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Original poster

3am regular as clockwork.......

36 replies

SilverLining · 15/01/2006 09:26

Right, know this has no doubt been done before but I'm just about clinging on to my sanity by my fingertips! DD2 is 19 weeks - text book in the day and goes to sleep beautifully at 7pm. Wakes up about 11 for a feed which again takes perfectly and then goes back to sleep but no matter what day of the week or whatever the weather wakes up EVERY NIGHT between 2.45 and 3.15! She is not particularly crying but get noisier if we leave her. We've tried milk but shes not overly keen, she's on 3 meals a day (on recommendation of Paediatric Consultant) so I can't believe she is hungry but I am rapidly running out of ideas. We've spent the debt of a third world country on osteopaths, womb bears, different sleeping bags ......DH works away and I've got DD1 who is good as gold but is awake and raring to go at around 6.30am. last night we finally got her to sleep at 4.30 but she was awake again at 5.15 ..... If its something she wants/needs then we will gladly do it - I don't want to sound like one of these mums who want babies sleeping through from 2 weeks! Any suggestions welcome!

SL x

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hermykne · 15/01/2006 09:48

silverlining yu poor thing, how does her day go, when does she last nap, prior to bed at 7, and maybe she goes into too deep a sleep too quickly thus she wakes at 3, it may be a casw of getting her REM realigned, keep her up a little later maybe 15mins ...just a suggestion, the food thing might be uncomfortable in her intestine and she may have cramps thus indigestion, my ds did at a slightly older stage, this happened at the same time too for him. i know the PC is a docotr but sometimes i think their tummies cant take too much food. its just an idea.
how much food does she intake? how much/many milk feeds in the day?

Original poster
SilverLining · 15/01/2006 10:21

thanks Hermykne! Her sleeps are currently 9 - 10, 12.00 - 2.15 and maybe a little power nap from 3 - 3.30. She is sooooo tired I can only just keep her awake till 7. Foodwise she has some sloppy rice with pureed apple or pear at breakfast after her bottle which I'm lucky vif she will have 4 or 5oz. 11.00 ish she'll have another 4 or 5oz milk and 30mins or so after that some pureed carrot or sweet potato. After her sleep she'll have more milk but still not massively keen and then some mashed banana at tea time. 6oz at bedtime and 6 or even 7oz at 11ish so I thought she should be full!!

thanks for trying to help! SLxx

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hermykne · 15/01/2006 11:00

SL
i'd take the sweet potato out of her diet and just see, stick to the carrot. s/potato can be fibrous! just a.n idea!

hermykne · 15/01/2006 11:02

sl. i didnt see the banana there, please please take them out for awhile. do a few searches here and you'll see bananas can cause wee hiccups as a first food. use some tinned fruit instead if you cant get/or buy fresh, like mango, peaches etc must easier to digest.
banana is not kind to babies!

hermykne · 15/01/2006 11:03

and give banana AM not PM, pear much easy on digestion for the night!

Original poster
SilverLining · 15/01/2006 11:25

Thanks so much Hermykne - you feel like my personal saviour!!! will def take your advice about banana - that definitely makes sense as she is much more contented during the day and the only thing we could think of was tummy ache so will go for an easier to digest option.

I just feel so tired and a wimp for moaning - second time round I thought would be so much easier. DH seems so worried about me which makes more weepy and "on the edge"! His company are being v supportive (as they want him there and not here!!!) that they have offered to help with child care and offered to pay for a night nanny which I think we are going to take them up on just so I can sleep but I would much rather have an answer to the problem so I can deal with it myself!

Thanks again - I really appreicate you taking the time to try and help!

SL x

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poppiesinaline · 15/01/2006 11:34

SilverLining - read your thread and you could be me! although my DS is 9 months but doing the same. I even posted to MN this morning at 4.45 am to have a moan (he had been awake since 2.30 am!) Its horrible isn't it? I suppose at least it is not going to last forever.

Original poster
SilverLining · 15/01/2006 11:38

Ditto poppiesinaline - we could have the same child!!! I must admit that up till today I have kept saying "oh it won't last forever" and being quite jovial about the whole thing but its just hit me that I've had DH pretty much at home since before Chirstmas and he is away tomorrow until Friday night and I'm just dreading it!

