Year 7 - bottom set - should I worry?

[NewYear7Mum]

My DD has struggled with maths and English since reception. She couldn't really read until year 5.
Assessments always indicate potential. Homework which she does by herself in school for maths doesn't have many errors if at all but tests and exams have again ended up with scores of 30% or less.
She can't spell.
She's been for a dyslexia assessment and she's not dyslexic.
She just can't seem to retain any exceptions only the main rules.
She did start at the "under performing" in reception and ended up "average" in year 6.
Now they've done one of those exams and she's once again bottom of the class.
Am I really going to have to worry about her for another 6 years?
Anyone with experience of a child who seems bright but nothing ever seems to click? And I mean nothing...
She likes art and science but those don't click either.
She's sporty but can't seem to coordinate her body.
She's born into a bilingual family but can't speak her second language (her younger sibling does! )
She has practiced the same music instrument of her choice for years but can't get to grade 1. She's not a quitter which is great. we've told her many times she can stop but she doesn't want to.
Does being the youngest in the class have this much impact?

She's had so much support during the primary school years. People always said "don't worry, it will click". Please when does it click? I don't want her crying herself to sleep every night because she's not meeting her own expectations. She really did feel that because homework was going so well without support that she was doing well!

Sorry for the long one but does anyone have a similar experience?

Apparently not. There's a homework supervisor.

Thank you but I've had meetings 3x or more a term with sencos and teachers every year for the past 6-7 years.

I was asking if I could let down my gaurd and I've already got the motivation to keep going thanks to others on here.

I don't need extra righteous anger...

My main worry now is if the continued assessments and interventions might affect my daughter's confidence but as stated before she's not given up yet so we'll carry on.

At least you are aware of the confidence issues - DS was similar - however he needed his confidence to get him through - he has strengths others do not, I focused on them and built him up.

That spiky profile is really important. Teachers in the class will see her do something and think - she's fine. Then they give her something else to do and she can't do it and they think she is slacking/hasn't done her homework etc.

In secondary, it is really useful if your dd can understand what she needs so that she can ask for it.

Helping her to frame it as - with these things I can do it. Rather than - I can't/I'm useless etc.
Helping her to see how the right support allows her to be successful in what she wants.

My dd uses a laptop. It is written into her school accommodations. Because she has it written in, she is not afraid to ask for it and say she needs it. But with things that aren't in there, she won't ask or even mention them to the teacher.

Getting all her teachers to use those key things in her lessons should make a big difference.

another example - my dd can't take notes while someone is speaking. So they are supposed to give her copies of the powerpoints that they use at the beginning of the lesson so that she can use those and add notes ot them. Some teachers are better than others, but they are all now uploaded onto their homework system, so she has a complete set of notes. Before that she had empty pages in her book. She had done the lesson and understood the lesson, but hadn't taken notes and was left with nothing.

@Oblomov23 do you mean an annual review of an EHCP. I don’t think the OPs daughter has one and it’s clear that OP is in contact with the school and had support from the school at primary level.

Shes only been at the current school since September, so there can’t have been annual meetings there. OP is very proactive in supporting her daughter and has said she will continue to do so. I think the comments made about checking which areas need support, getting a full assessment and speaking to the SENCo are the way to go.

Yes, you're right to worry. Unfortunately "bottom sets" are often dominated by the type of children who are disruptive etc., so your DS may get very little actual "teaching" during lessons making things worse rather than better.

My best friend at school struggled with her writing, which was basically illegible and very slow, meaning that whilst she was bright, she couldn't do well in classwork, tests, exams etc. Nowadays, she'd probably be allowed to use a laptop or have a scribe, but in those days, she ended up in the "remedial" classes which meant she barely ever got any teaching as the teachers were always occupied with controlling the disruptive/loud pupils.

Sorry I didn't mean review of EHCP. I grasped dd didn't have one. And yes, sorry it hadn't quite clicked that she's only been there 2 months. Apologies. I just meant a review. Press Senco in writing. Tell her what you want. Ask for a meeting asap.

