Any advice for daytime naps?

[highlove]

I am going slightly nuts trying to get my four month old to sleep during the day.

I'm lucky she's a pretty good sleeper at night, generally off by 8pm though it can take an hour of feeding (EBF) and walking before I get her off. She had to go down asleep. She'll usually wake once or twice soon after and won't self-settle but will go off fairly easily when we go in. She feeds 2-3 times overnight, usually nodding off on the boob and easy to transfer to her crib by the bed. Up for the day around 8ish.

Daytimes - just a bloody nightmare. I try watching for cues, don't know if I'm missing them or what. She won't sleep for more than 25 mins in the crib, rarely longer in the buggy (and she won't always go off in the buggy). I might get longer out of her in the sling but not before a good few mins hysterical screaming first, and we have to be out the house so not always practical. I have to put her down asleep in the crib (night and day) and she can't ever self-settle, hence short naps. I spend sodding hours each day trying to get her off but if she's had two hours in total by bedtime then that's a miracle day. Today it took me near on three hours to achieve a 25 minute nap, her having been put down asleep five times but waking either instantly or within five minutes. Of course by the end she'd been awake almost five hours and was horrendously over-tired so just made it harder and harder.

I feel like a shit mum. My other mum friends talk about 60 or 90 minute naps which they achieve each day at least once and I just want to cry. To my shame it just makes me feel cross with her - I try incredibly hard not to let it show but she must pick up on it. I get nothing done and it's just like Groundhog Day trying to settle her and failing.

Any sdvice at all - I'm beyond the end of my tether.

An update: after a 40 minute walk, it would appear she now won't sleep in the sling either. Today's been a bad day and she's now massively overtired. I'm dreading bedtime. I've been a total bitch to my husband. And baby and I have had almost no playtime today because I've spent the whole bloody day trying to get her to sleep (and I've spent quite a lot if it in tears).

Magic cure please, anyone?

Hi! - we are officially the same person with the same naughty 4 month old baby!!!!!! I even refer to it as Groundhog Day! I TOTALLY understand - this is my life too, day in day out!
My baby has approx 2 x20 minute naps a day and that's it, I've busted my ass to get her to have longer, I've posted numerous threads on here and tried everything that was suggested and it made no difference, nothing, nada
I had days standing by the cot weeping and begging this tiny person to sleep (which obviously didn't work!)
It was sling me depressed and anxious, I got very irrational about it - like you I have 3 it 4 friends with babies that have a standard 2 hour nap in the morning and 2 hours in the afternoon - I don't need to tell you how envious I am!
Anyway........
I was told by my HV (who is brilliant and lovely) that some babies are just cat nappers, power nappers if you want - they get short sharp naps and are good to go. Completely crap for the mother but great for them! She has 8 kids (yes you read that correctly) and she said some were sleepers, some were nappers and just to go with the flow. She said it wasn't worth getting as anxious as I was about it and that it would likely all change in the coming months when she starts to get more mobile.
So that's it
I stopped stressing, crying, begging and wasting precious hours desperately trying to make this child sleep when it's never gonna work - she's a cat napper!
She will fall asleep in the car and I can sometimes move the seat to the chassis but often the click of the car door opening wakes her!
She will fall asleep being continuously pushed in the pushchair, but wakes as soon as you stop
She will fall asleep on the boob, and if I judge it right I can move her to the cot but then I only ever get 20 minutes so sometimes I just keep her one and watch another episode of daytime tv crap!

I know this isn't the magic answer you wanted, I desperately searched and tried EVERYTHING but like me I think you just gotta suck it up and get as much done in those 20inutes that you can. Dolly will be happy for an hour or more after a nap and I can do stuff then too. But I've just resigned myself to not having any free time in the day!

I hope that makes you feel better - I definately had a lot if days like yours, chin up missus, you're doing great!

Natalie xx

My 16 week old is almost exactly the same! Has always been. Put down asleep at night and held in my arms for naps as he'd just wake up almost instantly on being being transferred. His naps are 40 minutes to the second, he has only ever breastfed to sleep and he can only manage an hour and a half awake so he needs at least 4 sleeps a day and it totally do dominates my day.