Sure I can hold it together a bit longer .... and it won't last forever!

SL x

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mears · 15/01/2006 11:42

SilverLining - have you tried leaving her till she cries? It may be that you are intervening in her sleeping rhyth by lifting her just because she is noisy. Perhaps she should be in another room. If she is already in another room I would switch off babymonitor - the cause of poor sleeping in babies IMO.

Original poster
SilverLining · 15/01/2006 11:45

thanks Mears - we have been doing that but only for the last 3 nights. She doesn't cry persistantly, just shouts and wails. I'm a great believer in leaving them and did that with DD1 whenever that was a problem but this time it just doesn't seem to be happening - I guess 3 nights is still early days? We don't pick her up - just stroke her head and say Shhhhhhh! At least I'm doing the right thing!

thanks for the suggestion though!

SL x

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Original poster
SilverLining · 15/01/2006 11:46

PS - she was an unplanned home delivery and came out screaming - my lovely midwife told me then "You'll have problems with this one" and little did I know how right she was going to be ...... spooky!! SL x

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macb1702 · 15/01/2006 20:33

I have a 7.5mth old DS who has been doing the 3.30am waking thing for about a month. I tried everything, extra milk, cuddling, leaving to whinge.... went through all the ideas. I then did some reading up and found a forum on the baby whisperer website, saying that with babies who do this it might be worth trying them on their front. (If they have the head control)
They are less likely to stimulate themselves when they wake by kicking, looking around or playing with their hands etc. I tried this 4 nights ago and it has worked a dream. He settles better and has only stirred at around 5am, and then it usually only takes the dummy being replaced and he's gone again.
Not sure if this will help, but I was at the end of my tether, and was nervous about putting himn on his front, but he's soooo much happier.

Original poster
SilverLining · 16/01/2006 09:22

Thanks for this - its something we have thought of. DD2 is almost rolling over and does tend to reach over onto her side and goes to sleep that way so I think as soon as she is capable she will go off on her front.

Incidently last night, having gone for peaches rather than banana she was definitely better. Still a 3am wake up call but only had to stroke her head and she went off again for another hour! So although not great by other peoples standards a lot better for me! DH thought she had slept through - bless him!!!

We're having a day of bland food and will see what the night brings!!! Feeling a lot better and less fragile today though!

Thanks all - SL x

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vivie · 16/01/2006 20:55

silverlining, my ds2 was doing exactly the same kind of waking as yours, predictably between 1.30 and 3am and nothing we did or didn't do made any difference until we figured that it might be a 'partial night waking' - like hermykne suggested in her 1st post. It's a bit like sleep walking and the child isn't properly awake, and it is more likely to happen when the child is really really tired, like your dd seems to be. Ds2 was having a similar routine to yours at that age, and was knackered at 7pm. Putting him to bed at 6,30pm has made a huge difference - from waking and crying 5 nights a week before Xmas to only one disturbed night since New Year when we made the change. And he's sleeping later in the morning than he used to, 8am on Saturday! , so don't worry about pre-dawn starts. As they say, the more they sleep the more they sleep... good luck.

Original poster
SilverLining · 17/01/2006 09:46

Thanks Vivie - have to say feeling pretty rubbish today - DD1 keeps asking why am I crying!! I feel so pathetic! DD2 woke for a bottle last night at 10 and then went straight back to sleep until 2.30 and then was just moaning and groaning for the rest of the night. DH is away until Friday and I just feel so on my own .

So do you think I should put DD2 down earlier when she is really shattered and not try and keep her up? I must say I'm leaning towards that as it seems almost cruel to keep her awake for an extra 30 minutes when she is rubbing her eyes and beside herself with tiredness.

Bizzarely though this morning she did not want any milk at all - forcefully pushing the bottle away! I just don't think she likes milk!! Want to talk to our health visitors but they are mighty talented at making me feel like rubbish - particularly when I feel so fragile anyway! When I stopped breastfeeding (it was either that or I got locked up for insanity!) all they could say was "well its your decision"! Might just be strong and go and see what they say!

thanks for your support though!

