How would you feel with this GCSE policy?

[DecisionParalysis]

We've just discovered some aspects of the GCSE policy of a school we're considering (in fact it was probably a front-runner up to now).
The school is Catholic so RE GCSE is compulsory - that's fine, I knew that from the start. However, it seems they only offer individual sciences (not the double science award) and they don't allow children to take more than 9 GCSEs.
I think each of these things is fine - but together they basically mean, if you believe in doing all 3 sciences to GCSE (which isn't compulsory at this school btw), you then have Maths, English, Science and RE taking up 7 of 9 choices... 2 choices left to cover MFLs, humanities, arts, and computer science. I'm a bit uncomfortable about this :/

I think it's fine, but may be slightly biased as DC chose to do 3 separate sciences and RE in their options..

If you're not happy with it though then keep looking.

It’s not unusual overall. Not having to take all three sciences is rather unusual in state schools IME, but compulsory RE is quite common.

And nine GCSEs is actually the most common number taken – followed by eight. The reform of GCSEs in 2017/18, as you may well know (so apologies if so) has meant a lot more content to assimilate and more exams, so schools have in many cases cut down on the number of GCSEs sat, to allow it to be more manageable for students.

There is no need to take 11 or 12 GCSEs after all. I do take on board your concern @DecisionParalysis about the limited possibilities to cover arts, creatives, MFL, humanities with just two options. That’s nothing new tho – a friend of DS2's was telling me about his options – "I’m taking PE” – he basically had one choice as he had to take history or geog and French. And that's about 10 years ago.

I think RE being one of the nine and double science not being possible makes it worse; but I guess then your DC if keen on arts/hums could choose just two sciences and then would be able to pick (say) history, German and drama. RE is a humanity as well if that’s of interest. Or if they enjoyed STEM they could do three sciences, CS and an MFL. That's all good.

Overall I don’t think this would put me off a school.

Check if English actually takes up 2 spots - English Language and English Literature are both compulsory in many schools (Although English Lit is not legally required).

If English takes up 2 spots then that’s effectively only 1 choice left, I wouldn’t be happy with that.

More and more schools seem to be moving to 9 GCSEs max though which inevitably narrows options. I think it’s a shame for those pupils who would be quite capable of more and would value the breadth.

I thought 2 English (lit and lang) was compulsory?

If this is a state school OP, it is COMPULSORY to take all 3 sciences. Double award is teaching all 3 sciences. I have no idea how a school would get away with only entering and teaching 2 of the 3 sciences. It would also massively limit them beyond (as it's so unusual!).
8 have no in exceptional circumstances that a student be entered for 1 or 2 of the singles sciences. But in theory that is because he or she hasn't been able to attend school. But all 3 would have been taught and on their original timetable.

That does seem a bit rubbish. Ours does 10 GCSE’s and RE isn’t compulsory so they get to pick a good choice and science double award is available.

9 is fine but the compulsory RE would put me off

Have you double checked that the RE that is required is the full 2-year GCSE and not the short course normally sat in year 10? A good portion of schools that require a religious studies GCSE actually only require the latter (usually with the full course being an option) and don't count the short course towards the options slots allowed.

Beyond that, this wouldn't be an automatic deal-breaker for me if the school is a top choice for other reasons, but I would consider whether it's a fit for your particular DC. It's pretty typical now that a student taking triple science and a humanity (albeit in this case it's required to be RE) will only have 2 options remaining, but if triple science and a humanity wouldn't be your DC's likely path otherwise this may end up feeling limiting.

Only offering standalone sciences has pros and cons. For students who would have taken triple anyways it's a bit of a moot point and it can serve students with spiky profiles or those who are struggling to get enough passes really well. But I think it does overlook the bright but non-STEM focused students a bit - the ones who would be aiming for top dual-science marks but don't plan to pursue STEM beyond GCSE and would prefer to free up an option block for a humanity or practical subject.

OP, if your DC is science-focussed, it’s a great advantage. I really wouldn’t worry about it.

It's not a state school so they do view taking all 3 sciences as part of the choice offered. I don't. I'm very much of the view that all 3 should be taken to GCSE even if as double award (didn't realise state schools had to do this - seems I agree with the government on sth!).

Yes, I'm counting English as 2, Maths as 1, Science as 3, and RE as 1 to get to 7. I've checked this with the school and they've confirmed.

Maybe I'm old fashioned but I'm not keen on whole areas being dropped by age 14. Just seems too early to me to specialise. I suspect DC is sciencey (certainly mathsy) but I know they are also very creative and love history. GCSE selection a few years off yet though so I guess things could change.

Even if taking eng lit and lang that still leaves two spots surely? Eng x 2, maths x 1, science x 3, RE = 7; two spots left. I don't dispute that's limiting but for me RE ticks the humanity box so unless hist or geog is a passion, there's still the possibility of (say) MFL and art (or whatever).

Interesting @user1471530109 about three sciences being compulsory. I did wonder as the only school I know of where DC can just take two single sciences is a private school.

RE short course has been withdrawn by some boards so I am not sure it is as common as it was, but I agree it’s worth asking if it actually counts as one of the nine. If the short course (half a GCSE) is offered then it may not.

