4 essay subjects at A-Level?

[TealDeer020202]

Just started Y12 having finished my GCSEs and an EPQ last year. I am currently taking Religious Studies and English Literature (both OCR) , Politics and History (both AQA) for A-Level. Wondering if anyone has experience themselves or with their child in these subjects and whether its a bit too much. For context, I got an A in my EPQ and six 9s (seven if you incld. native language), two 8s and two 7s at GCSE. I'm aiming for a history degree or maybe a law degree.

Why are you taking 4? Was it because you couldn't decide or did your school suggest starting with 4? You really only need 3 to study history or law.

Try thestudentroom.co.uk

The bottom line is that, for competitive law or history courses, you want to be securing high predicted grades by the end of Y12 so those will feed into your UCAS application in the first term of Y13. That term is also when you would be looking to prepare for and sit the LNAT and/or other entrance tests, so you need the time and space to prioritise that. A fourth A level may compromise both objectives.

Those doing four A levels often are selecting subjects with significant overlaps eg Maths, Further Maths, Physics, CompSci; your chosen subjects are content heavy and have limited, if any, overlap. Food for thought.

I did 4 A levels back in the day although one of them was maths. I think there are times when 4 can be useful but I think in your case, doing 4, and the 4 you're doing, would be very disadvantageous. You won't get any more credit really for doing 4 vs getting top grades in 3.

There is no benefit to doing 4 A-levels. The universities will not take it into account when making their offers which will be on 3 A levels. For competitive entry subjects like law, you would be much better focusing your attention on 3 A Levels to maximise your chances of top grades rather than spreading yourself too thin.

The only circumstances where 4 A levels are worthwhile is if one is Further Maths.

I thought taking 4 would give me one insurance e.g. if the offer was A*AA and I ended up with a B or worse in something I thought I would do well in I might still have some other subject as backup

I agree with others that you only need 3 A levels, but if you're coping why don't you see how it goes. You could always drop one later in the year or at the end of year 12.

I wouldn't have thought the school would let you take 4 if they didn't think you would cope.

Is there one that you are less keen on?

@TealDeer020202 I was given a 4-grade offer because I was doing 4. I was not happy about it all and hadn't realised it was a possibility but, such is life. I definitely wouldn't do a 4th as a back up though - what you're more likely to do is do 'okay' in 4 rather than 'very well' at 3. I think it's a very risky choice.

Not as yet as I just started. However my school has said that politics + history or business + Econ overlap too much from the POV of top unis and shouldn't be taken together unless in a four subjects combo. So if that's the case I'll prob drop politics if I have to

What/where were you applying for

Sounds like you're getting good advice at your school. No rush to make a decision as you're not swapping subjects, just dropping one. Good luck

does 4a have any advantage over 3a or say 2a2a over 2a1a

It foolish to do 4. Take 3 and spend more time on each of them to be certain of securing the best grades.

Your school is wrong about politics and history overlapping too much (they might have more of a point re economics and business studies)

i get a bit of a mixed picture on history plus politics and whether unis don't like them together no one seems to have an authoritative opinion

Unis only take the top 3 results. So three stars is better than 2A and 2stars.

Concentrate on 3 and do them well and look at doing super curricula activities that support your application, read books, watch documentaries, visit places, ask questions. But remember to have some fun as well.

You did an EPQ in yr 11 - that is quite unusual isn't it?

I would focus on getting 3 very good a levels and as others have said making sure you work hard this year to get good predicted grades.

Also do look at the student room - has so much info about attainment grades of people doing the courses you want to do.

It's not true that there's no benefit of doing 4 A levels. People who say so, don't really know what they're talking about. If you're applying to oxbridge or other very elite unis, the majority of successful applicants have 4 A levels for most courses including essay ones (even more so for sciences).

For example, History at Oxford: average entry UCAS tariff 196. History at Cambridge, 193. Three A stars is 56×3=168. So most successful applicants had at least 4 A levels to get over 190 points. English had very similar numbers.

How to find this info - choose your course, then click the plus button next to each uni, then "average entry tariff".

www.theguardian.com/education/ng-interactive/2024/sep/07/the-guardian-university-guide-2025-the-rankings

wow thanks so helpful I keep getting bombarded by everyone in school and outside about the uselessness of 4 levels so this is new

That's ok. I advise on this at school as part of my job. People (including teachers) love to give advice based on how they think things should be without actually looking up the stats.

Even many non Oxbridge universities have average entry tariffs of more than 3 A levels. For example I browsed a few more: History at Bristol, 171pt. History at King's, 173pt. Many successful applicants probably had 3 A levels and 1 AS level.

That's just the average, so half of the successful applicants had even more than that.

Most students getting into Oxford and Cambridge are getting A stars or As.

All those statistics show is that some students take 4 A Levels and that some take 3 A Levels and someting like an EPQ, for example. It does not mean your chance of getting into Oxbridge is higher if you take 4 A Levels, and taking 4 A Levels and getting lower results is a poorer result than taking 3 and higher results.

My DD took 3 essay subjects (which had 4 NEAs between them) and an EPQ in year 12, and it was a lot of work. I don't think she could have managed another A Level on top.

So most successful applicants had at least 4 A levels to get over 190 points.

NOOOOOOO!!!! It doesn't mean that at all.

That's ok. I advise on this at school as part of my job. People (including teachers) love to give advice based on how they think things should be without actually looking up the stats.

<head><desk>

If you're going to look up stats, at least understand what you're looking at. Grade 8 piano has 24 points, and EPQ grade A a further 24. So add on one A star, 2 x As and were at 200 points. And unis record the tariff points because they feed into the league tables - not because they want lots of grade 8 pianos.

You categorically don't need 4 A levels to increase your chance of an OxB offer. For the sake of your poor students please DO NOT perpetuate this myth any further.

Oxford PPE - A levels in history, maths and English language plus an EPQ were more than enough for DD. Not even straight A*s required.

Far more applicants have 4 A levels than 3 A levels, grade 8 piano, and an EPQ. Grade 8 piano is fairly rare, and op doesn't mention having it.

By all means there are lots of ways to get up to 190pt. And indeed, half of the successful applicants had below those average tariffs. But 190pt is way higher than "just" 3 A levels, even 3 A stars.

The fact remains that a huge proportion of successful applicants at those unis will have 4 A levels. You can slam your head on the desk as much as you like, you won't make the current UCAS climate less competitive. You can advise based on how you'd like things to be, or how they really are.

But average tariff is only that high because lots have additional tariffable qualifications. It doesn't have to be grade 8 piano. It could be drama, dance and about a billion other qualifications. Have you ever looked at the list of tariff bearing quals? It's huge!

You can assume the average tariff from 3 A levels for an OxB entrant is 2 A stars and an A. A lot will have an EPQ at A, so that's 184 already. Yes of course some will have 4 - in fact some will have 5 or 6. Or full IB marks - way higher!

Seriously, you're wrong. Really wrong. Just because a lot do a 4th/5th/EPQ/Dance doesn't mean the offer is made on that basis. It really isn't. It's MUCH better for students to do 3 and aim for A stars, than 4 and only get As, or even a B.

The high number of tariff points is nothing to do with entrant offers or likelihood of offers, it is everything to do with league table position. Correlation does not equal causation.