Political threads, bullying and echo chambers

[TenLittleSweetWrappers]

I just wanted to clarify Mumsnet’s stance on this as it seems really ‘off’.

I’m a long time poster and not aware that I’ve had posts deleted before or done anything controversial.
A political thread came up in my feed so sort of ‘advertised’ to me by Mumsnet. So I had a look.
Lots of posters are on this political thread who know each other well and have similar political leanings. That’s fine, but there were posts supporting anti-immigration and pro posting flags on roundabouts. So I felt a need to challenge as I don’t share that political stance,

Cue the group of long time posters to jump on me, accuse me of goading, derailing, telling each other to ignore me, referring to me as an ‘it’ - or ‘crying to Mumsnet’ when I ask for clarification - and - as a group encouraging each other to post rock gifs each time I post. Any perceived ‘goading’ or ‘derailment’ by me was minuscule compared to the onslaught of animosity from the bullying group.

Mumsnet told me to stay off the thread and to discuss my political thoughts elsewhere.

I’m sorry, but I’ve never come across this on Mumsnet before? I thought threads were public and all are free to post?
It felt like echo chamber, and rather than address the bullying, gang-like behaviour - Mumsnet seems to be accepting it.

I won’t be posting on the thread anymore. But I’m really disappointed that Mumsnet doesn’t moderate these threads fairly or adds them to my feed when I’m not actually welcome to post there at all and they are only for people of a particular political persuasion.

Thanks everyone, as I suspected! OP has been rumbled.

A political thread came up in my feed so sort of ‘advertised’ to me by Mumsnet. So I had a look.
You’ve posted repeatedly and followed them across to the next thread to continue posting.

there were posts supporting anti-immigration and pro posting flags on roundabouts. So I felt a need to challenge as I don’t share that political stance
My (albeit brief) AS didn’t show you challenging anything about immigration or flags on roundabouts. You’re either misrepresenting your intentions in posting there, or this happened under a previous username (if you’ve name changed, how long have you been following and posting on these threads that you just happened across?)

Cue the group of long time posters to jump on me, accuse me of goading, derailing, telling each other to ignore me, referring to me as an ‘it’
They were referring to your behaviour as “it”. As in “it’s annoying when somebody keeps inserting themselves into a long-running thread to argue with posters who know each other”.

Mumsnet told me to stay off the thread and to discuss my political thoughts elsewhere.
This is exactly what you should do. I’m decidedly left-leaning, and all a quick look at those threads revealed was people across a political spectrum who are annoyed with this Labour government.

And constant posting! I guess they don’t have a day job…
You’re engaging in the behaviour you’re complaining about: trying to get people on side to mock those who you feel are “bullying” you. Just stay off their threads and leave them alone.

there were posts supporting anti-immigration and pro posting flags on roundabouts. So I felt a need to challenge as I don’t share that political stance
My (albeit brief) AS didn’t show you challenging anything about immigration or flags on roundabouts. You’re either misrepresenting your intentions in posting there, or this happened under a previous username (if you’ve name changed, how long have you been following and posting on these threads that you just happened across?)

They didn't challenge under their old username either.

I wouldn't have any common ground with people on the threads in question, so I stay off them. It's just the polite thing to do. It's rude to insert yourself into a group of like minded people and start challenging them. There are plenty of generic threads with wide ranging viewpoints where you can do that.

You cannot name change on a thread you've already engaged in.

I've seen exactly that in the television section. It's awful when a discussion descends into chatter, as it usually does, and becomes personal derailing and off topic trivia. One self appointed boss controls the thread, on occasion even stating that only certain sorts of comments are welcome; anyone new (not part of the usual crowd) who enters the thread and doesn't toe the approved line is rounded on and hounded out.

@TenLittleSweetWrappers Mnet is full of robust debate threads. Thankfully it also makes room for more chilled threads where posters hang out with like minded people.

It's a breach of Mnet etiquette to crash such a thread.

I don’t think that is what that poster is saying, they are saying that on each thread the OP name changes and then claims to be a new poster when they are anything but.

Ok. Well clearly all the posters have come from there to bully me here!

I’m going to close my account with Mumsnet now.

It’s become a place for bullies.

Or, you know, you could be the one in the wrong? Maybe take some time for personal reflection?

And constant posting! I guess they don’t have a day job…
And this comment is just absolutely fucking nasty of you.

That YouTube has nothing particularly insightful to say and just some random dude amusing himself whilst driving so why worry about it?

I do, however, agree that the left is most definitely demonstrating an unfortunate lack of critical thinking these days. Too much group think / wrapping up all ‘left’ causes into one left perspective and not enough informed understanding and unpacking of individual issues.

This is extremely worrying as we desperately need effective leadership from both right and left.

Both need each other for checks and balances, but Brexit threw the political landscape into chaos and it’s never recovered with Johnson kicking out the intelligent Tory MPs, businesses struggling to do business with our biggest trad partner and Starmer making v bad choices for his cabinet. Reeves being the worst choice.

So people who don't agree with you are "bullying" you?

You don't seem to be engaging with the points raised at all. Maybe Mumsnet isn't the place for you.

