huge mistake to consider letting him sleep with a dummy??

meg - i formula feed anyway, so i don't know about that one. she does go a good 3.5-4 hours between feeds, but still wakes up anyway!

re the dummy. i find it both a blessing and a curse. it does really help her to calm down and suck herself into a state of sleepiness. sometimes, though, she's drifting off, the dummy falls out, and we're wide awake and back to square one.

well 10 months today and we woke every two hours

im slowly going insane

booby

I feel despair after two weeks of nightmare wakings, can't imagine how tired you must feel! {hugs}

Good job is is cute, cos he still isn't sleeping! Waking every 1.5 hours last night - we're all exhausted - big hugs to Meg who is probably feeling the same way.

On the bright side, his naps are getting better so am hoping for a gradual improvement. Might do the logging thing in NCSS and then repeat after 10 days. Otherwise I find it really hard to tell if he's improving or not!

Meg: I'm in NE London for the time being, though hoping to move later on in the year (we're still in a small flat and we have no space!)

DS that is

morning ladies and for the crap nights out there. if you get the chance, i'd recommend taking yourselves back to bed when the los are napping i know it doesnt solve anything, but its a good coping mechanism. we could start a mass sleep in

re. the formula = sleep theory, i was wondering myself as ds slept well and was ff and dd has been a dreadful sleeper and is bf. think its just the luck of the draw tho to be honest, and as cruise said, we just happen to have crap sleepers (her dd was a good sleeper, ds a rubbish one and both were bf).....have to add tho, she is a graduate of siftw as her little man now sleeping.
there is hope girls!

ginger, women are really given such dud advice, and it is such a vulnerable time. i was just lucky to have great advice from a doula who was also a BF counsellor, and i just politely ignored the midwife. well, actually every bit of advice the midwife gave, i would ring up the doula and ask her if it was right/ok to do that way.
tibs, the situation arose quite naturally, as i was at a BF drop in group on monday and a woman came who was the wife of someone i used to work with. anyway, i dropped around yesterday to try and help - i think the latching is getting better, though is tough times.

big sigh for everyone with horrid nights.

we seem to be on a predictable 3 waking routine now. wakes around 12.30 and 4 for food. and around 6 for no reason, but if left alone chatting, will mostly get bored and fall back a sleep after half an hour until around 8.

Meg, I've had no end of nights that in the past and then I've had fantastic nights where she's settled herself and woken once so I do think that when they're like that there is a reason for it. It's nothing we're doing. Teeth are generally to blame in this house but sometimes gas or something she's eaten seems to give her problems. I think the formula thing is a myth btw and as a dummy user I do sometimes wish I'd never introduced it because until about a month ago she couldn't really coordinate shoving it back in herself however it really settles her quickly and gives me some head space!!

Tibsy, job is for a press officer and i've told them that I'm only prepared to do 3 days so we'll see.

Slim and Booby for you.

Amber, I'm happy that it's getting better for you. You sound so much happier and together.

Our night was ok again. Woke as I was going to bed and so took her in with me and she slept until 5 woke for feed although I woke her with my fidgeting a couple of times but shushed her back. Then woke at 7 for the day. I do want to try and push that 5 oclock feed forward a bit though then I'll concentrate on getting her into her cot. Slowly slowly!! I on the other hand have turned into an insomniac. I was awake for probably 2 hours in the night, wide awake, mind whizzing with stuff and mega back ache. There's no pleasing some is there?

Unfortunately, am at work so no chance for a nap!

Amber: have prob asked before but what (if anything) did you do to improve things? I know you had a sleep nanny: what did she suggest?

And a general q: do you leave your LO's to settle themselves? DS still needs shushing/whispering/patting/rocking to sleep (though has graduated from bfing to sleep). He just cries if left. Should I try leaving him for a few minutes? Thing is he shows no sign of calming down if I leave the room...

Any ideas welcome!

hello all,

Booby, slim - big hugs - your nights sounds awful. only wish I had some advice to offer...

My LO is really grumpy today - must have inherited the gene on the maternal side. After last night's success, I tried leaving her to grizzle for her morning nap. turned out to be something of a mistake ...I'll never get the hang of delivering the goods. off to shut eyes before LO awakens in 30mins (you could almost set a clock by these micronaps). why did I stay up watching telly during her evening sleep instead of taking only chance of an early night I'm likely to get all week?

ginger - yeah feel so much happier with a bit of sleep!
slim, i can't be exactly sure what the night nanny did. he just started to sleep from the first night she came. i have always been pretty vigilant about trying to get LO to self settle. though now, i've had to reverse as the only time he'll eat properly is when he's going off for nap, or sleep in the evening. so i don't know what did it for us.
the night nanny did make me aware that i was rushing up to him quite quickly and she tried to make me listen to his cries more. so if he's just sort of whinging, i leave him be for a bit to see if he can sort himself out, if not then i try to help. but i'm not feeling very helpful these days, as there's not much i can do to help him to sleep if he won't feed.
i wish i knew exactly what happened when the night nanny came and that i could pass on some sound advice, but i'm just not exactly sure.

here's what i originally said after the night nanny came - no more enlightening i'm afraid!

