dear mn hq please could threads to do with testing for ds and other disabilities

[Shoesytwoesy]

be move in to the antenatal testing/choices topic. I remember that was why it was set up, so that it could be easily hidden.
yet we have a thread in chat of all places, surely it would be better for these threads to be moved.

yes, I do totally see that SOH

tbh I think there's no right way really. Chat is a good place to have these discussions as they're in the wider arena, but having said that chat is deleted after a number of days (60?) so those topics do ultimately disappear anyway. Also, there is the hide thread facility so in truth people who don't want to participate in these discussions do have the option to hide them.

It's difficult - I see the need for sensitivity but equally I think there is a need for discussion and it is hard to find the middle ground between the two.

Difficult isn't it? People do post specifically in chat because of the disappearing thing. 90 days I think.

Not this topic - but I have frequently posted things in chat because I want them to disappear eventually.

I would have been miffed if MNHQ had moved them without permission. Having said that I can absolutely see the need for people to be able to hide topics that are distressing to them for whatever reason.

I think the answer might be be a tick box "please make this a temporary thread" option when you start a thread (maybe only available in certain topics so it doesn't result in overuse). People could then use the appropriate topic safe in the knowledge that it would disappear in 90 days just like chat.

though I agree too with wannabe that the "testing/choices" section is not necessarily the place for a generalised debate/bun-fight.

That topic was set up as much to provide a safe place for people wanting information without judgement, as to protect posters who find the topic upsetting.

I don't know what the answer is in that situation.

tbh I often post in chat purely because I can't think where else to post. chat is for general discussion after all.

I would probably have posted a similar thread in chat (in fact I probably have done in the past as I have started similar threads before) because I wouldn't have thought that the choices topic would be appropriate for that kind of discussion either.

I'm not one for hiding threads but I have the testing topic hidden because I really don't want to read it, not because it upsets me but because I have strong views on some of the threads in there.

I agree with wannabe as well.
Not chat, but not tests either, because then the people who are facing tests would feel their real situation was being belittled by an online spurious debate, no?

Is there an argument for two areas: one called 30 day deletion for threads not meant for chat but which the OP would like to see removed one day, and one for sensitive topics? Dunno what you would call it though.

I am not sure this one should land in antenatal choices either: like TYV I see that as a fenced off safe area like SN, where judgements are not welcome.

We agree that it's a good idea to move sensitive threads like the one mention in the OP into Antenatal Tests/Choices, and that one has been moved now.

Please do report any threads like that when you come across that seem like they're in the wrong place, and we'll take a look.

Also, sorry that we've been a bit slow to reply to this thread. We do regularly look at Site Stuff but the fastest way to flag anything is to report the thread to us directly.

I think a sensitive subjects area would be good.
I find it quite easy to hide threads about ante natal choices. But I get really fed up that every few weeks someone fancies an mmr bunfight so they put a thread in aibu. I find that really difficult. The discussion in that section leads to deeply hurtful things being said by people who are neither affected by the subject from either side of the debate, nor want to discuss it sensibly. They want to hurl insults and abuse people.
I don't care if the topic is eating grapes in supermarkets. But when it is about my son I get pretty poked off.
A sensitive issues area could try and call for better standards of debate. Well, it's a dream I have

thing is I don't post in the sn topic, and I hide the antenatal testing one, I do believe that the antenatal testing topic is the best place to discuss testing for ds, but that is imo. these threads pop up quite often and always end up with the parents of children with sn being hurt, we are often told our posts are pointless or words to that affect, so it is not a debate.
could there be another topic linked to the antenatal testing one for these debates, then anyone on the topic could just hide it if they want to(as I do with the one there now)

I know there are a lot of sensitive subjects, but this one is beyond that, these threads always end with people like me being told we "chose" to have a child with a disability which is bollocks

I can't believe that anyone can honestly believe that such a theoretical debate such as the one started by this Down Syndrome thread is most appropriately suited to Antenatal Tests/ Choices, and the fact that it has been moved there is entirely insensitive and ill-advised.

On the face of it, it is a 'Down Syndrome Topic' and should therefore be moved but I would like to ask NancyMumsnet to read some of the 12 pages of posts as well as some of the recent posts in the Antenatal support thread for women who have chosen to terminate VI and then re-assess as to whether this thread is appropriate in its current place.

