Anti-Religious Trolling On Mumsnet

[DioneTheDiabolist]

I get that not everyone is religious and that some people are very anti-religious (some with good reasons).

But some MNetters are religious, others are simply curious. So how come so many threads are allowed to be derailed by anti-religious trolls? Today a thread about Good Friday was deleted because a troll came on. FFS, it's Easter! Threads about Islam are regularly derailed by Islamophobes. On a thread seeking information on Judaism in the Philosophy & Religion topic, a troll has posted LMFAO. Ok, serious question, why does the Jewish God make all men wear a funny beards? She continues venting for a few posts before eventually exiting the thread saying that she is on drugs because It's Easter, party time.

She is a MN regular, like most of the anti-religious trolls here. I have reported her posts but they still stand.

Trolls are not interested in knowing what other people think or believe. They have no desire to discuss the point of actual threads and rarely start threads of their own regarding their issues with religion or belief. They just derail threads in the hope of driving all talk of religion and different beliefs off MN. And they are succeeding.

Why are MNHQ allowing this to happen? Deleting threads instead of dealing with posters? Allowing blatant anti-religious trolling to derail threads that people may find supportive or informative? Is MN a religion free zone? Because if it is, that's ok. I just think that religious posters should be told. Then they can go elsewhere if they wish to discuss their beliefs.

capsium I accept that is your view but it is not one I share.

My personal values mean that I cannot possibility respect beliefs than encompass institutional racism, homophobia, control, abuse of power or intolerance.

Would you not challenge someone who expressed racist or homophobic views, how can you treat such beliefs with any shred of respect?

If someone said the Department of Transport wanted people to undertake on a motorway it would be entirely fair for someone to refer them to the current edition of the Highway Code and ask them how they came about their belief. It would be silly for them to get offended by them bringing up the Highway Code.

Well silver birch if you don't share the view of those that do have faith why are you even commenting, can you not just ignore the thread instead of posting what you have.
The equivalent is if a practicing Christian came onto a thread about Christians derailing threads about atheism and listing the reasons why they don't agree with your views. It is rude, irrelevant and is not what the theme of the thread is about. If you don't 'condone' the bible that's up to you- start a thread about it if you feel that strongly but don't derail other threads with your anti- religious talk just to provoke something.

Frankly calling their God a Sky Fairy is a very minor act in comparison with the Anglican Church's attitude and promotion of the persecution of gay people in parts of Africa. Respect and tolerance is a two-way street.

Right. So it's ok to be rude to people on an internet forum because of the actions of other people thousands of miles away. Can you not see any issues with that?

why are you even commenting,

I like to have flaws and contradictions in my thinking pointed out. If you feel someone is in error when they point something out then either ignore or explain.

Personally I'm also interested in how Christians tolerate the contradictions as helps me to understand my own history.

Would you not challenge someone who expressed racist or homophobic views, how can you treat such beliefs with any shred of respect?

I would, respectfully as I could. However people are not always in a place where challenging their offensive views will do any good. Sometimes something else which is wrong within them is manifesting in being offensive - so it pays to tread carefully IMO

If you don't 'condone' the bible that's up to you

But it's what you think that I'm interested in.

If someone said the Department of Transport wanted people to undertake on a motorway it would be entirely fair for someone to refer them to the current edition of the Highway Code and ask them how they came about their belief. It would be silly for them to get offended by them bringing up the Highway Code.

The Bible is not simply a rule book though. Yes, there are laws contained within the narrative but it largely consists of narrative, poetry and song. Church tradition, contextual reading, translation issues and reason all are taken into account when interpreting it.

all are taken into account when interpreting it.

So your thoughts on a loving god ordering the Israelites to kill babies?

If your interested in what I think then I'll tell you. If you go onto a thread and realise that it's regarding the treatment of thread about a particular faith group the by all means comment on how opinions can be voiced better or ideas not slated in a derogatory manner but don't spew out intolerant view about that faiths holy book or central ethos as that's not relevant to the thread in question and is just using the thread as a platform to spout out hateful and nasty comments.

^ and, head if talking about aspects of worship, for example - arguing interpretations of sections of the Bible which do not deal with worship is off point.

