Disgusting behaviour - can withdraw an application for a secondary school place

[Bananaslushie]

My daughter is due to start secondary school in September 2026. Our first choice is not guaranteed as it's a very oversubscribed school and we may not fit all the criteria
I have put a second choice down which seem like a good school at the time going to the open day. She is my only child so I don't have much experience of this process. Today I was on the bus and happened to be on the same bus as the students coming from the secondary school. What I saw was absolutely horrific. The most disgusting behaviour and language I've ever heard. Calling each other a cunt telling each other to suck hood many sexual comments towards girls. One guy kicked another boy in the back as a joke fight so they ended up punching and kicking each other in between the other passengers upsetting everyone, It was just the worst behaviour I've ever seen from a bunch of humans and now I worry if she's not offered our preferred school then she will definitely be offered this one, my question is if I decline the offer from this school - can I pick one of the other options I have put down such as the third choice? Or would I not see their offer because i was already given an offer? I want to go with the third place and I wish I could switch them around now, it was so bad on the bus. I'm anxious and pissed off with myself thatbshe's going to end up there, ruined her education ect +my friend said all schools are like that -but really?

I taught in an Ofsted outstanding school. One of the best in the country. A comprehensive.

Pretty normal behaviour for some tbh. Not saying it’s right but teens are going to teen.

I'm afraid I think you can find that behaviour from any school. Ditto drugs, bullying etc. I'm not saying there's no difference between them, but not that you can detect from a snapshot.

My girls both went to a good comp serving an affluent leafy suburb. Very often the police attended the bus stop after school. One dd rose above it all, had her own tight group of nice friends, it really didn't affect her. The other was great mates with all the baddest of bad boys, loved it all, left it behind as she matured. Just because it happens at every school doesn't mean it will impact on your child.

I can understand why it's off-putting, but the same thing could be going on at the other schools too, you just happened to witness this one incident.

Sorry, but this sounds quite usual. DD went to a good comprehensive, but the behaviour on the school bus was pretty feral.

The only way your DD will avoid this is if you drive her to school.

How do you know the third place school will be different? Or your first choice.

Will your daughter be travelling by bus?

I’m afraid teenagers en masse and public transport are often not a good mix.

Welcome to high school… our local school made news last year as a boy let of a firework on the bus! Everyone knows to avoid the school bus times. Something takes over when they all get on a bus or seems.

Ex teacher

virtually all secondaries have kids like this. Sorry

Sadly I think you will find behaviour like that at most secondary schools.

Children from your preferred school may well behave in exactly the same way. At my child's secondary, some were staging fights after school at the local playing fields while others just quietly went home to do their homework. One or two failed their GCSEs because they couldn't be arsed, and crucially, nor could their parents, while one or two went onto the local sixth form and have had interviews for Oxbridge. There are all sorts at a local school. In some ways, that's a good thing.

Did you email the school and complain? I think you should.

Unfortunately this is common behaviour from some teen boys and you will find this in every school.

We have some of the best secondary & grammar schools in the country but the behaviour and lack of consideration for others when they’re all let out of school together is unreal. I’m no shrinking violet but at school kicking out time I avoid town like the plague !

My son went to the best state school in the area. In a posh market town. We specifically went through waiting lists to get him into this school. There were still a proportion of kids like this.

I once made a comment about the behaviour of the kids in his school (as a positive) and he just laughed and said how little I knew.

The vast majority of kids will rise above it and it won’t affect them in their day to day lives. My son never had any issues with them.

On National Offer Day, you can decline the place and if there is a space in the other schools, you'll be offered that in the next round of offers. You'll automatically be added to the waiting list for the first school but will probably have to contact the local authority admissions team to ask to be added to the waiting lists for the ones lower down in your preferences.

The risk of this is that none have a space and he is offered the only remaining places in schools you would never have chosen or are in difficult locations to reach, but with the falls in student numbers, you may be OK. The actual recommendation is to accept so he is guaranteed a place somewhere for September but take steps to be added manually to waiting lists for the other schools; declining outright does not give any greater weight whatsoever to applications for other schools or appeal requests.

