Anyone heard from Tiffin Boys Sixth Form - interviews?

[Vive42]

DD is keen to go to Tiffin Boys for sixth form.

We found on another forum website that by now, last year, a lot of people were having interviews and had heard from the school.

So far we've received no further communications from Tiffin Boys about DD's application.

Posting here to see if anyone is having interviews and if we should expect a rejection. 😞

Thanks but I think it's too late for us to challenge, it says the deadline is 15 May for admission to Sep 2025.

We had an interesting parents evening session on Wednesday... in one of my DD's subjects the teacher apologized for a marking mistake. My DD had 7 in her Feb mock report and should have been a 8, and in fact she said she was a few marks off 9. This is my DD's least favourite teacher... the only one she dislikes. She is lucky to have really good teachers in all subjects in KS4.

She's now changed my DD's predicted grade to 9 for that subject. This goes to show how subjective these predicted grades offers are...

"Thanks but I think it's too late for us to challenge, it says the deadline is 15 May for admission to Sep 2025."

@anoukis no, not too late. Getting an adjudication on the 2025 policy would benefit next year's applicants directly, but also indirectly help anyone who decides to appeal in 2024. That's because the 2024 admissions policy is the same as the 2025 policy (apart from a few minor immaterial changes), so a judgement of non-compliance on the 2025 policy effectively applies to the 2024 policy too. The school couldn't be ordered to change the 2024 policy, but the judgement could be used as watertight evidence in appeals.

Hi I have a question for the group. I was comparing Tiffin’s 2023 A level results by subject, with our current school Waldegrave’s results. The subjects my daughter wants to do are Eng Lit, History and Psychology. For Eng Lit, the schools compare fairly evenly, slightly higher A* but based on small different in actual numbers of students, history was stronger at Tiffin, but Psychology was stronger at Waldegrave. Given Waldegrave is completely non selective, is this quite surprising?

@AnnieHack no, it's not surprising at all. Firstly, Waldegrave isn't completely non-selective. It selects by:

• House price / parental planning;
• Enjoyment of and adaptability to Waldegrave's culture (for internal students);
• The ability for external students to navigate a complex sixth-form admissions process (including technical challenges such as uploading identity documents in the student's name that they may or may not have, such as provisional driving licence, mobile phone contract, utility bill, bank statement)
• Last and probably least, the minimum grade requirements in the appendix of the admissions policy (which are lower than Tiffin's).

Also, Waldegrave's strong academic reputation probably means that it can be equally (or even more) selective of its staff as Tiffin. Many teachers would prefer to work in a leafy girls' school than an academically selective boys' school.

Remember also that:

• Tiffin's internal 2023 A level cohort (the majority) were selected based on highly tutor-able verbal and non-verbal reasoning tests at age 10, which isn't a reliable predictor of A level performance.
• Their 2025+ A level cohort was selected at age 10 based on maths & english tests. They reportedly had stronger GCSE performance, so are reasonably likely to have stronger A level performance too.
• In very small departments like Psychology, performance is very dependent on individual staff members, who can't be relied on not to retire, move schools, go on maternity leave, go long-term sick, etc etc.
• A quick google will tell you that Psychology A Level is much more popular with girls than with boys. It is therefore likely to be one of the 'harder to fill' courses at Tiffin, potentially with a lower entry-grade profile than some other subjects.

It looks like Eng Lit is much more popular with girls than boys too. Here is the info about gender balance for A level subjects: https://ffteducationdatalab.org.uk/2021/09/which-a-level-subjects-have-the-best-and-worst-gender-balance/

That's not surprising. Most kids I know in Tiffins are focused on STEM subjects and economics, where their parents see the most lucrative job prospects. Humanities subjects are less of a priority. It would be mostly kids from other schools who join at A level,who would bump up their grades. Including some of the best kids from one of the many excellent comprehensives in the area.

Still no news from tiffin boys though of course we’re not at the end of April yet.

We did hear of a boy who lives a few roads away from us being offered an interview and place though. We don’t know the subjects he’s applied for so not much help, only that things are continuing onwards. Not hopeful for DD.

Before Easter we have been invited with our daughter for the school tour and have received conditional offer. Now we have received official email with the offer subject to achieving the minimum entry criteria and additional condition which requires to achieve grade 9 in Mathematics and grade 7 in English Literature and Physics

@OsWasp congrats and thanks for sharing with the group. Still not a word for us. My DD is so disappointed that her friend whose grades are lower got an offer and she didn't. Also our school is super conservative with predicted grades and the teacher told us that they don't like predicting 9s - yet at this late stage they have upped her predicted grades in the last April report which I sent through but cant help thinking it is now too late. 😥

@Richmond001 without being too outing, did your DD apply for full set of STEM subjects? Only STEM?

I'm wondering if adding in an arts subject might have secured a place so for instance similar to what OsWasp has mentioned above.

We know of one DD who has applied for full arts, even though she's very good at maths.

DD has applied for full set of STEM subjects and so far no news and we are not expecting good news now.