SL x

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rummum · 17/01/2006 09:55

Do you think she could be cold, Does she keep the covers on?
Just a thought....

lucykate · 17/01/2006 10:05

haven't read whole thread so someone may have already suggested this. babies have sleep patterns the same as we do, ie sometimes during the night, they are in deep sleep, sometimes light sleep, she obviously comes into a light sleep at about 2.45am, enough to wake her up. the baby whisperer suggests in these cases to do something called 'wake to sleep'. i think the jist of it is you disrupt the sleeping pattern she's got into by deliberatly waking her up earlier, eg midnight, and settle her back off, results in her deep sleep and light sleep patterns being shifted around. it mentions this in the book, 'the baby whisperer solves all your problems' and goes more in depth into how to do it, hth!

Original poster
SilverLining · 17/01/2006 11:10

thanks rummum & lucykate - all advice very gratefully recieved! She's in a growbag and I've got one of those egg thermometer things so she is definitely not cold - I wish she was in a way, at least I could do something about it!!

A friend mentioned this baby whisper thing about waking them up earlier - how awake do they need to be? Just worried we'll all be up from 12 rather than 3!!!!

Will look to order the book right now...

SL x

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Original poster
SilverLining · 17/01/2006 11:10

thanks rummum & lucykate - all advice very gratefully recieved! She's in a growbag and I've got one of those egg thermometer things so she is definitely not cold - I wish she was in a way, at least I could do something about it!!

A friend mentioned this baby whisper thing about waking them up earlier - how awake do they need to be? Just worried we'll all be up from 12 rather than 3!!!!

Will look to order the book right now...

SL x

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Original poster
SilverLining · 17/01/2006 11:17

thanks so much that I've had to post it twice!!!!

SLx

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Ellieo · 17/01/2006 13:37

Silverlining - am watching this thread with interest, since I also posted about this a couple of weeks back. DS is nearly 7 months old and also has a habit of waking at around 3am. I have to say, since we've tried the controlled crying thing he's been a lot better. Some nights he'll wake up around 3am and as soon as I hear the first murmurings I head straight in, tuck him in, give him his cloth toy and say "it's OK, go back to sleep" (or words to that effect) and most of the time now he'll be asleep in around 2-3 mins WITHOUT crying. BUT, there are times when it takes around 2 hours and he DOES cry (heartbreaking), don't know why, and it's extremely frustrating, not to say tiring! Anyway, I'd be very interested to see how it goes with the Baby Whisperer thing, as if DS reverts back to form, I may have to give it a go!

Original poster
SilverLining · 17/01/2006 14:19

Thanks Ellieo - I am a great fan of CC and it worked a treat with DD1 but just not happening with DD2.

Having burst into tears in the playground decided to see my health visitor whos only suggestion was to try another visit to the cranial osteopath - helpful!

SL x

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vivie · 18/01/2006 14:17

silverlining, your dd2 sounds so like our ds2, CC didn't work with him either, because he didn't want anything in the night (milk, cuddles, dummy etc, too hot/cold) and after a bit he'd go back to sleep on his own (usually after 45mins - 1 hour but sometimes longer). We tried pu/pd, cc, leaving him completely, going in turning all the lights on and changing his nappy, and it did nothing to help. He still woke at the same time 4-5 nights a week. I thought it might have been something he was eating too, but could never decide what it might be.
Since having an earlier bedtime we have had 15 (count 'em, 15!) unbroken nights since he last woke (hope I'm not jinxing him!). I'm also trying to let him sleep longer after lunch even though it means we're always late for afternoon activities.
Really, try more daytime sleep and an earlier night. I'm sure it's what's working for us.

Good luck! vivie xx

Original poster
SilverLining · 18/01/2006 15:50

Vivie - thanks for the encouragement! Have done exactly what you said today - she's slept really well in her 2 naps and I'm going to be led by her tonight after her bath and see what happens. Last night she wasn't great but not too awful and DH is winging his way home as we speak as I think I worried him yesterday!

I'm still going to see what the osteopath can say on Friday but am definitely going down the "sleep breeds sleep" argument!

Long may your DS continue with the 15 and onwards!!! thanks again SL x

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vivie · 20/01/2006 14:34

silverlining, how's it going? Hope you're feeling better now your dh is home. How have the last couple of nights been?

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