The point of this thread is derailment of religious threads not the validity of different methods of Bible interpretation. More derailment.

Capsium!?! You just posted to me about interpretation!? Isn't that derailment???

Well silver birch if you don't share the view of those that do have faith why are you even commenting, can you not just ignore the thread instead of posting what you have.

I usually do. However the threads about 3pm were on chat and this one is on Site Stuff.

The basic premise on this thread is that challenging (in a 'disrespectful' way) religious beliefs should be subject to a new Rule on Mums-net. I feel I have the right to express my view that religious beliefs are no different to any personal stance or value of a poster.

There is simply no need for a special rule that protects the threads of people who have a faith from specific arses who have an agenda.

hateful and nasty comments.

Have there been any on here?
Are you referring to my mentioning the OT violence? So it's nasty and hateful to point out nasty and hateful bible versus too?

Underneath it all I know none of you are in anyway comfortable with those versus because you're good people. I would like to see how you explain them away.

Yes, head, it demonstrates just how distracting continual bombardments of questions/comments regarding a certain type of (very rigid, fundamental, controversial,) Bible interpretation can be. I fell for it, maybe rather stupidly.

So you're not going to explain what you think specifically about God ordering the Israelites to kill the babies? I don't need another vague paragraph about contexts and so on. Did that happen. Did God actually do that?

But the thread has gone that way with all of us posting.

this is just getting silly, I don't care what people think or feel about the Koran/ bible/ Torah or any other religious text
If an individual person interprets it in a way that allows them to have faith in God then just leave them be. Does their person belief in God hurt you, or interfere with your life if your choice is to not believe in anything??? Not it does not. If it's not something you believe in then just pass it by, the only person that is carrying baggage about it is you, is it worth it?? It just causes hurt for others and that's just plain mean.

So you're not going to explain what you think specifically about God ordering the Israelites to kill the babies? I don't need another vague paragraph about contexts and so on. Did that happen. Did God actually do that?

Start a thread on this then, head.

the only person that is carrying baggage about it is you, is it worth it??

Me? What I think/my past doesn't matter. What matters is that you can answer the questions for yourselves.

Why is it hurtful that someone doesn't believe in your God?

Religious threads digressing because of posters piling in with their own agenda is what the OP's complaint is about head. This behaviour means specific aspects of faith and worship cannot be properly discussed, it shuts down discussion.

Right. So it's ok to be rude to people on an internet forum because of the actions of other people thousands of miles away. Can you not see any issues with that?

Not really.

Personal attacks are not permitted on Mumsnet. Being sarcastic, cheeky or even derogatory about someone's opinions is acceptable elsewhere on the forum. Why should threads about religion being any different, who decides which beliefs have a right for special protection?

Offensiveness is subjective. And so far MNHQ have avoided over controlling content. Use of the words Fuck and Cunt are left alone. There are no rules about derailing, the only time subjective Moderation is used when a thread turns into a 'bun-fight''.

"is just using the thread as a platform to spout out hateful and nasty comments."

Great- maybe we're getting somewhere! Can you please highlight the hateful and nasty comments on this thread?

I think this post (from green above) sums it up:

MUMSNET HQ have an interesting conundrum. If they try and insist on basic netiquette which is based around mutual respect for the person behind the screen then they will upset some anti theists who insist that people of faith should not be respected. Richard Dawkins was quite clear that people of religion should be mocked and ridiculed.

That is why this thread is very much needed. It is extremely helpful that Dione started it.

MNHQ need to decide what their position is.

Just to repeat, I am an atheist.

'What matters is you can answer the question for yourselves'
Well yes. But that's non of your business. Its a private matter.
Lots of people would be interested in religion as an aspect of public life. Start a thread , im sure there will be lots of responses.
Since we climbed out of trees humans have wondered about life, death, the universe. All the big stuff. People have found answers, or semi answers through religion, philosophy, a vague sense of connection... it's part of the human condition to try to understand. It seems insulting to me to demand answers from someone who has come to their own sense of peace about these matters.
Public institutions based on religion? Fair game. Indeed necessary.
People trying to find a path, no leave them to it, it's nothing to do with you.