Standard of MFL teaching in my son's school driving me nuts

[Ferniebrook]

My son is in an inner city comp and is generally having a very good experience. However the MFL teaching is dire. I realised this because I have A level standard Spanish and started digging around into what he is doing because his marks were so much lower than other subjects. I went into the school, wrote to the head etc. I also looked at the school's data and realise MFL progress for high prior attainers was very low compared to other subjects. Hardly anyone getting above a 6, mostly 5s. The head said they have an issue with recruitment and are trying to raise standards, but know there is a problem.

The Spanish teacher was clearly v upset I did this and then insisted that he should do foundation despite him getting very high marks in any assessments. He just did another assessment and got over 90% again and she has now conceded he should do higher. However, I went over his paper and he did a good job, but there are errors in it which she has not bothered to correct, really quite basic errors to be honest. I am so cross about this and that she is letting the children down but I can't complain again because I know she is being vindictive and will probably say OK he has to do foundation (or give him behaviour points which he never got until I complained). Homework is sporadic and there are often mistakes in the homework or the task doesn't make sense.

I am already giving him a lot of support at home and thinking I might go back to the head end of the year with examples of incorrect marking. Any thoughts? So sad that it has come to this for MFL. No wonder vast majority can't wait to stop.

Needed a vent! Thanks for reading

ex MFL teacher here who dips in and out as a long term supply . I suspect this more about curriculum structure in the school and the dept rather than the individual teacher themselves . Sounds like they are behind and still in the worksheet era for producing coursework circa 2009 which frankly didn’t teach the students how to write in the target language or give them much confidence .

The methodology of teaching and language teaching has changed dramatically in the last decade. The higher exam is very difficult and needs students to be trained up from yr 7 . Covid has a huge impact . Gianfranco Conti and Steve Smith have been influential in curriculum design . Check out the website Language Gym . A lot of schools are ditching text books and following these principles just catching up on redesigning the curriculum . I know I took six years out and almost had to “retrain”in the art of teaching mfl rejoining a school I previously taught in .

IM recent experience in an excellent department yr10 the only written pieces of work that would be marked would be practice pieces for the writing exam and model answers for the speaking exam built up slowly over the 18 months in a folder / project book rather than an exercise book.The quality of feedback to students and what they need to do next would being scrutinised by the head of dept and senior curriculum leaders what ever the dept . It should be following a whole school very detailed policy . So I don’t think you’re getting the whole story here from the head. It’s not just about a lack of teachers but experienced well trained teachers which cost money . I’ve left teaching. I went back twice but it’s really hard but that’s another thread entirely !

Ex book is used for note taking and probably doesn’t have much marking to be fair . Students would have knowledge organiser with key structures. I’d expect to see the student was using this ,& annotating it I’d expect a student to peer mark / ( green penning / purple pen ) reading comprehension answers set for hmwk and we’d address any misconceptions . Not something I would set particularly to mark myself . Multiple choice type answers tick and flick is not something teachers have time to do and is pretty pointless for all . How do I know they didn’t copy their mates ? I might set a google quiz for immediate digital feedback but these take time to set up so students can’t cheat and I was self taught.

Language teaching is resource heavy . The excellent dept I worked in set a weekly vocabulary test using Quizlet resources and tracked progress there . You can subscribe yourself and make your own if you really wanted just using the vocabulary lists published in aqa . There’s a tonne of resources sourced through Twitter and yes . If you google aqa Spanish you often find other schools knowledge organisers online . I’d echo what a previous poster said about using the aqa website . Duolingo will only get you so far - it’s a fun accessible way and handy but not designed to help you pass a GCSE . You need have a look at Conti and the language gym series plus his website . He publishes GCSE materials

A lot of Spanish teachers post resources on Twitter and lots of schools post their KO’s too on heir website just google a topic with PDF / PPt and you find all sorts . To be fair you won’t get 789s on 3 hours teaching face to face a week . The student has to put work in themselves at home to master and practise the concepts taught in class using sites like language gym , past papers , Quizlet etc . Or a tutor . Interestingly a previous poster mentioned VIVA . I liked this text book . The digital version with the listening was free during Covid . Again only schools with healthy budgets can afford logins for their students

Yes the language has not changed but there is a lot of content at GCSE and bit overwhelming for a yr 10 . It can feel a bit abstract until they’ve got a few past papers under their belts and see they can achieve with some graft . The curriculum is a bit bloated and as I understand it is changing again with elements such as dictation . Good luck !

