SEX - Am I a pervert, is she frigid or is it somewhere in between?

[daddk]

I am 45 married to my DW (43) with three DC (10, 7 and 4). We have been together for about 22 years!

All in all I am happy with the family we have built and the life we have and I love my DW but one thing has always been a bit of a problem – SEX!

Ever since we started going out she has always been a bit shy and in my opinion a bit unimaginative. None of us have great experience with other long-term boy or girlfriends. There have been others but no other serious relationships.

Already in the early years our relationship I was frustrated with our sex life. In my opinion she never took any initiative and the sex was always the same. I grew up in Scandinavia with easy access to porn and she was from a traditional British family. I wanted to experiment but she was not up for anything. However I loved her. She was fun, she was sexy and we got on in all other aspects of life. I brought it up from time to time but nothing ever changed. About seven years into our relationship we had our biggest relationship crises and I told her that it was not working because of the unexciting sex. However I loved her and our life in general together was great so we stayed together.

Sex remained an issue and I kept bringing it up from time to time but nothing changed. Then we had our first child. Sex during pregnancy was of limits. I took care of myself and remained loyal (never been unfaithful). After birth it took time to get back into sex but we did and our second DC arrived. Same story and a few years later our third DC was here.

Everyday life has taken over and sex has decreased more and more. Now it is every 4-8 weeks and always on my initiative. She does not seem to miss it.

I feel that we are drifting apart. In my opinion she no longer shows much affection outside of the bedroom. A peck on the cheek and quick hug but with no passion. The passion is completely gone in the bedroom as well and it seems sheer obligation on her part. I get the impression she feels the faster the sex is over and done with the better.

As mentioned I keep bringing the subject up and as many other men I have probably chosen the wrong times and put pressure on my DW. I have read numerous advice on websites and carefully tried to put the ball in her court and said that I would like to talk to her about sex when she is ready. However nothing ever happens and she never brings it up. I have tried apps where both parties can tick what they like. She does not complete it. I have send her long text messages trying to express my despair of the state of our marriage but all I got back was a sad smiley. I have printed “yes, no, maybe” sheets and gone through them but she says “no” to most if she knows what it is (she was not sure what a 69 meant and it was a reluctant maybe).

Because of the children we have often slept in different bedrooms which I at times have actually preferred because I could get on my phone to watch porn and take care of myself like a sad teenager. She knows about this and finds it utterly degusting.

I love her and still find her attractive. I buy her lingerie, which just ends up in the draw. The children are getting better at sleeping in their own beds and we spend more time in the same bed but she just wants to cuddle up. I feel that I am just a big teddy or hot water bottle.

When we have sex it tends to be the same procedure. She will suck me off for a bit, or give me a hand job then she goes on top an rub herself against my penis. Occasionally she goes on top or it is the missionary position. She does not like me licking her or fingering her. She finds sperm gross so mostly I come on myself. Maybe I am influenced by the porn industry but I would love her take pleasure in making me come and let me come on her. She never shows any real pleasure (no moans or groans) and she has never had an orgasm to my knowledge. That upsets me immensely and I am devastated that I as her man don’t really know what makes her tick and can bring her to climax.

For all these years we have had sex and despite not being fully satisfied with our love life I still found her sexy and love being with her despite her lack of involvement.

I don’t know if it is a midlife crises or the fact that she seems to show less and less affection to me but I am starting to feel really depressed and even resentment towards her at times. I love her and the thought of us splitting up upsets me. I want us to work. I want us to be passionate.

She seems to be happy in the role as parent and put schoolwork, water bottles, children’s activities etc. before anything else. I feel we have become just like friends rather than a couple.

We struggle to communicate about anything and I have asked into what her thoughts are about the lack of sex but she is not very responsive. I have suggested we could try counselling but she is not open for this. She is not on any medication that can affect her libido but maybe she should see a doctor? (not sure she will see the need for this). I feel I have been open, approachable and sincere but everything I do seem to be ignored. She thinks I am obsessed. I see this as very serious but I get the impressions she thinks “not again” every time I try to bring it up.

Anybody who has been or are in a similar situation? Any suggestions? What can I do? Am I approaching this completely wrong?

