How oversubscribed are your local schools? Will they be able to take on students who are currently privately-educated?

[Macaroons]

One of the headline Starmer kept talking about is charging VAT for private schools. This would make private school fees unaffordable for many who are not mega-rich, pushing more students back to the state education system. Would the state schools be able to take in the extra students? Many schools are already over-subscribed, are there enough schools, classrooms and teachers to take in the extra students? My fear is that the extra VAT they get is not going to be enough to provide education for more students under the state system, as well as the additional 6500 teachers they claim they can provide.

School places per LA and nationally 22/23

https://explore-education-statistics.service.gov.uk/data-catalogue/school-capacity/2022-23

Number of schools in England (primary and secondary) number of places, number and % oversubscribed and number and % undersubscribed.

Nationally 18 % oversubscribed and 81% undersubscribed. There is a breakdown per LA which is interesting. Some LAs over 40% oversubscribed. Struggling to see any “there are no places in my LA” areas

I think it may depend on exactly what SEN the child has (this is a very broad range), the degree of that and the school.

some independent schools have amazing support for dyslexia/ dyspraxia.

My DS is extremely disruptive if not carefully controlled but very bright. His current school manages his behaviour through a combination of support / encouragement, stress toys, a special room when it gets too much and a very strict discipline. At you ne point he had a performance chart with ticks for each class. he is doing very well academically under this regime and also does not disruptive to other children.

we will see what happens in state school. I suspect continued academic excellence (I will also support him from home) but also much worse behaviour - unless they can dedicate the same focus to him.

@Zwicky there's an excess of 423 Y7 places for 2025/25 in my "inner London" borough alone + 392 in the neighbouring one, and it's even after private schools' campaign asking parents to apply to state schools to flood councils with applications.
So everyone is welcome to join our diverse and relatively well-performing state schools :)

https://explore-education-statistics.service.gov.uk/data-tables/permalink/9b0f1a4e-682e-49ce-9cd8-08dc8a203a6d

I was talking about secondary schools. Please see the National Offer Day this year. Only one school met all preferences as I said. 26 pupils got no place at all

ups sorry not 26 children were without an offer. 126 children had zero offers on March 1st...

Currently there are 126 children without an offer of a secondary school place, compared with 68 at this time last year.

still problem with see that" there are no places in my LA"?

@TheChipmunkSong it looks like this person was applying from really far away from both Richmond and Kingston boroughs. Like living more then 9 kilometres from RPA? Not getting into Teddington with 6km catchment?
Are you trolling?
There's 256 unoccupied Y7 spaces in Kingston and 193 in Richmond for 2024/25.

I don't believe there're "blind spots" in these 2 boroughs, just stubborn parents thinking they can have their way. Or prove it with a postcode.

There's 256 unoccupied Y7 spaces in Kingston and 193 in Richmond for 2024/25.

I am talking about Richmond Borough. I don't live in Kingston. There is no two headed hydra borough called Richmond and Kingston. Those are two separate boroughs

where exactly in Y7 in Richmond are those places? Can you see the list I copy pasted as the situation on the 1st of March? Can you see the link which states 126 got no offer?

Please do not call people trolls when they give you data and links

it looks like this person was applying from really far away from both Richmond and Kingston boroughs. Like living more then 9 kilometres from RPA? Not getting into Teddington with 6km catchment?

what do you mean by "This person". What person?

The list is showing the radius of offer from the school or nodal point on the 1st of March. People who apply for places are from Richmond and outside.
https://5f2fe3253cd1dfa0d089-bf8b2cdb6a1dc2999fecbc372702016c.ssl.cf3.rackcdn.com/uploads/ckeditor/attachments/15285/LBR_Notes_to_parents_following_secondary_2024_allocation.pdf

@TheChipmunkSong "Can you see the link which states 126 got no offer?"
Yes and I think those people got no offers because they didn't mention nearest non-faith schools in their list, so after 1st of March they are offered what's left.

What's interesting in your list is

1. there're more than 6 schools - don't you get to choose only 6?
2. for Twickenham school it says "All preferences met" - does it mean the application was made outside of application window, or this school was not listed in the preferences initially? Because it looks like they took all the applicants who applied on time.

I work as a Relocation Agent and often help with school finding. When a client says they want to use State schools my heart sinks if they live in some areas, especially if I know that the only places are likley to be at the schools nobody wanted . To be fair 90% of the time these are in year applications

@TheChipmunkSong so Twickenham school took everyone who listed it as one of 6.
126 people wanted to cheat the system not listing one of the least popular schools and now will have to wait, but there's still 193 unoccupied y7 places in the borough as per gov website.

https://explore-education-statistics.service.gov.uk/data-tables/permalink/9b0f1a4e-682e-49ce-9cd8-08dc8a203a6d

Yup. they'll be the people who only put down one school/only oversubscribed schools they fell into the lowest possible criteria for and lived a considerable distance from because a playground lawyer told them 'that way the council will have to give you a place there'.

