Mumsnet undermining breastfeeding again.

[Redebs]

Just read the Mumsnet article on caring for newborn babies. It's sponsored by a bottle manufacturer.

Much of it is misinformation that will seriously interfere with mothers' success with breastfeeding. For example trying to get a feeding routine for a two month old baby. This is totally against normal practice for on demand breastfeeding.

Anyone aiming for regular naps will be seriously frustrated and will think there is something wrong with them and their baby. Night feeding is treated as if it's a massive burden that should be shared by using a bottle.The massively negative impact of inaccurate information and expectations is aimed at discouraging breastfeeding.

There's a 'helpful' link to another article on 'combination feeding' aka introducing formula, along with references to a whole lot of bottle feeding products you should buy.

The WHO condemns companies that use misinformation and pressure on mothers not to breastfeed. While it may be subtly disguised, that is exactly what articles like this are doing.

And for money.

I agree with your entire OP.

My god, this went nuts over night. Some of the comments about extended breastfeeding are beyond belief.

I have a question that I've not seen answered yet.

Setting aside whether to formula feed or not (not important to this)

Is it ok for the formula manufacturers to put profits above the health of women and children?

To give context, companies like Nestle have and continue to promote formula to groups of mothers who haven't the means to continue to do it safely and who do have the means to breastfeed. This has resulted in deaths of babies. Is this ok?

Is it ok for formula companies to sponsor the only education doctors get about cows milk protein allergy (CMPA)? Is it ok that this education tells women to stop breastfeeding and use a cows milk based product that they create instead? (I'm a CMPA mum) especially when there is no evidence to suggest cows milk can enter breastmilk?

@Twizbe what does any of that have to do with anyone’s decision or lack of choice to formula feed?

Do you research the ethics of the company who manufacture every item you buy? Do you buy your clothes from countries where women and child work for slave wages and in unsafe conditions often causing their deaths? Do you assess each pharmaceutical company when you buy a medicinal product and who and what they sponsor in their research? Do you buy makeup that is tested on animals? Do you buy food that is imported from countries (such as avocados) where it was native peoples core source of food causing hardship and starvation in those countries? Or you only get bothered by the ethics of capitalism when it’s to do with breastfeeding?

Yes it is ok for the formula companies to advertise their formula and those that then wish to buy it can do so. It’s not ‘above the babies health’ as it’s not bad for them. You don’t think formula feeders want good health for their children? Here we go again! It’s not poison.

What a great example of whataboutery! It could go in the dictionary.

Exactly

“Is it ok for the formula manufacturers to put profits above the health of women and children?”
formula isn’t bad for their health and even if you believe it less superior that breast milk, are you that horrible to go out of your way to say that to other women who use it (for a variety of reasons)? Hey new mum I think you should know that you’re using something less perfect than I’m using so you clearly care less about the health of your baby whilst I’m the best mum in the world-just wanted to make you feel really bad about that ok’. You’re not a nice person. For FF it’s also not bad stuff at all my kids are a bit older and the FF ones are healthier than the bf ones ironically.

100% agree with your OP. People who don’t see it need to take a course on marketing and learn the highly manipulative strategies companies use to get around legislation. Informative and helpful article it is not.

I’m happy that we don’t allow promotion of powdered milk from a herd animal, intended for a huge calf, to insinuate that it’s the same or superior to the milk human women make for human babies. But there’s a lot of money in convincing women that they’ll have more independence, be a better mother and get more rest and sleep.

I’ve no problem if someone chooses to formula feed for whatever reason. But I do take issue with the companies that pedal it and do take issue with this idea it’s equal. I sometimes forward face my 18 month old in the car because he’s happier, it’s easier. I’m aware it’s not a great idea and I own that. But I make a choice that it’s worth doing for those short periods for the benefits it brings. I wish these debates always went like that. Breastfeeding is superior. Giving a 3.5kg baby powdered milk intended for a 45kg herbivore herd animal isn’t great and should never be persuaded. But sometimes it’s for the greater good.

Also ‘the health of women’ mental health wise formulas a life saver who majority and physical health wise and apart from the 0.5% breast cancer stat that has various caveats attached anyway there’s no benefit. Think they are intelligent enough to make their own decisions and not have others pick them apart.