Sadly as a very recent head of MFL, I don’t find this surprising! I left a very good (although rapidly declining) school but even in its glory days when people were banging on the door to get a job, it was always difficult to recruit what I would call quality candidates for MFL. For my second mat leave a few years ago many of my KS3 classes were taught by maths and history teachers neither of whom had even an A-level in a language. Desperate times. I left last year and my role still isn’t filled by a long term, qualified member of staff. Another member of the department is leaving soon and there’s been no interest in that job either. Very sad for the kids.

In terms of what you’re doing, it sounds like you’re doing a great job with the TES resources etc…there’s some great grammar and vocab resources. Duolingo is also fab! I use it to learn new languages. The oak academy resources that the government produced in lockdown are also well worth a look as they are taught by specialists.

also you can export any Quizlet vocab list to a website called “ blooket” it turns them into a sort of computer flash card game with little rewards . The basic version is free but my kids used at ks3 more but I had a yr11 student who was completed addicted to it and swore it was the only thing that kept him engaged learning vocab and he did improve drastically ! . Boys tend to like for a bit as a bit of a novelty as Quizlet can be a bit monotonous but that’s the nature of the rote learning element in langs I’m afraid . It’s just another way of shaking up the revision for a bit . I’m not a Spanish specialist but I get by helping my son with chatgpt checking answers ot grammar points as an “expert” . It’s just knowing again what prompt to put it to get the right answer and double checking on google translate . Not easy I know !

Dont worry about the dictation element BTW @Ferniebrook it doesn't come in till 2026 exams

Thanks so much all - I got the OllyMfL grammar guide from TES - that is really helping us. I'm definitely going to look at Quizlet!

Has anyone got any tips on getting started? I have searched Spanish GCSE AQA and there is so much content, slightly overwhelming...

I mean with Quizlet!

Try and find quizlets that match the vocab pages of the text book that follows the syllabus areas of study eg VIVA - look for content creators who are teachers eg made up examples MrsSspanish MFL and see what their whole content is. See if there is an aqa Spanish as a content creator . There were German ones. Or another easy was is to search aqa Spanish gcse under classes section and you will see where a particular school and that MFL dept has published their sets for their students and the more organised ones will have done the hard work for you ! You can use them as they are public and again if you sign up for a subscription you can copy them and adapt them as you wish - add pic prompts .

I would do the repair work yourself over the summer. My dc both did a MFL GCSE in private school and in fact, the situation was just the same. It seems that this is what MFLs have become these days. Teacher turnover meant 3 teachers in 3 years (for both kids at separate times!). The syllabus was not fully covered, there didn’t seem to be regular vocab tests. It was all very strange and shit and I’m glad both gave languages up after their GCSEs. There are staff shortages and often teachers are teaching a language that they don’t really want to teach - it’s at least their third language. DS knows several people who did really badly in Spanish and French.

luckily you are in a position to sort it

If you get hold of this textbook turn to the vocab pages at the end of each unit. At the top of each vocab list is a code for example 1.1f (for foundation).
On Quizlet search “AQA GCSE SPANISH 1.1f” and that vocab list will come up.

Make your way through all of the vocab lists in the textbook.

Hi I don't mean to be harsh but a lot of schools would only realistically be preparing children to get a 5 in all subjects. This is only one subject and personally I would try and support his learning in spanish outside of school rather than complain any further.

Interesting so bad in a private school - I thought it would be better. Some of my DS’s friends got 2s in the last assessment, compared to 6s/7s in other subjects. Agh. Onwards and upwards and so grateful for all the advice and sharing here

Honestly? Get a tutor, sign him up to Duolingo, visit Spain, consider sending your child to a language camp over one of the holidays if that is something they will cope with.