The obsessed pervert?

You sound like an awful lover. A real 'do it by numbers' and using the latest porn video as your guide to sex.

Maybe try taking pressure off your DW and just cuddle, kiss, gentle touching rather than going for sex. Maybe counselling and understanding how your wife actually feels about sex rather than your expectations

The only thing she’s going to suck out of you is life. You need to make plans.

If DH was as awful as she sounds, we’d have been toast a long time ago

@daddk

We struggle to communicate about anything

I think you have a number of issues compounded by the amount of time you have been together and not really addressed things, but if you can't communicate effectively you won't be able to move forward.

Clearly your wife feels pressured, and sorry as a man you will in the main get flamed on here. If you post was by a women then she would be getting posts like he is controlling you emotionally so sorry, but as a forum for women it is a little biased.

Having said that, some have suggested you make plans as marriage isn't about having a flat mate. There is some truth in that but how you address it is important. If you just sit her down and give her an ultimatum then that is no answer. I suggest you stop pressuring her and learn how to communicate better. Gradually start talking about your relationship and infrequency with sex being part of it. See if you can address that and then gradually maybe talk about what you like and difficult one, her inhibitions.

Some women I guess don't like oral sex but I don't know any from my friendship circle that don't (too much wine on a night out chat) 😂. I find it so arousing and I love that my DH when he does it loves seeing how I react and talk to him when he is doing that to me. It really does give me a shuddering orgasm and yes, afterwards I love the cuddles and feeling close. You just can't get there overnight as you have a long was to get from A to B

In the end, if you can't get to where you want, or an acceptable compromise then you need to think if you can live like this the rest of your life. Some would say no. For example I couldn't stay in a sexless marriage or one that was very infrequent as it is part of being married and having the intimacy and connection

Good luck

There have been some wise words (and awful
ones) above but I just want to say, as a woman, I've been in a similar position, but with a man happier to watch porn than to actually have sex. And I'm someone who would quite happily engage in pretty much anything!

I called time on that but it took me many years.

She knows you're miserable but is unwilling to do anything different. I think you need to decide what's most important and if you're happy to live a celibate life. If not, tell her and give her time to choose what is important to her.

“Get off the Porn” is common, that’s not the issue. It’s a consequence of not having sex, you can clearly see that in the OP.

That’s the opposite of what I see. I see a porn obsessed man, who has criticised her lack of interest in anything other than vanilla sex from the outset. When he tries to engage her in discussion, it’s with a tick list of sex acts, when he knows she not adventurous. She’s clearly taken on the mental load of raising three children and then her preoccupation with what the children need is used against her.

As for the guy who’s told his wife that she either has sex on his schedule or he will leave, that’s called coercion and there’s a word for you. How utterly repugnant.

Hmm. I dont think anyone on here can pass judgement on whether you are a sex pest or she is not into sex full stop (frigid is not a nice word, asexual might be better).

Does she masturbate?

It sounds like you communicate freely about sex, and her... not so much. Some people are so repressed they just .. can't or wont talk about sex. It is a thing.

On the quizzes and questionnaires, that feels a little bit too much. If someone did that to me I would think Fuck Right Off. And I would also be very cross that you didn't see that it it fucked me off and therefore stop it. I would see that as you putting your needs front and centre and railroading me.

I used to feel this way about my ex. He would push and push. And I would say no but he never once said "aw ok fine. Are you ok?? Dyou want me to get you anything? What's up??". It was all huffy indignation. That was what did for our relationship. Might not be you but some sounded similar. I could have shoved the kids water bottles up his ass by the end of it as I was also highly resentful about being a serving wrench and chief maid.

On the other hand, if you have genuinely tried to understand and discuss without it being a prelude to sex then I dont know what to suggest apart from an open marriage. It's not ok to be in a sexless relationship, for the vast majority of people. It's no way to live.

Serving wench! Not wrench....

I've not read all the replies, so apologies if someone else has said.
You need to follow your wife's lead. She is showing you what she wants when she cuddles up to you. She wants affection. Just go with it and back off. You're putting too much pressure on her, and trying to get her to perform like a porn actress

Insisting on regular sex is appalling. You know what that sounds right?