I'd completely had enough of having a boiling hot 14 lb baby on top of me 4 times a day not being able to move a muscle in case I woke him (and actually I think he was just as hot and bothered sleeping in my arms anyway) so I went cold turkey about 2 weeks ago and started to put him in his bouncer for naps as it's not totally flat I could manoeuvre him in without stirring him too much and if I did I could gently boing him to rock him back off. Just before he stirs at the 38 minute mark I start to gently rock and this will sometimes ease him into the next sleep cycle. It doesn't always work though, or maybe I just time it wrong.

At night we've co-slept since 8 weeks but that was getting on my nerves too - he's getting big now and sleeps starfished and takes up half the bloody bed. We only have a standard double so DH and I were having to spoon in the other half while his lordship sprawled out across the other. It's too bloody hot for this and also he's started to roll so he needed to start sleeping in his cot.

His cot is a kiddycare compact cot (can't fit a regular sized one in our room) and has fixed sides. It's nigh on impossible to lift in in without disturbing him so over the last 3 nights I've had to gently lift him in and then we do a version of pick-up/put down until he drops off, settling with hand on tummy and a gentle shush.

I've started to put him down for his morning nap in the cot too and it's been successful the last 2 days. I tried a later nap and after an hour and half of PUPD I had a hysterical, sobbing overtired baby so I abandoned ship. But I will keep persevering.

Tonight I placed a sleeping DS down in his cot and of course his eyes pinged open on contact with the mattress and up kicked his legs. As he wasn't crying or fussing just out of curiosity so see what he'd do, I put my hand on his chest and just sat by him. It making eye contact. His two fingers went into his mouth (he's literally only just started to do this) and over the course of 10 minutes he sucked and sucked and his eyelids started to droop and bless him, he dropped off to sleep all by himself. I could have cried with pride.

So no real advice other than to say just try new tactics little by little and I truly believe that over time babies just start to "get it. But I understand how utterly draining it is!

Ha poppet I've also tried begging. That didn't work either.

Today has been a particularly bad day. But I think I do need to try a few new tricks bit-by-bit. Will try her in her bouncer tomorrow and see how that goes.

Any other magic techniques would be very gratefully received.

Not sure if any help at all but my ds is 10 weeks old and i do get good sleeps out of him but didn't always! He hated his moses basket and eventually the crib in our room so i ended up using a poddle pod with him sleeping on his side which he prefers, and is now also in his own room with a monitor and sleeps much better as i think we were keeping him awake just moving around etc! I'm trying to keep to routine and put him upstairs in his cot for his daytime naps too....so far so good!

I've also started loosely following advice from the blissful baby expert book about feeding/sleeping routines, some people have told me my ds will find his own routine but i've found the book really helpful and really recommend the 1 1/2 - 2 hour sleep rule, definitely worth a try but as ur hv said maybe just a cat napper!

My DS is nearly one and I hate to say it, but I get very excited if he manages one thirty minute sleep a day. However he does do around 12 hours at night. I tried everything but like the pp, we never had any time for fun stuff so I just gave up.
Don't worry too much about it, some babies are definitely cat nappers and when they do decide to bless you with two whole hours you'll be checking on them every ten minutes

Exact same situation here! I get 2 x 30 min naps a day. The first he will fall asleep on me and then go in his bouncer the 2nd he sleeps on me as he will wake and either play or get grouchy as soon as he goes down. On a night he goes to bed relatively well at 8 after bf, he is half awake half asleep but will settle himself. However come 1am he wakes and I tried shh pat pick up put down last night for an hr and nothing worked so in the end I bring him in to bed with me until he is completely asleep and put him back in his cot. He fed at 4.30 last night and typically doesn't go back in his cot after feed and is up from 6 or 6.30
Everyone else seems to have these amazing babies that either sleep through the night or nap during the day and I don't :( he used to wake every 3 hours on a night but would self settle and nap for longer during the day. Now we have terrible days but good nights! Xx

I'm another one in this position.

Co incidentally it was at 4 months old that it nearly tipped me over the edge.

She's now 10 months and I agree with pp that it's something you just have to suck up.

She would only sleep in the pram and at one point I was walking 5 miles a day , for weeks.

I am having a nice sit down now that she's having a nap today - today is a good day but yesterday wasn't a fucking nightmare

I think around 4-5 months babies develop a circadian rhythm-that is they find it easier to sleep at certain times of the day. Around this time ds would nap at 9am, 1pm, and 4pm, bed around 7 (On a good day) Getting him to nap outside these times used to be difficult! Before this he used to sleep on and off during the day.

