Any experience of Kings Maths School vs LAE for 6th form?

[JusteanBiscuits]

My son has applied to KCLMS for 6th form and also to LAE Stratford.

He wants to study Maths at University, and truly loves the subject. His heart is set on KCLMS, but as that is entirely maths / physics, I wonder if going to LAE (his second choice) would be better for the all round experience? Meeting a wider variety of people, a much wider selection of extra curricular clubs etc. I worry the excitement at 16 of being immersed in maths might wear off, and being somewhere with a wider curriculum might be better?

Any experience would be appreciated. Thanks

Admissions Test | King's Maths School the test date is here
Did you get an acknowledgment of your application?

Exam is 7th December, but son hasn't received an email yet either! I might email and check with them as it's under 2 weeks away now.

Exam info information just been received!!!

Received too. Exciting! I can't remember if they have past papers online. Does anyone know what the exam is like?

@KnottyAuty

(Sorry, don't know why it's insisting on tagging Knotty but it also won't let me delete it)

There are specimen questions and videos of some being answered for help on their website

https://www.kingsmathsschool.com/admissions/admissions-test

Oh brilliant, thank you!

We did the virtual LAE open evening last night (I didn't get a spot for the in person) and was very impressed with the opportunities outside of the standard curriculum, as was my son! They did a great job of selling themselves.

Again, our concern is though his GCSE results are likely to be very good, he doesn't meet any of the criteria for over subscription other than results. And at the open evening they said that 40% of places will be specifically reserved for disadvantaged children.

We watched too. Impressed but they all do a good job at selling themselves at open evenings. I was mainly impressed with the 'extra' subjects like Ancient Greek. DS would love that.

We had a giggle in our family at the diversity in names of the teachers, yet not the ethnicity! Mr Huang looked white as they come (did he take his wife's name? Is he half Chinese but the genes were not strong?). Ms Rahman is obviously married to an Asian man, as also very white. So.. 🤔. All very MC indeed.

Little bit worried about how my children would stand out in a cohort of 285. In their current school they are top of the pops which does wonders for confidence, albeit without so many obvious opportunities.

I think they'll apply. Nothing to lose. If they get an offer, I think they'll make the grades but would need to see if they got the offer.

Oh, and DS was upset there wasn't an arm wrestling club but I said perhaps he could set one up!

"We had a giggle in our family at the diversity in names of the teachers, yet not the ethnicity!"

It's not a very good example to set your kids, scoffing at things like this. If they say similar things in school or, in future, in their place of work it is likely to make people uncomfortable and get them reported.

Well perhaps they should feel uncomfortable if a very diverse school ethnically/socially is represented by an SLT which basically white middle class. Not an accent to be heard other than RP! I'm sure there are some fantastic black/ Asian/ Romanian teachers out there (maybe even in the school, though that would be interesting to look at), who could be on the SLT of such a 'socially progressive' school.

@JusteanBiscuits many thanks for the accidental tag! I've been so busy I haven't been able to check on this thread so that was handy :)

We also got our timings for next Saturday. DS has done a little bit of revision but not much. Mocks have taken up a lot of time unfortunately.

He has been doing questions off the website from the KCMS weekly challenge and enjoying those. But this week's?! He says it is way more difficult. Anyone else had a look?

@elkiedee (and everyone else) - does anyone know how the Maths and Further Maths are organised?

KCMS virtual open evening was among the first events we attended and I am now realising the huge variety and didn't note which version they might do:

Current school: Maths in Y12 sit the A level. If passing sit FM at the end of Y13. If Grade C then re-sit Maths in Y13 and not do FM. Need Grade 9 to do FM.

LAE Tottenham: Maths and FM taught in series; both exams at end Y13. Need Grade 8 to do FM.

Others: Maths and FM taught in parallel; both exams at end Y13. Asking for Grades 7-8 generally to do FM.

The way our current school runs this is not ideal for DS who is very mathematical but has ADD and so needs a little more time to absorb things. Covering 2 years of A level content in only 7 months and then sitting the exam is a big risk for him.

Otherwise he did the KCMS Taster day and loved the white board teaching and being surrounded by mathmos. So I am hoping the Maths arrangements are closer to LAE Tottenham and not his current school ... Anyone know please?

My understanding is that Kings Maths school was formed when top university maths departments found it difficult to widen participation on their courses, not because kids in less advantaged settings were less talented but because they did not get the right preparation in sixth form. This might have been because the school lacked strong maths teaching, or because insufficient progress in mixed ability teaching groups. Lowering entry grades does not help if students flounder when they arrive. Hence the idea of a school specifically to prepare suitable students for demanding courses.