And to Op please stop buying your wife lingerie and treating her as an object. She's a person. Not a hole.

Reconnecting with each other. Romance. Genuine care and affection without the expectation of a 'reward'. Then an open and non judgemental conversation about BOTH your expectations. But only after you have reconnected as a couple.

You do know that porn is not real.

They are actresses, doing things that male directors tell them to do.

Your post does talk about you, you, you.

Sit down and make one session entirely about her. Ask her what she likes. Focus on her pleasure.

I would want sex more with some one who really cared that I feel good. And also I would want sex more with a man who wanted natural sex, and didn't want to do loads of porn moves on me.

Porn moves can be scary and threatening to women

The last man that I met said to me"can i come on your boobs" me I said "no"

I know that he got that from porn.

Be gentle, kind, respectful. Ask her what she wants

I'm probably going to get ripped to bits here but ... what on earth did I just read??

If this is real, you are wayyy out of line. I am surprised you refer to it as your 'love life' because you are not acting like a loving, supportive husband. Your post is all about you, you want to experiment, you want her to let you come on her etc ... but she has told you she does not like this. In response you have criticised her 'performance' (for want of a better word), bombarded her with an immense amount of pressure with apps, quizzes, lingerie, and repeatedly threatened to leave.

If this is 100% absolute deal breaker for you then leave. Don't blame her, it's not her fault, you're just not compatible.

If it's not, chill the f out. Do you not value the sex you have? Is it not a good way to connect with your wife? Do you need her to be hanging from a chandelier to achieve that? A lot of women see sex as a physical expression of an emotional connection. If the emotion part is lacking then there is no point in the sex, or no enjoyment of it. If she is one of those women then you're probably breaking her heart by making her feel like the sex you have is not enough.

Work on the emotion and connection part of your relationship. What do you do to give her pleasure of a non-sexual kind? Are you affectionate without being demanding? Are you supportive, complimentary, her biggest fan? Do you tell her what you love about her (not physically) and why you're proud of her?

I've been following this thread and don't really have much advice I'm afraid as I'm not in a relationship. But it does sound like you're aren't compatible sexually anymore, nobody's fault so either live with it or don't.

I do however want to comment about the sexual acts you mention, and getting the "ideas" from watching too much porn - this is where I disagree with some posters.
What is wrong with a man wanting to ejaculate somewhere other than inside a woman ? Of course, if the woman isn't interested in that then that's her choice and it won't happen, but don't say that these sex acts are all porn induced.

@lmnoh because of how it is said. It is usually said with insistence, an "I deserve this", "I expect this", and they seem absolutely incapable of taking a no.

Asking for something is fine.
Demanding something, expecting it and bot taking a no for an answer, is something that I think alot of men get from watching porn.

When I said to the man that I didn't want him to come on my boobs, he looked at me with disgust and looked at my boobs and said "but I own these".

It is this awful dominant attitude, where the woman is meant to do everything and not is allowed to say no, her feelings don't matter, is what I think comes from porn.

"Coming on some one" is a huge thing in porn. It is known as the "money shot".

Many porn directors do it, because if the man comes inside the woman - then the viewers cant see it.

I see so many terrible sexual attitudes in men lately because of porn.

Really violent porn is out there.

The last three guys that I have been with, have:
Either, been violent and rough- hitting me
Demanded to come all over me, and got really angry when I said no.
One guy, when I refused to do something, he said "but you are saying no to me!"

Porn is ruining men's minds, and makig sex very unsafe for women

@angell84 Yes, your experiences with some men would suggest that they are highly influenced by what they are watching in porn movies, but not everyone is the same, and some men and women are respectful of other people's boundaries. Which I'm sure the OP is.
He's just trying to find a way to ignite the flame and make things exciting .... nothing wrong with that in my eyes but the two people involved need to be both excited about it else it's not going to happen.
Happy Friday everyone !

@imnoh he doesn't sound that respectful to me, and he talks about porn alot

The porn and disrespect stuff sounds awful.