You can also appeal against a decision not to offer a place at the higher preference school at the same time AND ask to go onto waiting lists for other schools you hadn't selected previously. None of this will affect the outcome of an appeal or a decision to offer by any other school. Also bear in mind that some places will always be declined and acceptances withdrawn over the subsequent months due to similar decisions, moving out of area, taking up places at independent schools and successful appeals elsewhere, so it isn't fixed until pretty much the first day of term.

Tbh that sounds pretty typical. Dd left school 14 years ago and she chose to walk rather than use the bus as behaviour was feral from a significant minority and it was semi regularly that the police were called to remove them from the bus as the bus driver refused to take them any further.

To answer your question - no, if you get offered school 2 you can’t refuse it and say you want school 3 instead. You can go on the waiting list for school 3 and hope a place comes up, but if you refuse the place at school 2 they won’t automatically give you school 3 - you’ll either end up with nothing or potentially a place at whatever school has
places left at the end which could be miles away/even worse.

Sorry @Bananaslushie I agree that this behaviour, while unpleasant, is not unusual in schools or rather on school buses. It doesn’t mean your DD will follow it. You need to support her to be resilient and get the most out of her school. I bet if you were on the bus with DC from your third-choice school you might see the same.

But to answer your actual question, no you won’t have the option of a place at preference three if you are offered pref two. You can decline the offered place but it’s not advisable as the LA is then not obliged to offer you any other place.

If you are allocated pref 2 and decide you prefer 3, accept place 2 and enquire if pref 3 is full. If not then happy days. If it is then you can go on the WL or appeal. Or both tbh.

I wouldn’t worry too much about it rn. You may be offerd pref 1. How likely is it – how far was the furthest offered distance last year and the year before and how far are you – or are there other criteria (religion?)?

To answer your question, you can refuse a space at your second choice if offered it, but you won't be offered anything else. You can go on the waiting list for as many schools as you like, but how quickly they will move no one can say.

In answer to your question about places - if you get offered your second choice, no you cannot decline and have a place at your 3rd choice. What would happen is you would decline the 2nd choice and then have to go on to waiting lists for schools you want to go to. You may get lucky as things do shift a bit, alternatively the only school with places left may be a bad school but miles away - so your choice maybe between a bad school close by or one with a long travel time.

All schools, even private fee paying schools have awful teen behaviour when adults are not looking. As long as behaviour on school grounds is responded to there is not a lot you can do once the children are no longer schools responsibility.

There's poor behaviour in all secondary schools. You're very naive if you think your DC won't come across this behaviour in any school.

We have 2 excellent secondaries next to each other. Very leafy suburb.

Everyone avoids the shops at kicking out time. Even though staff are on duty the behaviour is not good. Staff patrol the bus stops too. They are still feral.

Sadly quite typical OP. Mine are in their 20s now and went to a very well regarded school but some of things I heard that when on were toe curling.

Unfortunately normal, even the local private school wasn’t immune, if anything their language was worse

LOL. There are going to be kids like that at every school, including the 'best' ones.

This goes on everywhere on the bus after school unfortunately. It doesn't actually tell you anything about the school.
I went to a private school over 30 years ago now and the boys from the neighbouring private school went on like that on the bus then - calling people cunts, fighting, tipping cans of fizzy drinks over each other's heads or over passersby. They also talked in a disgusting way about girls and sex.
The girls from my school weren't as bad but there was still a lot of awful behaviour. The school was constantly getting complaints and we were all hauled into assembly or a bollocking on a regular basis. Made no difference.
I don't think you can judge the school based on bus behaviour. It might be that the school is very strict and that those boys you saw do comply with the behaviour policy in school and then go completely wild when they are "released" from the school and its rules at the end of the day.

Have you been to the school to visit?