I used to keep same routine with dd take her up to cot....close blinds and put her in Gro bag.... So bed was always in her cot....

I was a bit of a routine freak and used to work things around naps....

I have a cat-napper (2 actually), and nothing I do realty helps. I remember the sheer frustration the first time around though, I got so fed up of struggling through the day.

Second time around, I'm a lot more relaxed I've given up and as she sleeps well at night I just let her catnap, which works well as I would have to fit in naps around DD1 anyhow. DD2 is currently dozing next to me on the sofa, after an hour of eye rubbing and not letting me put her down. She naps in the car, buggy (if she goes in, another thread) and occasionally in her lunch. But even then I can't guarantee she'll fall asleep in the car etc, so if she gets to the evening with only 20 mins nap time in her I'm just mindful of putting her down on time or slightly earlier.

Please don't drive yourself crazy like I did! I wish I could wave a wand for you. The loss of downtime was a big shock to me and I still have days where I wish I could go sit by myself for 10 minutes, and I often despair at the state of the kitchen.

Just thought of something, this may not be popular but.. at 4 months I would sometimes put her down in her baby bouncer and put on waybuloo (soothing music) and dash around the house tidying up or making a brew. 20 (occasionally 40) mins of hands-off babytime, which is relaxing for baby too. However, they both sat from 5 months, so it was a short-lived reprieve.

Thanks all. Another nightmare day - achieved two shirt naps in the sling and that was it. Walked for about 30 mins with her in the buggy as well but she just got sleepy then cross then wide awake again. FFS. Ah well. On the plus side, I didn't get quite as wound up as yesterday - only cried once.

highlove you are definitely not a shit mum. Your mum friends are simply luckier, not better parents. I wish someone would have told me that just over a year ago, when my dd was just like yours.

It's probably no consolation right now but it will get easier. I think it was around 5 months when things started improving for us. Naps gradually became longer and she finally learnt to self settle. Before that I would feed her to sleep (and continue holding her otherwise she would wake) or I would walk her for bloody miles in the pram.

If it's any help to you, or anyone else reading this, here is what we did:

We had (and still have) blackout blinds, blackout curtains, pillow cases over the top of the curtain rail (I kid you not), white noise and soft classical music. We also introduced a soft teddy at around 6 or 7 months - not sure what the guidelines are about that though.

I would feed her in our bed and then just lie next to her until she was asleep, often a hand across her body soothed her. I found that being as boring as possible/pretending to be asleep worked best.
Sometimes it was almost instant, sometimes it took a few minutes and, yes, sometimes she became very distraught - when this happened I would cuddle her and then lie down with her again, sometimes re-feeding, sometimes not. Then when she was asleep I would sneak off.

It meant she slept on our bed for her naps and also from bedtime until dreamfeed, which was ok as she couldn't roll over then. I really think this helped her to self sooth and we then progressed to feeding lying down followed by moving straight to cot (we had to do this as she had learnt to roll).

I wasn't keen to try cc or cio as she usually wound herself up to being hysterical if we tried to leave her. Likewise PUPD used to make her mad. It took a few weeks but eventually we got to the point where I could feed her and put her straight in her cot. I honestly never ever thought that day would come.

Ahhh I remember the horror of naps and it wasn't so long ago. I found the baby whisperer useful - google pick up put down technique, but I recommend buying the book if you are going to use it. Also no cry nap solution book. Mine was a screamer at nap times and screamed for a while even with all that (seemed like it would go on for ever at the time). But got to the point of napping in cot twice a day for 1-1.5 hrs. Nearly broke both me and OH getting there but we really appreciate naps now!

Had to sort out reflux and tongue tie issues before he would nap lying down in the day though.

Just want to say I really empathise and there is hope but I so understand the horrible way it feels at the time!

This is the four month sleep regression surfacing - same happened to me and it nearly drove me nuts.

I downloaded Elizabeth Pantley's no cry nap solution and started following that and after a while it got better.

There was a point when he went from 2 to 1 nap a day later on that he would sleep for 3 hours just after lunch

So it does get better but use the book, I thought it was fab!

Another mum to a catnapped here too, Dc1 was a good napper so it's a shock this time round and harder as first DC is an exuberant 2 year old without volume control.