Ok I'll rephrase the question.

Is it ok for the companies to persuade women to formula feed when they don't have the literacy to read the instructions, the clean water to make or sterilise the bottles or the money to actually buy the product? Especially when they were breastfeeding. It is practices like this that have led to the deaths of babies because the mothers could not formula feed safely. The companies persuaded them despite knowing full well they didn't have the means to do it safely.

Is that ok?

That that you're all avoiding the questions or misunderstanding it.

In the UK we have the literacy, the water and the money. Formula here is a safe way of feeding baby. We are in a lovely ivory tower in that respect.

Not this shit again.
People how about you just feed your kids however you want to feed them.

For what it's worth I've just read the article and it does not in any way discourage breastfeeding, it seems quite inclusive to both types of feeding actually.

FGS. Look up the Nestle formula scandal and educate yourself. You sound so ill informed.

Advertising isn’t pedalling. With my second bf was ‘peddled’ to me constantly even though after bf my first I knew I didn’t want to bf ever again-and I actively chose formula-and I’m SO glad I did it was great and did no harm (17 year old not just survived but excelled is off to Oxford uni this sept and has incredible immunity fyi). The sugar they eat at all the parties in junior school will un do all your hard work whatever you choose fear not. Mums if babies reading this you’re doing great regardless of how you’re getting fuel into them so well done and it’s of zero significance which method you choose. Do what works for you and ignore everyone else. You won’t remember this Tiny phase one day and when you look at a prom room full of teenagers one day good luck trying to pick out the bf ones 😀😅😂

My children are living proof I don’t need stats. Look up stats on mental health of women who get obsessed to bf then can’t. Again: imagine how you would feel as a young vulnerable mum reading what you say. Maybe be a nicer person and crack on doing whatever you do and leave them alone. People can do their own research if they want. Assume your kids will never eat haribo:/

The OP says undermining, not discouraging. They are very different things.

A bottle company representative advising expressing and feeding from a bottle is undermining breastfeeding as it is not as good at stimulating supply etc. Thus undermining successful breastfeeding.

an article sponsored by a bottle manufacturer...? There is no profit in breastfeeding.

I don't care how people end up feeding their babies, what is important is how they got to that choice.

Exactly. They just saw it as an opening to make ff mums feel dreadful based on nothing other than the fact they themselves have been able to/wanted to bf. I don’t understand why anyone would do that.

@SoupDragon

But it's not undermining..it says once the mother has gotten to grips with BF they can express to have a break before bed.
It doesn't say to express all day.
People are just looking for something to be offended about.

Your children are living proof - sorry, I assumed you were in the UK, I didn't realise you were in a developing country without access to clean water or means of sterilisation. My bad

@Prochoice11 so it is ok to do what they did and are still doing? Yes?

To the vulnerable mother I say, feed your baby how you want to / need to.

We live in a country with clean water, literacy, free healthcare and comparative wealth. What happened to those families is not going to happen to you. Don't think though that formula manufacturers are your friends or care about how you feed your baby either. They care about your £. Look for evidenced based information such as NHS not sponsored content.

Yes in the uk. My children are living proof you can be FF and excel in health and life as a young adult. So I do not agree formula is bad. Your attitude however needs work.

Yes I think they are fine to advertise it

Half of the ebf brigade will have had the COVid vaccine that’s the funniest thing

Right, in the UK. When that poster said formula companies put profit above the health of babies they were talking about what happened in developing countries.

Wet nursing, milk from other animals eg goat or cow, 'pap' were all used. Obviously we know that those aren't suitable now but at the time people had no choice of BFing wasn't working out - either the baby died or had to be fed something unsuitable in the hope they'd survive long enough to get onto solid food.

Thank goodness for formula! It's funny how the lives saved by formula never get mentioned but the, yes reprehensible, behaviour of Nestle decades ago always gets brought up.

@Twizbe you ignored my question which are just as relevant as yours. Why do you only care about the ethics of businesses when they relate to breastfeeding? Also interested how you know ALL women in these countries can and were breastfeeding without issue?