@Vive42 I think your theory probably holds up. My DDs friend who got in chose all humanities and my DD chose math plus humanities subjects. Although it might be a sound approach to choose all humanities for the purpose of selection I wouldn't want to influence my DDs choices and get her to do subjects she might not prefer to get in. We do have an excellent comprehensive backup so all is not lost but she is disappointed having put all the hard work in.

My daughter has applied for Maths, History and French. Heard nothing, all 8’s in mocks.

I think it’s the Maths that will be the most oversubscribed. At the Grammar my DD has an offer for, anybody who applied for Maths had to do an entry test. Even people we know who can get a 9 in maths very easily, (and one who holds an 6th form scholarship place in maths for a very desirably private school), were rejected.

I spoke to the admissions lady and she told me that the interview choice is not linear so I presume the subject choice has a huge bearing . She said the letter in April 30 th would clarify things including the wait list process. A friend whose son is there told us that choosing Maths is a huge deal in terms of numbers . Their son’s friend from Teddington did not have great grades and yet got admission .

Hi, just asked my DD again to be sure and I was actually wrong about her friend. Her friend chose Maths, Biology and two humanities. So very similar to my DDs choices although different humanities choices yet she got in and assume my DD didn't so still super confusing. The lack of clarity of criteria is super frustrating. and her DD has lower marks.

"not linear" that sounds like it could mean anything - e.g. if we like the look of your child and school... 😉

Sorry perhaps I should be as clear as possible, I had asked that an interview was unlikely given my daughter had not 9s only 7s &8s in her mocks. I asked this more than once and she kept saying it is non linear dependent on a few factors. I asked if this included reference from school , she said ermm not really. Then I asked if subject choice was a key factor, then she became animated and said there woulld be a clear explanation from April 30th. I reitterated my daughter's grades once again asking if it was probable that she would not get a place. She said things were not so definitive-she kept using the phrase 'non linear' ! She did say children get in once they have their results each year.

"She said things were not so definitive-she kept using the phrase 'non linear'!"

Non linear = "our assessment of" the predicted grades = subjective, and therefore in breach of the admissions code.

From page 7 of the national admissions code:

Do they not use predicted average point score? Seems quite clear to me. The popular courses (maths, physics, chemistry, economics etc) will fill up quickly with internal students, so to get on those courses you’ll need a much higher APS. You’d probably get in with quite a low APS to do languages, English, music, RS etc.

Gosh , it is so confusing . I guess we all have to wait and see . My husband thinks it is crazy analysing it as it appears luck of the draw apart from those with straight 9s & potential Oxbridge students .

Hi! I've been following this thread as I am also very interested to see what is happening regarding interviews and offers and would love to understand more clearly how it all works as it does seem to be rather ambiguous! My son has applied with a full set of predicted level 9 grades (he's predicted to get 10 GCSEs at level 9 and 1 at level 8) - Level 9's in the subjects he wishes to study at A level. We also haven't heard anything yet, other than they generic email to say they are still looking at all the applications, so it's not looking promising for us either, in spite of the high predictions of grades. We live very near to the school - 1 mile away - so can only presume it's because my son has applied for STEM subjects, which are more heavily subscribed to by the existing cohort and leaving little to no room for incoming students??

When the rejection letters come out they should include information about how to appeal. The attached paragraph about the right to appeal is from the national admissions code.

It's a bit confusing for sixth form though because none of the offers are confirmed until August. However, when predicted grades are used to decide who gets a conditional offer, someone with a conditional offer is in a better position than someone without a conditional offer. This was mentioned in the Twyford school adjudicator decision, which ruled that use of predicted grades was a breach of the code: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/twyford-church-of-england-high-school-15-july-2022

@safaristar wow a full set of 9s except for one 8?! Yes it must be that the STEM subjects are already fully subscribed to within the existing cohort. It's disappointing for us all with kids who are very bright and worked really hard but no chance of a place.

I'm really glad you posted because my DD has slightly lower level than your DS's but not by much and therefore we can pretty much assume now no offer based on the fact that there's just no room, not that her results weren't good enough.

It seems like anyone getting an offer has at least one or more arts subjects mixed in.

And at least this thread if it is found in the future will help others realise that applying to Tiffin Boys wanting to do full STEM is pretty much a non-starter and maybe not to bother!

@safaristar WOW! all 9s and yet no offer - proof, that decisions are #non-linear ☠ We all try to teach our children that hard work pays off and yet, instances like these can really demotivate children and makes our jobs so much harder to keep our children motivated. But on the positive side our children will be taught resilience in the face of rejection, however I would much rather my DD feels she is actually rewarded for her hard work. Makes fundamental sense that offers based on prediction is unfair. Would be interesting if one could put in a freedom of information request to actually see where their biases are because my conclusion is that there are definite biases in their selection process. Do they prefer certain schools, backgrounds, subject combinations etc etc... All in all super disappointing but as mentioned by @Vive42 at least threads like these will open other applicants' eyes. I cannot imagine this can be good exposure for Tiffin.