The school is designed for kids who love maths, and are happy to be with other kids who love maths. Their priority is to recruit students who will benefit most from the education they offer. I am not surprised that they impose a level of discipline. The workloads at destination Universities which the school is preparing students for will be high and sixth form is the time to learn suitable study skills. Also the setting, though reasonably safe, is very urban. Not the place for groups of students to go wandering about at lunch time.

I don't know if knowing the percentage of kids from private schools will help. Parents with the money would probably prefer the sixth form of the nearby Westminster School. At the same time there are always kids who need to transfer to the state system at 16, and if they are super bright there is no reason why they should not be considered.

The school is not that old and is expanding. I assume that initially the priority was to recruit experience school leaders into the SLT. I assume that the current policy is to recruit the best candidates who apply, and that over time the team will become more diverse. (FWIW central London state schools often have a real problem recruiting good maths and physics teachers.) The school has been a great success and has enabled students to attend and thrive at top universities who otherwise would not have done. I would have thought that this combination of success and diversity of student body should be sufficient. In time, as a greater diversity of students graduate from top Universities, the mix should change organically.

Ah - just re-read the curriculum pages and it does say that both maths exams are at the end of Y13. Perfect!

Last question! Can someone explain the "woke" politics/agenda mentioned up thread and how this manifests?

We live in an ward area where residents have 90 different first languages are spoken. And DS school photo (a different borough) looks like the united nations. So we are hoping to find a similar mix at 6th form and woke might be what we are looking for... or is this referring to something else?

Thanks!

@KnottyAuty I think it’s a fairly standard level of wokeness for a London sixth form tbh. Lots of keen staff engagement with things like gender diversity, Pride, Black History Month, feminism and girls in STEM, mental wellbeing and ill-health. Lots of awareness of the students’ diverse cultural backgrounds - I think it’s a decent mix of ordinary Londoners, in terms of ethnicity and religion and class, lots of students from first or second generation immigrant families, young carers, kids on free school meals etc. Plus an additional level of engagement with / celebration of neurodiversity because as a maths school kings has (I hazard, but I think it’s true) a greater than average proportion of students with ASD.

Mostly the staff are well intentioned about it, if occasionally a bit galumphing. Their intention is to make everyone feel safe and comfortable so that they don’t get distracted from working like crazy. The one thing I’d say is that they come down pretty hard on even quite gentle piss-taking behaviour that most sixth forms wouldn’t bat an eye at - quite a lot of kids get in trouble (small time) in the first term until everyone realises that the staff really do take this stuff quite seriously. One of my sons said their was a kid in their class who did that thing of putting their hand up to answer every single question, and a bunch of them started giggling about it and were instantly and quite fiercely disciplined. (Fair enough - but they were all really surprised after what they’d seen in their ordinary secondary schools!)

My son went to LAE. It is very mathsy and the maths department is excellent (with the exception of one teacher who only teaches year 12). My son really enjoyed it and I would definitely recommend the school. He started with maths, fm, physics and economics but dropped economics in year 13. It's much harder to get in if you do those subjects (as in you need higher GCSE grades) compared to the arts subjects.

We are white, middle class and he got in (8 x grade 9, 1 x grade 8). Once they've filled the 50% of places that go to Newham residents, the entry criteria pretty much just goes on GCSE grades and distance. I actually think that being a white boy went in my son's favour because they are very definitely a minority group at LAE.

It's a great school. My niece went to a a private sixth form and I was shocked at how poor the UCAS/university interview/applications support she got (for medicine) compared to LAE.

Is he morning or afternoon? Mine is morning but his mate he was going to travel with is the afternoon 🤦‍♀️

I'll ask him about this week's maths challenge.. it's all WAY over my head!

That's really helpful, thank you! They're moving into their new purpose built building which looks incredible too.

Ooh thanks. That all sounds good. Sniggering about intelligence and being keen is bad form in my book too.

Early afternoon. 11.45 arrival. What sort of score do you think they need? DS trialled a UKMT maths paper today and got 78% but I’m thinking that’s maybe not enough if we don’t meet any of the enhanced criteria?

Ah, my son is 9.15am arrival. He's going by himself on the tube as I need to be in two places at once, and feeling a bit guilty about it.

I think they said anyone scoring over 70 last year got offered a place. Son was doing the practice questions yesterday evening and found them OK I think. He is on COMPOS too and so seems to be doing maths all the time at the moment.

How is it going with practice for Saturday?

Not great here as there are 2 end of unit tests this week which have eaten time. But he did manage a couple of UKMT sample papers. Some of those questions have fiendish wording don’t they?!

OK so far - pretty chilled to be honest, but son is a very chilled person! Still feeling Mum guilt over the fact he is going by himself. But two kids needing to be in two different places at the same time is normal life for a Mum! He has an hour extra after school every day at the moment leading up to GCSE's which is really annoying.