OK thanks bye.

ETA: Flouncers' corner is >>>> that way.

I came in just after the Moldies.

Then there were the Wolefs, & Shiney’s crowd, & later on the insanity that was the Thighs…

Good times.

I'm sorry you feel ganged up on and bullied @TenLittleSweetWrappers It's not nice to feel like that, and it can appear - when many people are disagreeing with you, don't like your opinions, and start ignoring you - that you're being bullied.

However, after going through the thread in question, I don't think it was the case on this occasion, I think people were just getting annoyed. I don't think calling people flag shaggers is particularly nice, and it raises my hackles when someone says this, just because someone isn't left wing, and may like to fly an England flag. So that would have got my back up if I'd been on the thread. (Although I do agree painting them all over town/on traffic islands etc is a bit ludicrous!)

As has been said, it's poor form to hop on a thread (for example) where people are saying how it would be a good thing if Nigel Farage was Prime Minister, and start attacking people, accusing them of being thick, racist, flag shaggers etc. Or to go onto a thread about being an atheist, and tell people they're wrong and stupid to not believe in God. Or to go onto the childfree board, and tell posters they won't know love until they've had a child, and they'll 'change their mind eventually.' Or to go onto the Christian board and tell people they're daft for believing in God, and call God the sky fairy and so on...

Even if you don't share the views, it's pretty rude to plop onto a thread and start being combative with the posters on there.

I'm guessing MN didn't tell you to stop posting on the thread. More like 'feel free to hide the thread.' I doubt they would ever tell you to stop posting.

Also, I didn't see people telling others to ignore you, just someone saying 'posters are free to not engage with any given poster.'

As I say, I'm sorry you feel victimised, and I hate pile-ons, (and some posters did have a go at you,) but I think you're in the wrong here, and most of the posters were just being defensive, and actually had some valid points, as you were being quite argumentative. No need to leave the site though. Have a break for a few days and then come back...

Would you be equally surprised if those people then told you to fuck off, ignored you and carried on with whatever it is they were doing though?

I'm not saying they're right, just that it's a bit naïve of you to think you can elbow into a group to declare your completely opposing views and not receive backlash for it.

Do you not think though that if you have people talking about expensive handbags then if someone suggests giving money to charity instead one of them might think 'You know what, I think she's right, maybe I should give something to charity?'.

Or if you have people talking about Christmas in November then if someone suggests life would be easier for us all if we didn't have 2 months preparing for Christmas one of them might think 'I not going to be so obsessed by Christmas'.

A forum isn't a forum if you don't have different opinions. It isn't free speech to feel that you can't contradict somebody. Threads can't be 'derailed' just because it goes a different way from what you intended. If you don't like what someone is saying you can ignore them but even better if you think what they are saying is incorrect then you can tell them why you think that.

I think reading the room is always a good idea, ie reading at least all the OP’s posts on a thread before commenting.

It’s very annoying when a parent plonks onto a childfree thread to tell us all what they think we’re missing, and if someone came into the long-running chat threads in the Litter Tray to tell us all that they hated cats, I think it would be entirely reasonable to give them very short shrift.

I agree I'm quite happy to post on generic threads that I hate Christmas but wouldn't seek out threads where people were asking for advice on Christmas menus or presents to do it.

There are some vile posters on MN, and yes, there are sometimes group pile-ons. I have been the target of petty, bullying posts myself on occasion.

But the thing about MN is that you are always free to just walk away. You aren't under any obligation to keep posting on a thread. Just scroll on by and leave the children to play in the playground. You can even name change if you want to.

It's an Internet forum. These people are not your friends or family. It doesn't really matter what they think. Don't take things too much to heart!

Hi OP. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Just to clarify - on Mumsnet, threads are public and all users are welcome to contribute but everyone is expected to follow our guidelines.

When we suggested discussing your political thoughts elsewhere, it wasn’t to exclude you, it was because continuing on that thread in the way you were had become more about escalation than debate.

We also want to be clear that our moderation applies to everyone equally. We ask that all members, new or long-standing, follow the same rules and we do act when posts cross the line. Repeatedly returning to challenge others, or using new usernames to continue an argument, doesn’t change the guidance.

Mumsnet works best when everyone contributes constructively, and we do sometimes encourage reflection on whether posting is serving that purpose.

You were subjected to a disgusting pile on a couple of days ago.

You missed my point entirely - OP is saying "she's never seen a thread like this".

My response is that most threads are like this and it's impossible to be a long term poster without seeing such threads. False naivety, why?

NB. Re handback and charity - why do you think people who buy expensive handbags don't contribute? and even if not, why do you think such post will make them change their mind re handbag, not just irritate and put them off charities completely?

Indeed! And I exercised my choice to walk away from that particular thread because I felt that certain posters were just picking a fight and not actually wanting to engage in good faith. We all have that choice.

It's very easy to get sucked in and feel like you have to respond, but we are all grown ups - even if some don't act like it! It is sometimes quite freeing to realise that we don't actually owe anyone a response, and even less so if they are behaving like a playground bully.