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Secondary education

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Advice regarding informal complaint to school.

60 replies

Redwineandsunshine · 24/11/2023 16:47

At the very end of summer term my 11 year old daughter went on a school trip for 2 nights/3 days.

She came home obviously very ill, with a fever and a badly infected elbow. We had to take her straight to a&e where she was admitted for 6 days of iv antibiotics (plus then tablet antibiotics for a few days once discharged) and was given a diagnosis of cellulitis and lymphangitis. The cellulitis was very severe looking (very red with a large ‘crater’). There was even talk of her having to have surgery but fortunately the surgeon she saw decided it wasn’t necessary.

During this school trip she complained twice, to two different teachers of a painful arm, once on the first evening and once at lunchtime on the third day.

The teacher she told on the first day had a look at her arm and as there was nothing obvious there told her to put a wet towel on it. However, on the third day she asked the other teacher for a plaster for her arm as it was hurting but her arm wasn’t even looked at and she was told there was no plasters available.

I picked her up from the school trip late afternoon/evening and spoke to the first teacher (who was in charge of the trip) to say thank you. This teacher mentioned nothing to me about her problems with her arm during the trip. It was only when we got home and saw it ourselves we realised how badly infected it was.

I had been in touch initially with the teacher in change of the trip to find out exactly what happened and how she came home so ill. He was going to find out if the other teacher had looked at her arm on the third day but I never heard back from him about that particular question.

Once autumn term started I left it a couple of weeks then got in touch with the head teacher to discuss what had happened and that I hadn’t had an answer regarding whether her arm was looked at on the third day, and also to complain that I wasn’t told
anything at pick up. She said she’d find out but I didn’t hear anything.

I saw the head on an unrelated issue at the beginning of last month, and mentioned that I still hadn’t had the answers I was waiting for and that I was really unhappy, disappointed and obviously very upset by the whole thing. I was asked if I wanted to make a formal complaint which I said I didn’t, I just wanted answers and a reassurance this wouldn’t happen again.

The head told me she still hadn’t spoken to the other teacher which I don’t actually believe. She’d had weeks to speak to her at this point.

Anyway, weeks later and I’ve still heard nothing. Im not sure what to do now? I can obviously get in touch with the head again but I’ve asked these questions 3 times already.

The schools policy on informal complaints is to respond within 10 days. I’ve been waiting weeks now. Has anyone else been in a similar situation or have any advice on moving this forward. I’d still rather avoid a formal complaint as I’m not sure if it’s justified in this case. Any advice gratefully received. Thank you

OP posts:
MidnightOnceMore · 24/11/2023 16:56

Why do you want to 'avoid' a formal complaint?

Something this serious, just send it in.

NotquitewhatImeant · 24/11/2023 16:59

I’d think it definitively warrants a formal complaint. You don’t need to second guess yourself, you should be upset and they do need to have steps in place to ensure that never happens again

Redwineandsunshine · 24/11/2023 17:01

I suppose I’m not sure if it’s the right thing. What kind of answers would I get with a formal complaint that I wouldn’t with an informal one? I’ve never done either before and I guess I assumed things could be resolved informally, but yes it is serious and if I’m not getting answers then it’s probably necessary.

OP posts:
Redwineandsunshine · 24/11/2023 17:06

Thank you. I really appreciate both responses.

I’ll think about this over the weekend and put something together to send in on Monday. I feel like I’ve been fobbed off by the school over something so serious and making a formal complaint seems so drastic but perhaps is the best way to go now.

OP posts:
Lifeinlists · 24/11/2023 17:10

They have failed in their safeguarding and duty of care. Now they're hoping you'll stop talking about it and it'll all go away.

Make a formal complaint, back it up with the medical evidence and submit it to the chair of governors. You'll notice a different tone then I should think.
What happened is not acceptable.

comfyoldcardi · 24/11/2023 17:14

Did she have an injury either at school or on the trip?
One of mine had a serious injury at school but because they weren't admitted to hospital they didn't care. If a child has an injury at school and IS admitted it has to be reported to ofsted.

DahliaJ · 24/11/2023 17:17

Yes, you have tried informal. The school complaints policy will be on the website, just follow it to the next stage. It will start with class teacher, senior leaders, etc and then move on to governors.

Lavinia56 · 24/11/2023 17:18

Does she know how she hurt her arm? Asking for a plaster indicates that she cut it.

Whatever the cause, from the teacher's point of view there was no visible sign of injury on the first inspection so it's not surprising that no-one contacted you.

You do need to find out exactly what happened though, and if you're not getting satisfactory answers from school.

Ursulabouffet · 24/11/2023 17:19

For a child to be admitted for IV abx and for surgery to be on the table, this is incredibly serious. She could have got sepsis and lost a limb, ended up in ITU or worse. Imagine if the school trip had been slightly longer. I would put in a formal complaint.

MBappse · 24/11/2023 17:19

Yes. Formal complaint.

You can word it nicely.

Not responding to you on 3 occasions should also be part of the complaint (I did not wish to escalate this, but haven't had a response to three separate queries on what happened and my daughter's care...etc etc.)

WeeSleekitCowrinTimrousBeastie · 24/11/2023 17:19

Teachers are trained in first aid, but they are not medical practitioners.

A kid saying they have a sore arm and teacher looks at can find nothing wrong.
A kid says to another teacher I want a plaster.

From that I can't say that I would have done any differently nor been able to tell there was something wrong. Could anyone?

What is different is that you say she was obviously unwell when you collected her - would that have been obvious to the teachers? When did she become unwell? Did she tell anyone that she was unwell? Was she obviously unwell when she spoke to the first teacher or when she asked for a plaster?