I really despair some days as I feel like I spend the whole day trying to get baby to sleep while sporadically shouting at toddler who goes 'exploring' while I am otherwise engaged.

I was about to start a thread entitled 'catnappers unite'.

God, this thread is wonderful. Another catnapper here. I really did think I was the only one. All this talk of 1.5 hour naps after an hour of activity time. Ha!
I was beginning to despair- lots of tears, mainly mine. So today I decided to stop worrying that she'd never nap properly and just go with it.
I just got the No Cry Sleep Solution and am working on a bedtime routine at the minute (still taking about 2 hours to BF her to sleep however) so letting the nap side of things slide even though it means the house is a tip. And I used to be so obsessive about cleaning!
Honestly though, today was better because I decided to just enjoy DD and ignore all the amazing sleepers I feel are surrounding me. Clearly we are not alone. Hand holding!

My girl is nearly 6 months and us exactly the same. I would say around 4 months I got really upset by it. I was the same as you and could get nothing done, but then one day I just decided to accept it. I just decided that's the way it is and so long as she's happy then that's fine. So now I judge that she sleeps approx 30 minutes roughly every 2 hours, depending on what's on in the day, so usually 3-4 naps a day. Not one of these is ever in her cot as when I attempt this then she had a 10 minute nap and is grumpy.

So, basically if I'm going out for a walk I give her a quick bf before I go and make sure she's full, I then pop her in the pram awake (if I try and do it asleep she usually wakes and gets annoyed) she will then usually fall asleep, but if not I play music from my phone. Yes, I sound like a crazy person with music coming out the pram, but she relaxes to a song I listened to when pregnant and I'll do whatever works to get her to sleep!

If I'm in the house I get comfy and put the bf pillow on my knee and feed away and just let her fall asleep and sit there with my feet up for half an hour.

It's not ideal, but accepting it was the best thing I've done for my sanity. Hope things get easier for you, whether that's more sleep or you just feel more content. I'm currently listening to above mentioned music as dd is having an unsettled night and keeps waking crying, hopefully this is the last wake up till the early hours cos I'm knackered!!

One thing that concerns me is that catnapping is a sign they can't settle back after one sleep cycle. At the moment my catnapper sleeps well at night because she is so exhausted from crap daytime sleep but when she gets less needy of sleep I am envisaging hellish nights of her waking every 40 minutes.

My DS is 20 months old now and sleeps for 2 hours after lunch BUT he catnapped for around the first 6 months of his life. It did drive me nuts and his over tiredness was exhausting. I didn't believe it when people said "it will get better" and even mentioned to my HV too - but it does get better. Nothing helpful to add really (I struggled to get him down in the day & often resorted to walks in his pram or car journeys) but it should get better soon.

In the meantime, hugs x

My ds is now 13 months and was just the same, ge has improved slightly.
I agree with all the other comments to not worry and stress about it and enjoy your time with her.
the morning nap is the most important, I always found that if we didnt get that then thw rest of the naps that day were difficult. I also found there was no way he would nap after 3:30 so didnt even try and he had an earlier bedtime.
What sleepy cue do ypu get? And how long after waking are they? My ds never really had any so I had to go by the clock and once it got to 1.5 hours after a nap or 1 hour after getting up in the morning I had to watch him very closely, as soon as he refused to make eye contact and/or had a distant stare he was ready. If I missed it and he started to yawn he was nearing the overtierd stage and it was hit and miss whether he went to sleep.
When you are at home how are you getting her to sleep? Feedong/rocking? At home ds wouldnt feed to sleep for naps and bedtime but would fall asleep on the boob in the night so I used white noise and rocked him swaddled which made transferring him to the cot so much easier, I would leave the white noise going while he was asleep and I tried wake to sleep a few times which worked sometimes but not all.
Can you share a nap with her, I would rock ds to sleep then then lay down with him and have a nap, I got some longer naps doing this even a 2.5 hour one once.

With respect to those saying don't worry/stress about it... It's hard when you have a constant overtired baby and not a second to yourself to do anything. Ever.

It's not even the time to myself that I need but time to do stuff with my toddler. We have had the odd day where she has slept for two or three consecutive hours and it's been soooo great as I have been able to play with other child and then focus on baby when she is awake and everyone then gets a bit of attention. Hey ho, hopefully it will change for all of us!