Others who wouldn't have an offer on NOD would be those whose applications were treated as late or whom failed to apply at all. They would be offered somewhere after the NOD acceptances and refusals/others on waiting lists for higher preference schools/appeal outcomes/private school deposits were paid all caused the lists to shuffle around.

Yes and I think those people got no offers because they didn't mention nearest non-faith schools in their list, so after 1st of March they are offered what's left.

What is "nearest"? Nearest to what?

That "nearest" suggests that you have no idea what is the table showing. This is not a distance to anybody house. This is Distance offered from school

I completely have no idea what you are talking about. And I am afraid you are talking nonsense because you don't understand what you looking at.

The list includes faith and non faith schools

1. there're more than 6 schools - don't you get to choose only 6?

Yes- 6. The problem is that you don't understand what is the list because you don't read carefully. Therefore, the sentence above is a nonsense in the context of this table

or Twickenham school it says "All preferences met" - does it mean the application was made outside of application window, or this school was not listed in the preferences initially?
Because it looks like they took all the applicants who applied on time.

yes, all who applied got the place. But above that is waiting list.

what application- whose application? Again this proves that you have no idea what you talking about. Please click all links I placed above

@TheChipmunkSong so Twickenham school took literally everyone who listed it as one of 6. The one who didn't will be offered one of 193 spaces in the borough after "clearance" - it's not my info, it's from gov.uk.
Problem solved, no need to build a new school at least in Richmond :))

so Twickenham school took everyone who listed it as one of 6.

not quite. Twickenham took anybody who listed Twickenham iF the school listed in the higher priority were not offered.
And now it is filled and have no spaces:oversubscribed

126 people wanted to cheat the system not listing one of the least popular schools and now will have to wait, but there's still 193 unoccupied y7 places in the borough as per gov website.

126 people not necessarily lived close enough to Twickenham to include it. E.g I live on the outer edge of Borough and my son got the school in another county. In the same way the kids from Hounslow, Hammersmith apply to Richmond schools

I don't know how it can be unoccupied y7 list. I know several kids on waiting lists who had randomly allocated school not on their list. And they are upset as it is far. Still hoping

It doesn't work like this that you list Twickenham and everybody who lists it gets it. - No. If they listed Orlean first and Twickenham 6th but they live by Orlean they got Orlean.
The corrected sentence is: everybody who listed Twickenham had an offer from the list because if they didn't get other schools they got Twickenham.

126 people have not had Twickenham in their preferences 1-6 for variety of reasons: didn't want or it was too far.

@TheChipmunkSong but there were no surprises in places allocation this year. Turing's catchment shrunk a bit and Orleans widened a bit. So people could easily predict their chances and list a reliable back-up as well to not leave it to the council.

You are jumping too quick to conclusions. You assume that everybody mastered the way how the system works. Look, a second ago you had no idea what the list I posted was and kept talking as if it was somebody's application results.

Look how ethnically diverse is London. Many people cannot understand the system.
Also, what is the point of applying to Twickenham school if your child has to travel 2-3 busses for 1 hour to get there?

At some point people like you are going to have to understand the vast majority of people in this country don't give a fuck about VAT on private schools, in fact its very popular, please stop making threads about it

There are currently no places in at least one secondary year in Richmond Borough. I enquired to see what my options would be only to be told there are currently no spaces.

exactly. I have no idea how there are 93 as per the comments here.
The only chance that the spaces will be located is if some kids got an offer to private school but forgot or intentionally not notify the Council- killing two birds with one stone. In Sept they may decide on private and release state place

Lots of places around. Maybe not at the popular schools and certainly not 'private school standard buildings/sport facilities' but no one would be turned down a placement.

State school parents and children don't always have a say or a choice of placement so honestly I don't care a lot if private school parents and children have it or not in a transistion from private to state.

@TheChipmunkSong "Also, what is the point of applying to Twickenham school if your child has to travel 2-3 busses for 1 hour to get there?"

Council can't build "outstanding" schools at the front gates of every 126 of the applicants who could't comprehend the system. Someone will have to adjust.

Council can't build "outstanding" schools at the front gates of every 126 of the applicants who could't comprehend the system. Someone will have to
adjust.

You making a lot of very basic uneducated statements yet expecting people to comprehend the admission rules
. There is max time set that the council can expect a child to travel. -45. This is statutory.

It is not always that simple that worse schools are the one without the waiting list.
Also, Twickenham school is not bad at all- simply it is big school and that is why it filled the slowest and is very close to Turing. Hampton High has worse results.

and at the moment in Twickenham school there is zero places for Y7