FWIW I think men and women can watch porn without turning into evil, self obsessed cumshot chasers. If they are selfish and insensitive by nature, that is where you have your issue.

Coming on someone's boobs or in their mouth is something lots of blokes like. Nothing weird about that. Obviously if you say you dont like it that should be the end, but it isn't a sign of disrespect or pornhub addiction necessarily.

@angell84 how old are the guys you've been with out of interest? I think the guys I've been with are in a different age group (40+) ... they dont seem to be so badly afflicted by this stuff. Or maybe I've just been lucky....

@Whathewhatnow I am mid thirties. And now I think of it, the last three men that I have been with, have been late twenties.

I didn't intentionally decide to get with younger people, we all just met at groups.

That is it, I need to start talking to men older than me. Maybe I will finally have a good , respectful sexual experience! :)

I feel sorry for you OP but I do agree with PP that you should lay off the porn and stop pressuring her with the quizzes etc. You are being communicative though and that is definitely the first step in trying to resolve this. She has said to you that she likes cuddles etc, so that's a good start. You probably don't really need a therapist, just tell each other your needs without making the other feel too pressured.

A lot of goods points have been made about how you can change things for the better. She is preoccupied with the kids and is quite rightly putting them first. However, looking after three young children is a libido killer. Can you organise some childcare and take her out on a date? Make her feel special?

Try and help her achieve an orgasm whether its through oral or toys etc, I can't imagine sex being much fun if there's not much in it for her to be honest. Maybe once you get into a regular pattern of sex, you can try experimenting with other stuff.

Relationships, especially with three young children is hard work, but you both need to work at it. Good luck OP, don't give up. I hope it all works out for you.

Hi all,

Thanks for all your input!!! I agree that there have been some really wise words. I have read each reply in this tread several times.

I know that quite a few people are in the same situation as me. It is easy to stereotype this as a male problem but as some of the replies prove there are also women who want their husbands to show physically love and have the need to be wanted sexually. I can relate to this. I feel I live with a flatmate but I am after sex and to be physically loved and want to be wanted. But I want doesn’t always get. I wrote this back in December and since then we have had sex once maybe twice! I don’t think scheduling sex is the right approach as I really want her to want it rather that feeling she has to.

It is really difficult to put my frustration in writing without coming across as an uncaring, selfish unpleasant pervert. As I explained this the lack of physical intimacy has been present for years. I have brought this up from time to time and it tends to end up with me venting my frustration. That was why I tried questionnaires, apps and the text message approach. As pointed out this might not be the most romantic approach but it puts the ball in her court and she can react on it in her in her own way and her own time. She responded with a sad smiley (!) to a long text message and has not responded to questionnaires and apps at all.

Stop pestering her was another reply. I have tried that and now we are approaching the fifth month of the year pretty much without sex. This is not working in my opinion. If you are hungry you would ask for food or you would make it yourself. “Making it myself” is what I do with porn. I would rather “eat with her” but as she is not engaging I watch porn. I am aware that porn is not real but at least people looks like they enjoy it and want to be part of it (I realise that they are paid to do this). My wife finds it disgusting that I watch porn. She knows I am “hungry” but she will not “eat with me” and she doesn’t want me to “eat on my own”. To me this seems selfish.

I honestly don’t know what to do. Should I show her this post and the replies to see if that starts the conversation?

You are simply incompatible. There is nothing less sexy than “scheduling” sex which should be spontaneously desired by both parties. Nor is having to jump through some sort of program of cuddles. Move on to someone who likes sex.

Well daddk I totally understand where you are coming from, and I don't think I'm a pervert, just a normally uninhibited happily sexual person.

Your DW sounds like a block of wood. But - crucially - happy that way. I think at least half of all women seem to be a bit like that 😬

And mostly they are the ones sensibly/happily married with nice houses and no money worries! And husbands running around after them!!

I'm not quite sure how they get away with it. Anyhow: she's not going to change. If she honestly wasn't sure what 69 meant and thinks it's disgusting for you to watch porn then ... I'm really not sure what you do with that.

I honestly truly just don't get it when women are like this. I'm so not like it. I can't understand their coldness and lack of interest. I feel v sorry for you, OP. Counselling??