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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

What is the rationale for leaving crisis threads up once OP is safe?

76 replies

ArsenicChaseScream · 20/10/2014 23:29

I know there are differing opinions for what should happen before that point BUT once an OP has said they are safe, accompanied or similar, is there not a strong argument for suspending the thread?

OP posts:
Maryz · 21/10/2014 12:03

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MsGee · 21/10/2014 12:08

Yes Maryz - I think that feeling of helplessness is horrific for other people.

I know in my heart that nothing would have stopped my MIL. And for that reason, she would never have spoken out. But it all still stirs up the inevitable questions.

Flowers Pourquoi. I am so sorry you went through that. I do understand what you mean, its a terrible thing for a child (of any age) to have to go through with a parent.

heartisaspade · 21/10/2014 12:26

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MNHQ
RowanMumsnet · 21/10/2014 14:54

Hello

Sorry, we seem to be chasing our tails rather across different threads about this today.

We are, right now, in the process of seeking advice from the Samaritans about how best to handle these situations. (Thanks for those guidelines heartisaspade - they look as though they were written as guidance for journalistic pieces/UGC under published journalism, rather than for peer-to-peer forums, but you may well be entirely correct that the Samaritans' advice would be the same for forums).

Once we've got feedback from the Samaritans we'll come back to you all and see if we can form a consensus on the best way forward.

heartisaspade · 21/10/2014 15:08

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SlowlorisIncognito · 21/10/2014 15:50

I am glad that munsnet are seeking advice on this from the Samaritans.

I would however say that the ethical decision on this subject may not also be the most popular and that seeking a consensus on this issue might be difficult.

MNHQ
RowanMumsnet · 21/10/2014 15:54

Absolutely hearts and we're not trying to find a way around it at all. We do want to actually speak to the Samaritans though and make sure we get clear advice from them, if possible, about our specific situation.

FarelyKnuts · 21/10/2014 16:22

If someone is posting a "goodbye" style of suicide note on a forum I think it should be deleted and a message sent to the poster pointing them in the direction of services that can actually help them.
Having suicidal thoughts and saying you are planning on acting on them right then and there ARE not the same thing and so far mumsnet is the only forum I have come across that has a mental health section that does not have the disclaimer written across the top about posting suicide notes.

MNHQ
RowanMumsnet · 21/10/2014 17:06

Yes you may well be right Farely. We appreciate that there are at least two things here - posters who want to say 'I'm feeling extremely wobbly right now', and actual flat-out statements of suicidal intent. It may be that the external advice we receive makes a distinction between these two things.

When we've got something substantial from the organisations we're approaching we will happily come back and discuss further.

heartisaspade · 21/10/2014 19:13

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MNHQ
RowanMumsnet · 21/10/2014 22:18

It has been deleted - we zapped it this afternoon.

Of course you and other posters are making very compelling points - we just think that for now, as we seem to have reached a point where lots of users are concerned about this particular issue, that we should make sure we've done our research properly before reversing a long-standing stance (on allowing posts by suicidal posters to stand). We're sorry if this comes across as splitting hairs or deliberate foot-dragging; it's really not. We just want to be sure we get it right so that we don't (hopefully) find ourselves having to revisit everything in a few months.

ChillingGrinBloodLover · 21/10/2014 23:01

Rowan have you read this thread? The OP of this thread posted it on one of the other threads this evening, explaining how MN helped her when she posted a suicide thread.

MN HELPED

ChillingGrinBloodLover · 21/10/2014 23:04

It is frustrating me no end that people are saying threads like this don't help (suicide threads)/they should get RL help/they should xyz Read the thread I linked to above. Listen to the many posters who are saying MN DID HELP them instead of shouting over them.

ChillingGrinBloodLover · 21/10/2014 23:07

OH and if anyone bothers to read that thread or listen to the posters who are saying MN HELPED then they might also like to note that when the posters were feeling a little better and able to post again it helped them further to see people were asking after them, keeping the thread bumped to see how they were etc. They felt cared about. That is why the threads should be left.

wooooosualsuspect · 21/10/2014 23:16

At the expense of the posters their threads upset?

