Your thoughts on unpaid internships? Slave labour or needs must?

[FrancesMumsnet]

Hello. We've been asked by the folks at InternAware for your comments, experiences and thoughts about unpaid internships, the system where young people work for free, sometimes for extended periods, in return for something to put on their CV - and maybe a foot on the first rung of their chosen career ladder.

InternAware are worried about the financial toll this system is taking on family life. They say 37% of interns complete 3 or more internships (European Youth Forum survey) and, as most
unpaid internships are based in London (where living costs are high), a single typical three-month internship could end up costing a much as £3000.

If you'd like to, you could sign InternAware's letter to Nick Clegg, which calls on the government to do something to help families struggling to help their children get a job. (Clegg, if you remember, said last year that "internships have been the almost exclusive preserve of the sharp-elbowed and the well-connected", and that they should be paid).

But most of all, we'd be interested in hearing your thoughts: do please post them here.

I think unpaid internships are a great way to get experience in a field provided they are open to all & it's not a case of who you know.

I do support them & also think they are a great way for a person to show their commitment to working in a particular field.

Some professions almost exclusively consist of those rich enough to work for free, as there is no other way in.

This needs challenging- if work is there, it should be paid.

Agree with tether but wanted to add that I really think relying on unpaid staff in the NHS and schools is the worst because those are publicly funded.

I think there's a big difference between giving someone some genuine insight and training which can help them get a job, and companies getting a free employee who is just given the photocopying type jobs.

I did some experience as part of my college course, it included supervision by the college and counted towards my degree. It also led to paid work over the summer.

I do support them & also think they are a great way for a person to show their commitment to working in a particular field.

There are thousands of young people out there desperate to 'show their committment' without a spare £3000 lying around.

Internships are slave labour, unquestionably. How is it fair to expect new young graduates to work for free, with no promise of a job at the end of it.

I can only presume that those in support do not have children who have graduated in the last year or so and are desperately trying to start careers in an atmosphere of mass youth unemployment and a double-dip recession, who are faced with two options: back-breakingly expensive slave labour, or unemployment.

I am not exaggerating. This is the situation for tens of thousands of young people throughout the country right now.

Agree with kickassangel.
Think though they should be limited to 1 month at most.
That way a prospective employer can see a bit of what the potential employee is like,and the person doing the internship gets some experience and insight.

My main quibble is the geographical unfairness. They are so much more affordable to those who can live with parents, and impossible for middle or low income people who would have to rent. This is a real north/south issue, and rural/urban issue.

I think they should be paid. At the moment they're only accessible to those who have other means of support, such as parents who are able to pay for or provide accommodation. It's impossible to do two full time jobs, there aren't enough hours in the day.

Unpaid internships are salve labour and people should be paid if they are doing a job. Not everyone has the financial backing to "show there commitment" and it means companies aren't getting the best most appropriate candidates for their companies, they are getting the richest.

I agree with kickass and amillionyears. I don't think that short duration unpaid workshadowing/work experience for a particular skilled/professional role is that terrible. I suppose I am more comfortable with unpaid work placements being done by students/aspiring students, than someone who has graduated, so may be in more need of regular paid work.

I've just graduated from university. Luckily I've landed pretty much my dream job straight out. Many of my friends are currently trying to get work.

Take, for example, my best friend. They want to work in parliament. Currently, an unpaid internship is pretty much the only way to get into it, yet the prospect of a 3 month, unpaid internship in London will only ever attract those wealthy enough to afford it, or lucky enough to live in London anyway. Unpaid internships are fuelling and worsening the glass ceiling experienced by many graduates from lower income families. There is no funding available. None. Internships are mostly full-time - how can you manage enough to fund rent and living expenses from evening/weekend jobs and still be able to put your all into an internship?

I've just finished a year long internship & I fitted in having a baby around working for nothing.

I will be back to post more things, marking my place!

They might let an employer assess the capabilties of individuals without making a financial commitment to them, but internships won't help them select the best candidate when so many talented young people are excluded by factors beyond their control.

Btw, I separate internships entirely from work experience, which I see as normally being up to a fortnight and shadowing/insight rather than actually performing a particular role. Work experience is invaluable and for the very vast majority of students can be funded through part-time or holiday work.

I've seen this from both sides. I couldn't afford to do unpaid internships - mainly because I had to work in my full time job and needed what holiday I got for exams and job interviews.

When I was in private practice I often supervised interns and it was quite a burden from the firm's point of view, the only benefit we got was a chance to appraise potential applicants outside an interview situation. It was a lot of work and time spent away from client work to keep them meaningfully occupied, and hopefully they got a lot out of it.

The whole thing was rife with nepotism though, the interns' parents would inevitably know at least one of the partners and they would typically be working their way around all the organisations where their parents' friends worked!

Edustudent I was thinking of work experience actually, they were one or two week placements.

Unpaid internships are pretty much the expected route into many careers now, especially in media, publishing the like. The vast majority of these positions are in London, so like other posters have said, unless you happen to have rich parents and/or live in London you might as well forget it. I would dearly have loved to work in publishing, but because I lived in Newcastle and couldn't afford to work for free in London, I didn't have a hope when applying for positions against others that had done unpaid internships. I also imagine it is so competitive that some companies will just use people with no intention of ever employing them.

Yes but Kate presumably, you have a partner who has been able to support you.

I did an unpaid internship after university and eventually got a job through it. I supported myself with a weekend job and waitressing in the evenings. There's always a way. I also committed a lot of time to gaining work experience in the university holidays, and did an internship one afternoon a week during the university term (that one went on for two years). I enjoyed all of it, learnt a lot, made good contacts (my internships were at different but complimentary organisations) and I really believe it all paid off. Yes, it would be nice if interns were paid, but it's not always possible (or affordable) - the risk of making it mandatory is that it will become even harder to get experience, as no one will be able to afford to offer it.

Could a separate funding body be the answer?

Or should legislation prohibit companies from employing unpaid interns?

What is the status of an unpaid intern WRT claiming benefits?

Too many questions?

At university, we did attachments for 4-6 weeks at a place of work (not internships, what a horrid word). I finished my degree, wrote to one of the companies I did an attachment at and got a job. I am still in the same career.

This was more than 20 years ago, so this is all probably irrelevant.

"There's always a way"

A weekend job (unless very lucrative) and waitressing in the evenings would hardly cover the cost of living in London these days.

I agree with the poster who mentioned one of the benefits as being able to assess candidates beyond the interview situation. I've hired several of my ex-interns (or given them very strong recommendations for jobs which they have then got), and have actually never hired someone, at a junior level, who hasn't interned for me.
If a good candidate was finding it hard financially I generally tried to help them be able to do the internship by allowing them time off to do money jobs/ they were always allowed to leave early for an evening job etc.

Ten years ago I managed - worked in a shop both Saturday and Sunday, and waitressed three/ four nights a week. My accommodation was far from glamorous, and I couldn't afford much (anything) in the way of luxuries - but as I was working seven days a week, and most nights, I didn't have time to spend anything anyway.

I know that London is expensive, but there are still cheap deals to be found - especially if one teams up with a friend and is prepared to share a room. I'm not for a second suggesting that this is an ideal solution, or maintainable for any length of time, but for three to six months? Surely not the end of the world.

Although, I've got a feeling that one could be eligible for housing benefit if one is doing an internship - am I right?

It would be interesting to find out, Puffy. Also, could you claim income support?