The MN Mail Column - what we think, and what we plan to do next... part 2

[whataboutthisone]

Firstly, I am a regular but have created a new name for this.

My thoughts about what I know so far:

1. In a much earlier post there was a discussion about a change in T&Cs and whether they are valid or not. Several years ago I took a company to court for a breach of their T&Cs. Their argument was that they had changed T&Cs and my complaint was therefore no longer valid. However, the judge said that because I had not specifically been asked to accept the new T&Cs, I was entitled to rely on the ones I had accepted and therefore I won my case.

1. I choose to post on MN in the knowledge that the details I give are probably just obscure enough to anyone I may know in RL who also posts, so that what I say still effectively remains private. However, that doesn't mean that the same could be said of, for instance, my mother, who reads the DM (!) There is probably just enough about my circumstances that would enable her to put 2+2 together. I would like the option to choose whether or not I let my Mum ( or anyone else in RL) in on certain areas of my life, and there is a real possibility that this hack, has taken that choice away from me.

1. I have never ( and now will never) post asking for advice, but I will also be very careful about offering advice in the future. I, along with many others, occasionally use examples from my life to explain where I am coming from. If I continue to do that, as I said earlier, it is possible that some people would be able to work out who I am. Now, I am not so big-headed as to believe that any advice I offer is worth taking, however, there are many fantastic posters on here who do give amazing and insightful advice based on their own experiences. It would be a real shame if that was to stop because they, like me, do not want to share some of those experiences with the folk they are close to in RL. It would also be a real tragedy if others were prevented from asking for help for the same reasons.

I am very disappointed that any MNer would feel it is acceptable to violate the trust we place in each other on this forum. I do not know who she is. I do not want to know who she is. But I hope she is hanging her head in shame for breaching the trust that has been placed in her by everyone whose words she has stolen to make a few bucks!

Slightly off topic but for the conspiracy thorists out there - it's now 143 posts ...

Beanie, what is?

just funny posting style yesterday which looked a bit odd. in AIBU.

I agree, it looks a bit suspect, beanie

Hi all

Just a warning that today's pretty hectic, so if we miss some comments/appear absent we're not ignoring you. But to come back quickly on a couple of points.

1. The whole site should know about the DM.

This conversation and the previous one have been stickied at the top of active conversations all week. I know we're planning to discuss changes to T and C's - guess what - when everyone's back, but it's not as if at the moment we're hiding the DM discussion under the carpet.

1. "Hmm. I note that 'we will discuss what's going to happen when everyone's back from holidays' has turned into 'we think we can get DM to agree to this/that for the future'

Sorry if this came out the wrong way. What I was trying to say and am trying to do is mitigate the things that folks are worried about in the short term, for the next week or so until Justine and everyone else is back, not that this is a done deal and this is how it's going to be full stop.

Finally thanks to all those who have sent messages of support either on here (thanks KingCnut) or via email. We know to some of you it looks like we are evil plotters wilfully out to spoil everyone's Mumsnetting pleasure, and doing deals with every devil available, but we honestly aren't. We just want to all be in the same room (same country would be a start) before we make any decisions/ do anything that might have repercussions for the site. It's not that long to wait - everyone's back after the bank holiday - any chance you could just bear with us till then?

And in the meantime we will - as an interim measure - a) try and talk to the DM about assurances they won't use threads from before the column started and b) try and get a heads up on what the column will be about next week.

We might not be able to get through until Monday, but we will report back.

Sorry, seem to have lost ability to post in less than 1000 words. Thanks for reading this far.

Aitch, you may well be right about that - or they could have decided to use it as a case to show that they can take what they want from sites like this... who can say?

I still dislike what is going on, I just do have some sympathy for HQ IYSWIM

Anyone who has to deal with the DM has all my sympathy, and of course individually and personally MNHQ are all lovely lovely peeps who have established a wonderful site. Isn't the tricky bit when we have to discuss MN as an entity? How to negotiate that difference....nobody wants justine and carrie and everybody else there to have a hard time...but as an entity MN has to function separately from the individual.

IYSWIM.

beanieb, is there any rhyme or reason to the threads they are bumping do you think or is it just anything in AIBU? I wonder if that is the sort of column they are heading for "This weeks scrap on MN"...detailing all our best put downs and angry moments?

not sure KingC, some of the threads they have bumped are a few days old with no posts and no real reason to bump them other than to say 'yabu' or 'how did it go' etc.

the Cinema thread is actually a thread started by someone I know in RL so it jumped right out at me when it was bumped as I thought 'ooo that's a bit weird' thinking someone had started an identical thread. Though that one is bumped by someone else and then the person we are talking about has posted in it too.

it is just odd for example that this person has bumped a thread which is 5 days old and posted saying they love the thread or in another AIBU thread about the DM they have just bumped it with one word.

if that were the case, kingcanute, then they'd be in much the same position as they are now anyway so no harm no foul.

I don't think anyone thinks you are evil plotters Carrie, more that the situation has been handled a bit, well, half heartedly, as you are torn between not wanting to get into legal disputes/liking the free advertising vs protecting the interests of your members. And that MNHQ's half hearted actions may mean a precedent is set for anyone publishing stuff from here in future. What if the DM published an 'MN baby survival guide' in direct competition with your own books? It seems that MN threads belong to anyone who chooses to make money out of them now.

I agree with po, and aitch (splutter away aitch). I think that just one letter would have made the DM just not bother anymore, because they know that they are in very shady territory. Now they have tacit consent from MN (you have tacitly consented, Carrie, by entering into negotiations about what the next column will involve, you have accepted that there will be more columns so you now have zero prospect of stopping this) and they won't stop.

Whooooo-oooooooooh!!!!!

I think I would have had alot more sympathy with MNHQ if I didn't have to spend 2 days begging them to delete my old posts.

And I see there is no mention of what posters who want to delete old posts can expect from MNHQ

And I agree with the posters that are saying the DM issue is still a smoke screen for the real issue of who else is going to do this and do MN have any powers to stop it?

I have not posted on DM threads yet, and I assume that I am like many many MNetters. I have not posted anything on MN under my normal posting name that I would be upset to see in DM, Times, Guardian or any other paper.

I can understand that anyone posting personal details, or professional advice may feel wary about these details being printed in a national paper.

Tbh, I don't think that the articles so far have been interesting enough for the DM to make them a regular thing. If LH would use a thread that was controvesial and then actually write a bit about the opposing sides of the argument then it might be enough to catch my eye and my imagination.

As it is, the column reads like a school gate conversation.

I said... then she said.. then I said... and soandso said...

I don't think that many MNetters will leave over this, I hope not.

Oi - ghosty, behave

Did you dereg Bella? Did they delete any of your posts for you?

Affirmative to both questions.

Seems that MNHQ will delete for some people and not others.

Carrie, I understand what you are trying to do completely. Do you not understand though why people are saying that it is too late because you've given tacit agreement? That's all. Your mitigation is their tacit agreement.

conspiracy theory cont... The odd bumping of threads is up to 143 now, all 1 to 3 words for each post except an AIBU post about the DM

I agree that MNHQ are doing the best job they can on skeleton staff, but my worry/point is that although the DM has said that they won't dredge up old posts, they know (and LH knows as a Mumsnetter herself) that all you need to do is add to the post to once again make it come up in Active Convos.
The fact that LH has deregistered is irrelevant, as anyone from DM can register and bump the threads that tenuously fit with their headline that week.

If this column is going to go ahead, then MNHQ are really need to put some big, obvious warnings for Mumsnetters and insist on more input/editorial control before it goes to print..

(i haven't read all this so obv may be wrong)