If the school isn’t teaching him, you’ll have to plug the gaps yourself unfortunately.

Wow, what a depressing thread.

It shouldn't be up to parents or children to put up with substandard teaching in case the school decides it is too much hassle and stops teaching the subject altogether!

I have plenty of sympathy for teachers, but surely things will only get worse if the public puts up with teachers who are not equipped to teach their subject. What about the children who don't have educated parents who can help them out with the subjects the school can't teach properly?

If a school is only preparing their higher prior attainers to get 5s in all subjects their progress 8 would be extremely low, because that would be 1-2 grades lower than they should get. I don’t know any local comps who wouldn’t generally be trying for 6/7s + for high prior attainers. I do take the point from you and others about not complaining again..I feel we have a good (if laborious) plan and will stiick to it!

I agree, but I think the point some on here have made well is that the school prob has no options so complaining is unlikely to achieve anything positive when the school is aware of the problem. If a child doesn’t have parents who can help or pay for a tutor they would get a low grade. But many children/ parents don’t value MFL so prob not overly concerned…how many adults do you know with a decent level of second language? Having a working knowledge of a second language is not common. We don’t value it. It’s all a cycle of decline…

I have just taken over as HoD of MFL in our school and the teacher we got to cover my boss's maternity leave quit after two days. So in the three weeks I have been in charge I have spent every day setting cover work that could be done by a cover teacher. Now another member of the department has got another job and there is the very real possiblity that it will just be me and a trainee in September to cover year 13 and 8 GCSE classes. I am not thinking about KS3! MFL teachers are like hen's teeth where I am and schools need to be doing everything they can to keep them. I am sorry you are having to plug the gaps with your child. The whole situation is becoming increasingly untenable.

Fair enough for you as one parent to not kick up a fuss, but for the general tone of a mumsnet thread to be so defeatist and with such low expectations of schools is very depressing to me. If you put up with crap, that's what you will get. A school may think they are doing well enough putting a non-specialist in year 10 and (ffs) year 12, because nobody is complaining. Obviously one way to deal with this is in the way we vote in the general election, but I also think schools have to take responsibility for the quality of teaching.

Where will you get those teachers from @ColouringPencils ? We haven't had any applicants and even agencies don't seem to have anyone suitable.

@tadjennyp As a parent, it's not my job to find the teachers. But acting like it is my job kind of justifies my point - just like this thread suggests it should be my job to plug the gaps in education left by substandard teaching. Clearly huge change is required, but the idea that parents and children should just put up with crap is also part of the problem.

What if the schools then just stop languages? The teachers are not there. I’m not happy at all, but I think I’d be less happy if the school followed some others and stopped altogether

I absolutely don't think parents and children should put up with crap @ColouringPencils , or that it is up to you to plug gaps. I am, however, concerned that we won't get anybody apply for the posts in our department and would rather have somebody crap than nobody at all. At least I could work with them and help improve them. Setting cover work almost permanently is far worse for the students. As I am sure you are aware, the government keeps missing their recruitment targets for trainees, particularly in subjects like MFL, science, computer science. They also don't give a stuff about retention of experienced teachers hence people leaving the profession left, right and centre. We are at the stage where things are about to fall over. I don't know what the answer is, unfortunately.

No school wants to put a non-specialist in front of a class, especially a GCSE class, but if they can't find a qualified teacher, what are they supposed to do, even if parents complain? I work in an MFL department in a fantastic, highly over-subscribed grammar school. We just advertised for a new Head of MFL. We had one applicant. One! If schools like mine can't attract teachers, lord knows how other schools manage. Well... they don't.

We are such a school. Small town, over 40% PP, not a great reputation. Very hard to improve if you can't get the staff...

The main answer might be about how people vote in the general election, but I also think part of it is raising awareness about falling standards, if that's what is happening, because then you justify the need for change. Just keeping quiet and putting up with it does nobody any favours.