I have only joined Mumsnet as a result of my recent experiences which have taken me to the Antenatal tests/ choices board. This is a fantastic place for people who are experiencing most women's worst nightmare; to meet others in similar situations, gain information and advice and express their worries and emotions at such an incredibly difficult time. Whatever their decision. For I know from experience that there is very little support in the real world for people coping with the decisions that they made. These women should be able to do this without fear of being judged by other people, especially those who are lucky enough to have never been in this position and want to debate ethics.

I am not sure that antenatal testing is the right home for threads liek this. It seems to me to be entirely valid there to be discussion about the ethical and moral side of ante natal testing on a theoretical basis. The Antenatal testing threads are, I thought, for people actively going through the process.

Isnt it - sorry if this sounds harsh - up to people who find such threads upsetting to hide them? And if any of these threads actually said that a particular posters child was unwanted then it should be pulled and the poster banned. People are talking about their own thoughts, feelings and experiences, not what other people shoud do, or should have done.

Agree with Seeker and MyAngelAva.

It seems very unfair that the posters on the tests thread should have to have an ethical debate rammed down their throat, as much as it's unfair for parents of DS children to have to see it.

I haven't read the original thread, and have no desire to, but when I went ahead and had my amnio I wouldn't have appreciated being faced with 12 pages of people applauding/berating me.

but why should people who have disabled children have to put up with it, it is very distressing especially if you have a child with ds to read these threads.
there is no easy answer, but imo people should spare a thought for our feelings as well. and as someone said you can just hide the thread.

You're right of course, you shouldn't have to read about your child as if he/she were a game topic for debate, with all the wacky attitudes that such threads invariably attract.
On balance, I reckon a "sensitive topics" area would be best.Not ideal of course, but can't think of anywhere else.

Of course everybody's feelings should be considered - but it does not seem to me to be reasonable to expect people not to discuss the possibility of termination because somebody who chose not to terminate a similar pregnancy might read it. The discussion is not about the person with the here and now child, it is about the person with the pregnancy. Or about the person thinking about what they would do if they were in that situation. As I said, any derogatory remarks abotu a person who chose not to terminate or their child should be instantly deleted and the poster banned. But I don;t think it is right to stop people discussing the subject because somebedy might read it who made a different choice. I repeat, we would not be talking about that person's child, but about another person's potential child.

you can't stop people discussing it I agree, but there imo just needs to be a place that they are put away from people they hurt

Of course threads like that are very hurtful to parents with children affected by the issues, but they also have the potential to hurt people going through hard choices at the time - whatever way they are leaning. If you're trying to decide what action to take on a bad test result the remarks on both sides are likely to be extremely wounding. Why should it shunted right into a topic that was supposed to be set up partly as a "safe" place?

And saying "well you can hide it" - that cuts all ways doesn't it?

I'm really surprised at MNHQ on this decision - I think it was poorly thought out to move such a painful thread into the "choices" section.

I'm not saying it's right for it to be in chat - but it's surely not right to put it in a place where one of the groups of people most likely to be hurt by it HAVE to go to look for information. That's barely better than putting it in SN.

So where do you suggest? I think ante natal testing is entirely inappropriate.

hopefully the one good thing about this is that mn hq will hopefully think of an answer, as nobody should have to be hurt.
I only suggested that topic because of it's title and the thread being about that topic, I have the topic hidden so don't know and don't want to know what is talked about in it.
of course the sn topic would be the wrong place as well.

Sorry was that question directed at me? I agree with you - the move was totally inappropriate.

A "sensitive topics" area would be much better. Failing that, I think chat is imperfect but preferable - I agree it has the potential to hurt everyone there, but at least "chat" is a neutral area where people may be more prepared to encounter something upsetting.

chat imo is not the right place,
but what about other stuff(just remembered it exists) I always found that a rather more serious topic iynwim, where as chat seems more light hearted.

Sorry - cross posting.

Yes i hope MNHQ thinks of a solution. And I wasn't trying to criticise you for suggesting the move Shoesy - I can totally understand your reasons for wanting it out of chat.

There are loads of things that come up in chat that i don't like - I either hide them or ignore them. I honestly don't think it should be censored.

I've reported my post by the way, to flag the rest of the thread to MNHQ's attention (just in case they've ticked it off after Nancymumsnet's post)