"this has been the easiest few hundred quid the sleep nanny has ever earned. i don't know what she did - LO has just been sleeping better than ever before while she has been there. the only things i can think that might have made a difference:

1. made me more confident and LO has picked up on my determination/no fuss attitude
2. made me more conscious of working out a good nap routine (at home most of the time)
3. made me wait and listen to his crying before rushing in to his room, a lot of the time it is just general moaning/whinging and he can actually go backt o sleep if left."

ginger will keep fingers x'd for you

amber - that sounds fab, you must be proud of yourself, if not, you should be, i think that the type of support yuo get at the commencement of bfing can make or break it. good on you

slim - ive been working through the gradual retreat method but got 'stuck'. think it was my own reluctance to let dd cry even a little. i really do hate to hear her cry anyway, the past 4/5 nights, ive fed her til shes getting sleepy, but take her off before she falls asleep, give her a last cuddle and pop her into bed. i give her a kiss and say my goodnights. she usually starts crying as i leave the room, but i've perservered and sat just outside on the step has been taking a couple of mins, certainly no more than 5 and shes cried intermittently before falling asleep on her own i wouldnt leave her to cry if she was distressed, but after the initial protest cry, its been more along the lines of shouts of annoyance!
hth

yeah i do feel good about doing it, and glad that i've got the energy to do it now the nights are getting better.
sometimes if you can just genuinely say 'it does get better' to someone struggling, i think it can make a difference. i remember thinking a few weeks after LO was born, surely BF should be sorted by now. it really made a difference when someone said to me that it took her 2 months to really feel comfortable with BF.
i just passionately don't want women to give up in the early stages because they think it will always be like this.

Slim, if DD cries as soon as I put her down I don't leave and will hold her hand. If she is OK I will leave and go back if she cries. I probably leave her for about 1-2 mins depending on how frantic the crying is because in my experience the longer I leave it the harder it is to settle her. I might start doing what Tibsy is doing tho as she is getting that bit older and is understanding more what is happening.

I find the unsettled evenings worse in a way because I just want to sit down and have 5 mins to myself and get really annoyed when she is up and down every hour. Thakfully the last week has been good so feel for those of you that are struggling with that at the mo.

its tough ginger. i think i'm lucky in that LO is quite good at settling himself a lot of the time. if he doesn't fall asleep at the breast in the evening, then i put him down and he chatters and thumps his way to sleep. its just if he's really overtired that we run into trouble.

the irony with this whole breastfeeding malarkey, is that we still don't have it sorted. LO is so fussy. he refuses to eat a lot of the time, and i have to 'trick' him into eating. its ridiculous. i have to try not to take it personally sometimes that he rejects it so much!

one question, before your LO's started solids, do you know approx how often they were eating? i know its highly individual, but sometimes i have no idea what LO needs because eating is so low on his priorities. i try to feed him every 4 hours, more if i think he'll take it, that way i feel like he's getting enough. but i don't know, maybe he can go longer at 5 months, and i'm just forcing the issue. he does seem hungry a lot of the time, but unable to focus on the task of eating. (sorry, offtopic i know)

Amber, my lo was difficult to feed at that age until just recently. She has only just got the hang of solids and now we're doing two bf and two ff a day. I think when bf it's hard to get their attention sometimes. With a bottle I've found I can feed her facing the room and she drinks as doesn't need to turn her head then get distracted. I know you've had difficulty getting your ds to take a bottle / cup tho. I did but a bit of persistence has paid off. I just kept offering it. No pressure and eventally it worked. I had absolutely no structure until I started offering ff. FF on demand is just a nightmare as you throw so much away so we've got ourselves into a nice little routine now of 4 hrly milk and solids at 7.30, 12.30 and 5 (ish) (milk follow about 1-2 hrs after). To be honest it's more that it's evolved rather than anything I've done

thannks ginger, its so tricky. i just don't really want to faff around with expressing and bottles etc. i know he is hungry - he is gnawing on my arm as i type, just won't eat though!