Standard of MFL teaching in my son's school driving me nuts

[Ferniebrook]

My son is in an inner city comp and is generally having a very good experience. However the MFL teaching is dire. I realised this because I have A level standard Spanish and started digging around into what he is doing because his marks were so much lower than other subjects. I went into the school, wrote to the head etc. I also looked at the school's data and realise MFL progress for high prior attainers was very low compared to other subjects. Hardly anyone getting above a 6, mostly 5s. The head said they have an issue with recruitment and are trying to raise standards, but know there is a problem.

The Spanish teacher was clearly v upset I did this and then insisted that he should do foundation despite him getting very high marks in any assessments. He just did another assessment and got over 90% again and she has now conceded he should do higher. However, I went over his paper and he did a good job, but there are errors in it which she has not bothered to correct, really quite basic errors to be honest. I am so cross about this and that she is letting the children down but I can't complain again because I know she is being vindictive and will probably say OK he has to do foundation (or give him behaviour points which he never got until I complained). Homework is sporadic and there are often mistakes in the homework or the task doesn't make sense.

I am already giving him a lot of support at home and thinking I might go back to the head end of the year with examples of incorrect marking. Any thoughts? So sad that it has come to this for MFL. No wonder vast majority can't wait to stop.

Needed a vent! Thanks for reading

(I mean keeping quiet as a general population. I don't expect @Ferniebrook to mount a one-woman campaign outside her school)

I have plenty of sympathy for teachers, but surely things will only get worse if the public puts up with teachers who are not equipped to teach their subject. What about the children who don't have educated parents who can help them out with the subjects the school can't teach properly?

@ColouringPencils I wonder what you think should be done. You mention voting - yes I do think that years and years of Tory rule has not helped the situation.

The public is "putting up with this" by voting in the Tories again and again. Maybe many people don't care. I have certainly had the experience of calling a parent about their child, only to be told "we don't value German at all anyway".

I agree that the DC whose parents cannot help them or do not know that they need to are the ones who will suffer the most. But if there are no good experienced MFL teachers applying for jobs what do you do?

I am far from being the only ex-MFL teacher on MN - or even on this thread. I am never going back to teach in a school - the workload, the behaviour, the ridiculous expectations just ground me down and I took a pay cut to leave.

I agree the situation is appalling. I could give you a way to solve it but it would cost money. The situation in teaching in general is poor. I have a group of friends, former teachers of MFL and humanities; at one point we all taught together. Of the 15 or so of us, at least five of us have left classroom teaching, tho we are still working in educational roles.

My son is the same. He is predicted 8-9 in every subject, but 5-6 in Spanish (despite being best in his class, so I'm not sure how the rest are going to manage). I got him group tuition in Jan which is quite reasonable and making a big difference. He still has the whole of Y11 too to improve. He's very talented naturally at language so I want to give him the option to take it to A level as he's totally unsure what he wants to do.

His school teach French and Spanish to Y10 then it's just an option, not compulsory, so you'd think they get kids who want to do it - but they are already behind, having done 2 languages (compulsory) at a basic level (not streamed) for 3 years.

I think it's really sad the hit that MFL has taken. It's just not valued or taken seriously by the government, and therefore schools. Maths, science, English and then schools sometimes specialise (his school is performing arts).

I used to teach and in our inner city school the French teacher was actually the art teacher who, bless her, let slip she had spent 6 months in Paris in her youth so was put in the French classroom when the resident French teacher quit. LIKE, you'll do!
MFL recruitment and retention is a MYTH

There are two options.

The public puts up with teachers who are not very good (either because they are new or teaching out of their specialism or whatever).

Or they don't.

What would not putting up with it look like?

It might look like changing school. But generally the schools that have good teachers and are fully staffed are full anyway and hard to get into. So you can't really change within the state system. You could go private and that would be better teaching but would be expensive.

You could complain. Realistically if the school can recruit a specialist they will, and the more complaints the more likely they are to try. But many schools are cutting back on GCSE options now, partially because school budgets have taken a hammering and also because they are hard to staff even if you do have the money.

What else do you think parents can do to "not put up with it?"

Sounds a very similar scenario. Best of luck!!

Of course, MFL is graded more harshly than other subjects. Research shows at least half a grade. We have been pointing it out for years.

This is so depressing.

It really isn't the government that's wholly to blame. It's Brexit and the people who don't care about other European cultures. We have millions of them. It's now something to be proud of. Of course it lets our young people down,

DD did MFL at uni. One of her friends became a MFL teacher but in a prep school. Another dc from primary school teaches MFL. Her DM is a MFL teacher and DF is a head so they are keeping it in the family! My DD had no intention of teaching if she could avoid it.I know it's not a popular view but many dc just walk a mile from teaching unless they are dc of teachers. Many teachers I know have dc who teach so clearly some people love it!

The poor leadership in some schools doesn't help and who wants to teach something the vast majority don't care about and neither does SLT. If a school cannot identify and improve poor teaching, it's not an attractive place to work.

Fluency in MFL can be improved very easily at home with Duolingo. It really really helps. I'd encourage him to do a small amount every day.

We went on strike last year? We got a load of flack for it and were told we were greedy and lazy.