ETA: x posted with your update @DecisionParalysis if it is a private school that explains the science aspect. Is it the best private school available to you? I must say if I were paying £££ that might colour my view a bit. It also depends heavily on what your DC is keen on (which I appreciate you cannot fully know in year 5).

This would definitely put me off, OP. Mine have recently done / currently going through GCSEs and it’s really hard narrowing down the choices.

Like you say it’s the double whammy of max 9, with only two real option slots because of the RE. Doesn’t leave any room for much interest based options eg wanting to do art, music, try out business or keep DT going, yet still do eg history and a language, or geography and computer science.

If there were no other good schools at all I guess we’d have to suck it up, but I would be seriously put off by this. 9 great GCSEs is plenty to get you where you want to go, but it’s so focussed so early on, it doesn’t seem right.

I wouldn’t be happy with it. Would have been fine for my daughter who chose triple science & RE but for my very unsciency son who struggled with writing & the concepts of RE but excelled in the arts it would have been disastrous.

You’re right, I can’t count!!!

I'm with you.

In my experience, a lot of schools offer double or triple science, with the triple option meaning you're taking an extra GCSE.

I'm a raging atheist but actually think RE is important. I like that my child learns more about the different cultures they're surrounded by. There's a chunk of the syllabus that covers stuff like ethics too.

But I agree about not limiting options. Of my child's three choices, one was an afterthought and late switch (from practical but boring IT). But it has become an absolute passion which they now want to specialise in.

I wouldn't be keen on compulsory RE or triple science, but it wouldn't necessarily be a deal breaker for me. It would depend on what the alternatives were not just in terms of GCSE offer, but the school overall.

All the state schools I am familiar with place some restrictions beyond the Science, Maths and English core. I think a totally free choice is rare. The nearest catholic school insists on RE GCSE. They all require one of history, geography or a MFL, with some insisting on both a MFL and a humanity for average or above average attainers. Maybe free choice is more common in the private sector?
At DD's fairly average comprehensive students can opt to take further maths or triple science as a 10th if they attend after school sessions. Triple science can also be taken as a standard option. I think for the vast majority of young people 10 is too many, but the option is there.

Where I live there is little/no choice unless you afford private and/or are a baptised catholic who can afford significant transport fees (£900+/year). We just accepted what was offered. In your situation where you have a choice, I would look at state and private options carefully. The GCSE offering is one factor, but there is also ethos, religous character, behaviour policies, journey time, sport and PE, enrichment etc. If you are considering private cost is also a consideration. I'd look at the whole picture and decide whether the positives you see in the school outweigh the GCSE restrictions.

It would put me off. It’s far too narrow at gcse. RE is bonkers if it means only 2 options left as dc cannot choose an art, a more desirable humanity and a technology subject or sport. It’s all about results and not about a broad education. It’s saying they only care about scientists.

It would definitely put me off as well. I've got a bit of an all-rounder so options choices were bad enough once you'd had triple science take up one of them - at least it was his choice! It feels like it really narrows them only to have two actual choices.

I'd actually welcome compulsory RE - it's so useful for everything from reading Shakespeare to understanding world politics to knowing that party bags at your kids' parties need to be halal. The ethics section would be interesting too.
9 GCSEs is pretty normal.
Triple science would depend on the kid. It wouldn't be a issue for one of my kids, might be for the other.

I'm not sure I'd go so far as to welcome compulsory RE taking up an actual option for GCSE but agree that world religions, philosophy and ethics is a bit like PHSE and should definitely be taught to all teenagers.
My original reason for the post wasn't so much the compulsory RE - if anything, as a religious school this was the least surprising part - but the combo of:

• individual sciences only (so takes up 3 if you don't want to drop any)
• compulsory RE
• max of 9

It just means there's only 2 options left for everything else.

Maybe look upon the third science as an option. Then you have: 2 English, Maths, 2 Sciences, RS and 3 full options.

Only people who love science would choose the third science as an option. People who don't like science could do a second humanity and two languages or two creative subjects or even two additional humanities and a language. So I think most pupils would be able to play to their strengths with this policy.

I agree with you that Double Science would be a much better core than only two of the three, but if you let go of the idea that everybody should study all three sciences then I think it is actually not so bad.

But this isn’t an option at all. They have to do all three sciences, no option to drop one.

I don’t think anyone can drop a science in England anyway. I did see on here a while ago someone saying that their child could drop one science, but I’m not sure where they were based. Maybe Scotland?

@Talipesmum The OP says in the first post that doing all three sciences isn't compulsory at this school. So they are allowed to drop a science (maybe even two?). It is not allowed at state schools but it is allowed in some private schools.

Ah yes good point, I had completely missed that. But I do agree with the OP that you’d need a really good reason to wholly drop one science.

Tbf I only took two sciences (didn’t do physics) as I wanted to do a whole load of languages (well, three in my normal option list).

I do feel tho that double science covering all three in less detail (and still allowing German and Latin) would have been a better option for me. I do sometimes feel my lack of physics knowledge so I see where the op is coming from.