These are the things you should want looked into?

LadyWiddiothethird · 24/11/2023 17:26

Teachers are not “medically trained”,what an idiotic thing to say!Surely they should be aware if a child is as ill as this one clearly was!She was taken straight to A and E after returning from the trip.

Put in an official complaint,don’t wait for the school to get in touch,they clearly know how serious it was and are trying to trivialise it for their own good.

Sounds as if she had a lucky escape from sepsis.

MBappse · 24/11/2023 17:35

Do you think the crater was there on the first day? What was the cause of the infection, do you know?

Redwineandsunshine · 24/11/2023 17:36

Thank you to the new responses. I am definitely feeling like a formal complaint is the way to go to get answers and a satisfactory response

No the injury wasn’t at school or on the trip, she got a superficial cut before the trip which turned into cellulitis during the trip.

OP posts:
CeilingWacks · 24/11/2023 17:44

On a busy school trip, I can see why the teacher didn't think that "my arm hurts, can I have a plaster" was particularly serious. The fact remains, however, that it was extremely serious.

It seems that you're not looking for any sort of blame, or sanction, you just want to make sure that everyone is aware how seemingly innocuous injuries/illnesses can be more serious than you might assume? The school should be falling over themselves to a) make sure this training happens, and b) let you know it has happened. I would be devastated if this had happened on a trip I was leading, and I would have already booked in-depth first aid courses for everyone involved in future residential trips.

If a formal complaint is the only way, then so be it.

penjil · 24/11/2023 17:50

The school are taking the piss out of you. Get a formal complaint in ASAP. Not just about the teachers, but the way the head teacher hasn't dealt with the informal complaint!

They're obviously hoping you'll forget about it! Don't!

lanthanum · 24/11/2023 18:08

I think what you're wanting is to know that they will review procedures to try and make sure this can't happen again.

I imagine that the first teacher saw only the superficial cut, and didn't know that it was worsening. The second just answered her request for a plaster, and probably thought it unlikely that more than that was needed for an injury that they assumed was now healing. It doesn't sound as if your daughter had made the staff aware of any fever.

So what needs changing in the procedures to avoid this happening?
I think it's unlikely the first teacher would have realised it was infected - they're not experts, and they had no comparison with how it was before the trip. It sounds as if her second query was late enough in the trip that the teacher would have seen what you saw, so hopefully would have realised there was an issue, even if not how serious. So an instruction that any request for a plaster should involve looking at the injury would probably have made a difference there. As they were presumably setting off home soon at that point, they probably wouldn't have been doing more than keeping an eye on her and alerting you.

It's difficult, because teachers are not medical experts. My daughter had exczema that got infected, and it was a while before I discovered. I got a phone/photo appointment with the nurse practitioner, half-wondering if that was necessary, and she asked to see DD, prescribed antibiotics, and explained that it could easily have gone to sepsis. She addressed that lecture more to my daughter than to me, because she hadn't shown me, and at 14 I couldn't be expected to inspect her body on a regular basis.

avenue1 · 24/11/2023 18:17

I'm a teacher and if an 11 year old asked me for a plaster, I would 1) believe them that there was a wound/cut as opposed to muscle pain. And 2) Not rely on them to assess the severity and apply the plaster, so would have checked it.

Mirrormeback · 24/11/2023 18:27

In a normal situation like this they should have called you to collect your DD

However like any infection it starts off small and gets worse

It was at its worse by the time she got home

Whilst on the trip I doubt it warranted much attention

Mirrormeback · 24/11/2023 18:29

Redwineandsunshine · 24/11/2023 17:36

Thank you to the new responses. I am definitely feeling like a formal complaint is the way to go to get answers and a satisfactory response

No the injury wasn’t at school or on the trip, she got a superficial cut before the trip which turned into cellulitis during the trip.

Then it was your duty to mention the cut prior to her trip

Teachers are not trained nurses

Mirrormeback · 24/11/2023 18:32

You are also not a trained nurse

If you were you would asked for regular updates on what even you thought was a superficial cut

If you were worried then you would not have sent her on the trip

None of you knew quite rightly that it would turn into cellulitis

None of you are at fault

It is what it is and you dealt with it accordingly on her return which is when it was progressively worse

Mirrormeback · 24/11/2023 18:33

No one in this particular situation is at fault

DisquietintheRanks · 24/11/2023 18:56

Lifeinlists · 24/11/2023 17:10

They have failed in their safeguarding and duty of care. Now they're hoping you'll stop talking about it and it'll all go away.

Make a formal complaint, back it up with the medical evidence and submit it to the chair of governors. You'll notice a different tone then I should think.
What happened is not acceptable.

^ This! If the school wanted to avoid a formal complaint they should have shown you they were treating the shortcomings in their handling of this incident very seriously indeed.

DisquietintheRanks · 24/11/2023 18:57

Teachers are not trained nurses

But when they are in loco parents they should seek appropriate medical care for their charges in a timely manner.

Ursulabouffet · 24/11/2023 19:11

To those defending the teachers.. the child's arm was "severe" with a "crater" at pickup and immediate presentation to A&E led to admission shortly after. The request for the plaster was made mere hours before.

Teachers should review a wound a child has complained about twice. If they had, the severity would have been apparent.

Paediatric EM consultants do not admit 11 year olds for IV antibiotics lightly at all.

The school failed in their duty of care by not reviewing the wound and flagging it to the parent.

If this was a 7 day trip the child could've been very ill indeed. Cellulitis is nasty and progresses to sepsis easily once bedded in.