This isn’t just a languages thing or to do with Brexit. I’m a maths teacher and there are kids in my school who haven’t had a maths teacher all year, just supply. Their parents would have similar complaints if they looked in their books - lack of marking, basic errors etc. There’s literally nothing we can have done differently as there are no teachers. Once Y11 and Y13 have gone we’re going to pick up extra classes so they have at least some of the year with a teacher. We’ve had A-level classes having to teach themselves in other subjects for most of the year due to no teacher.

It’s absolutely depressing.

OP, there’s a website called italki where you can book conversation with native speakers. I recommend it highly - it’s not as expensive as tuition but will really help with fluency.

I woul also recommend the bbc bitesize website for practice of the GCSE topics.
I doubt politicians of any party have MFL as one of their priorities anyway. What we need is consistent funding and commitment to start MFL earlier in primary schools and give it sufficient time. The current "entitlement" is a joke and provision varies hugely. My child had 5 lessons of French in the whole of year 5. When I expressed surprise it was so few the child said they were actually meant to have had 7 but the specialist teacher wasn't in on 2 of them! I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.

I have plenty of sympathy for teachers, but surely things will only get worse if the public puts up with teachers who are not equipped to teach their subject.

How exactly do the public go about not putting up with it though? What form would that take? You can't force people to become teachers! The only thing you can really do is wrote to your local MP, I guess, and then when the general election comes, vote for a party who you think might do something about it.

Labour announced today that they would recruit 6,500 more teachers, using the private school VAT money. But how they propose to do that when people don't want to train to be teachers, I have no idea. They are putting the cart before the horse. The only way to improve recruitment and retention is to change things about the job, not just to shout 'We want more teachers'!

@AllProperTeaIsTheft

That announcement from Labour was a total whitewash. A total misunderstanding of the problem. Where are these teachers coming from?.

Too many schools are not great places to work. Vast numbers of secondary schools are academies. That was a Labour policy. They thought choice mattered more to parents. I suspect it didn't. Good schools matter more but creating schools where no one wants to work is just going backwards.

Poor SLT is not tackled and it's these people and Mat executives on high pay who need to be accountable for making a school a decent place to work. Grads vote with their feet. They know schools are not great places to work. They look at the working atmosphere and unhappy teachers for years and simply don't want that for their working lives.

Some schools are fantastic places to work. They are supportive of teachers and have decent parents. Those with challenges find it more difficult to recruit. Nothing has changed and nothing will change with VAT money. Other than more dc diverting from private education into the better schools.

I am sorry but I have completely opposite view.
It drives me crazy the thought that children are only learning in order to achieve a good result in exams. The main purpose is to gain knowledge and especially with a language to learn to speak this language.
OP you should continue challenging the school and demand better MFL provision/teaching but also push your DS with a tutor or try yourself if you can following curriculum and using books rather than just on ad-hoc basis

We cannot recruit maths and science teachers so should we give up on those subjects too? It's a ridiculous argument to say give up. Brexit was so damaging in more ways than we ever imagined!

Yes, most of us are not easily able to move state schools, but the usual way to not put up with things is by making yourself a pain in the arse to people who have some kind of ability to make change, which might be writing to head teacher, school governors, local authority, local MP, education secretary...
Voting in a way that reflects the things you care about, and if you feel confident to do so, explaining why to others. Making a fuss (in writing) so you are harder to ignore.
Making your feelings known won't magic teachers out of thin air, but it makes it harder for people to pretend it's all okay when really it is not.
Since so many people are having the same problem, it's clearly not at school level and it sounds like it is not just to do with MFL either.
Some teachers on this thread seem to think they are being blamed for the lack of other teachers, which makes no sense. Nobody is blaming you, we are on your side and believe in education; we want more of you, trained to a high standard and teaching subjects you are specialists in. I actually think the best way we as parents can defend education is by highlighting where cuts reduce standards and that we are not happy with it. Far more voters are parents than are teachers...

Update: son has told me said teacher is leaving end of the year. This is the ‘it can get worse scenario’. That will be two vacancies in a small dept - no idea how they will cope. Already one other teacher teaching with virtually no Spanish. Motivated me to crack on with the sessions at home!

I'm glad a couple of people have recommended Duolingo as I'm never quite sure how useful it is. Even though I have a really long streak in French I'm not sure how I would fare in France. My son y10 does Duolingo most nights and I'm sure it helps reinforce what they're learning at school. When my kids have not understood topics I've suggested they look them up on YouTube which is a great resource.

I think all these things are useful but with my son and where he is I think verbs (and other key grammar)/ vocab mixed in with some topic based practice of reading/ listening etc is most beneficial. I can really target it this way. Anything will help though - but if the teaching is really lacking you have to tackle the fundamentals imo

There are some good YouTube videos for revision. Bitesize is quite good, particularly as it gives the question types.
I might be able to recruit two new experienced members of staff this week to my department. Please keep your fingers crossed that they are good and they want to come to us!

You are right, but it might be best you stop here. Look at what you are actually trying to achieve. Isn't it best to just focus on ds, his grade, apps and support etc.
I have fought twice, once massively, and now see things differently.
What's really sad is once you realise that complaining achieves nothing, even in a good school. If they were that bothered the Head, and HoD would've looked at what you presented before and made subtle changes. But he didn't did he. Sadly.

I am focusing on DS, given teacher is leaving would make even less sense.

Best of luck!

I'm struggling with my yr 10 ds2 in Spanish, but also generally, aswell op. So thanks for the thread. Has prompted me to also start doing more behind the scenes to help him. I've already done some for maths, English, science. Spanish is next.