SlowlorisIncognito · 21/10/2014 23:16

Chilling Do you accept that some things, such as detailed descriptions of how someone intends to commit suicide, should be censored?

Do you think the OPs are the only ones who matter, and other vulnerable people who might read the thread are not deserving of protection?

wooooosualsuspect · 21/10/2014 23:23

What if you were on a thread all night with a poster who had posted a suicide threat trying to talk them down but then found out they had killed themselves anyway?

Where would your support be? MN is not the place for that level of support.

RJnomore · 21/10/2014 23:34

I totally disagree the threads should be deleted, as long as there is no suspicion that the poster is trolling.

I need to go and formulate my thoughts as to why it is that I disagree so strongly but I am shocked at the strength of my feeling regarding it.

ChillingGrinBloodLover · 22/10/2014 00:09

Yes usual. You can only help the person asking for help, you can't protect the world and their dog against everything. Lots of people, find lots of things triggering &/or upsetting, if we stopped people posting about them then MN wouldn't exist.

Of course it would be upsetting if they killed themselves anyway, but that wouldn't stop me trying to help them. I wouldn't need support and if I did I would find it, possibly from other posters on MN. There are thousands of posters on MN, there is a lot of support to be had.

Slow Do you accept that some things, such as detailed descriptions of how someone intends to commit suicide, should be censored?

That depends, if they say they intend to take pills/hang themselves/throw themselves under a train then no, they don't need censoring, that's hardly new news. However, if they were to say 'I am going to take xyz tablets and you need x many to kill yourself and I got that many by doing xyz' or I plan to hang myself this is how...'gory details' then yes, they should be 'edited by MN'. Just the bits, not the entire post.

wooooosualsuspect · 22/10/2014 00:15

That's you though . Chilling, and I admire you for that.

But other posters might be devastated. If you care about posters on MN surely their feelings count too?

I dunno, I just think MN is just an internet forum. Nothing more.

ChillingGrinBloodLover · 22/10/2014 00:30

Usual - of course I care about other posters, of course it would be upsetting if some of them got hurt in the process, but that's life isn't it. You can't not help one person just in case someone else gets hurt by seeing you do that.

There are many, many threads on MN that are triggering and upsetting to some people, we can't just delete them so that no-one else gets hurt by them.

MN is an internet forum (there's no 'just' in that), one that doesn't position itself in the 'lighthearted giggles' sector nor the 'hobbies' sector. It positions itself in the 'support' sector with a side of craft/camping/giggles.

I don't really 'get' your just and nothing more. Support forums are there to provide support, people give what they are willing and able to give. No one has to read or get involved in a thread.

Maryz · 22/10/2014 00:34

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LadySybilLikesCake · 22/10/2014 00:35

Sorry, Chilling, but MN is a parenting web site, not a support site for people with mental health or other issues. These sites require very different moderation. The average poster doesn't come on here to support others. They are not experienced and they are not trained.

wooooosualsuspect · 22/10/2014 01:12

MN is not a support forum for people who are suicidal.

ChillingGrinBloodLover · 22/10/2014 01:26

No MaryZ it's not an uncaring thing to say. You simply cannot stop 100% of people getting hurt 100% of the time. It's impossible.

I disagree that 100 people have posted to say that the initial thread upset them, there may have been 100 people upset by the accusations of troll and other things.

There maybe 1000 people who have got something out of the thread or other threads like it.

I am showing empathy for the person who asked for help. I am showing empathy for the people reading it who are getting help.

1000 didn't have to read the thread.

For every thread announcing a pregnancy there are going to be 100's if not 1000's of people getting upset.

For every thread discussing a bereavement there are going to be 100's if not 1000's of people getting upset.

You can't stop that.

LadySybil MN has a Relationships board, it has a Mental Health Board are you saying that all of those should go and only the actual parenting threads should stay because that's what it sounds like?!

Usual are you saying that as well? People who have Mental Health issues should not be supported on MN?

If MN is only for 'parenting' issues then most of the boards need to go. MNHQ actively support other issues, including Mental Health.