I would say a full assessment would be required. Some sencos are better than others tbh so you may not have got full investigation at primary. Everything you describe sounds quite serious and so I would definitely dig in now to find out what is going on as things won't get easier for her and she could crumble when she gets to gcse. Bottom sets aren't generally great places to be and behaviour can be disruptive which impacts on what your daughter might. It sounds like she is a lovely girl who keeps trying hard so well done for helping her develop that resilience. If she enjoys the music, fantastic but don't be afraid to let her give up if she doesn't.

As mum to DD now 15 who was much like you describe (and such a bloody hard worker) and is facing a very real chance she may not pass many GCSEs as d implore you to listen to your gut.

We were fobbed off with such platitudes as "she'll be fine", "Don't worry she'll catch up" for years. Well she isn't and she didn't.

I wish I'd been banging on the HOYs door years ago and got her real struggle taken seriously. Even now, after a year 10 Mock maths result in May of of 2 (and that's with a weekly tutor) school don't even answer my emails asking how she can get more support.

Don't be like me and years down the line be wracked with guilt that you've let her down.

Good luck OP

Meant to say we're waiting for recent Y11 mock results and trying tonne optimistic . Feeling a bit sick to be honest.

Bless. I imagine that feels like my current situation x1000.

I feel like I'll put in all this effort and she'll still be petrified off failing her GCSEs. But it looks like there's no choice.

I don't want to not give her the best chance she's got. and it seems like there's little possibility of things magically getting better without intervention.

Again thanks everyone. I'm really glad I asked before pretending everything will be OK.

can I encourage you to look at English and Maths Functional Skills.

It is an alternative to the GCSE and does real life English and Maths practical skills. You can take it at level 1, 2 and 3 and the level 3 is equivalent to a GCSE pass.

I really wish that more schools would look at this as an alternative to taking GCSE, as for kids who are struggling it serves the purpose much better and also gets away form expecting them to study Pride and Prejudice and Shakespeare.

I second English and Maths FS. But it won't help as schools won't teach them and finding a tutor seems well nigh impossible too ...

I passed maths this way at the young age of 35 having failed GCSE and then failed the resit with an even lower grade (perversely proud at how I managed to do that!).

As an interim measure, can you not do some simple Numeracy/Literacy work with her yourself, get some cheap books from Amazon or print off some worksheets from the internet. Start right at the most basic level and try to make a bit of progress yourself, find her weak points, maybe give her some confidence if you find things she can do and then progress with??

I've never heard of maths and English functional skills. I'll ask. As an update, I've not had any response back from school yet. That's a first to be honest. They usually reply on the same day.

And I have a lot of cgp and Collins books from reception to year 6 including hand writing.

We go back to basics more than anyone I know and watch numberblocks and alphablocks still at age 11. It helps.

At end of year 6, we were doing 10 minutes a day of year 5 work. And we completed 10 mins a day of year 6 over the summer.

I haven't started the year 7 one yet as she really wants to get through this year herself but I think that ship has sailed...

Not everyone is bright. This is something that many people struggle with. If everyone was the same then there could be no selection of students for certain courses and careers. I would focus instead on providing plenty of support and help so she can achieve her full potential whilst nurturing any interests she has. Testing her and looking for a reason for her not performing to a higher level is perhaps not the answer.

Not everyone is bright. This is something that many people struggle with. If everyone was the same then there could be no selection of students for certain courses and careers

What an awful thing to say!

Everyone has potential, everyone has a place on the world. The problem with education is it measure academic success - it does not measure kindness, thoughtful, empathy, humanity - all excel qualities that are overlooked.

We can’t all be nuclear scientists!

We can all be kind.

Agreed. Most people that I know that have long term successful careers have way more than academic smarts - it’s a lot about emotional intelligence and getting on with people which has very little to do with school performance.

I agree with an ed psych or similar assessment.
Have you considered dyspraxia?

This.

We go back to basics more than anyone I know and watch numberblocks and alphablocks still at age 11. It helps.
https://www.themathsfactor.com/

We used this daily in primary took about 4 years but did get the basics solid - over learning seemed to get passed eventually the poor working memory issues.

Honestly if you can afford it get tutors now.

I'd keep on with the school - though TBH we found them unhelpful but I really wouldn't wait but if she can pass Maths, English lang and 3 others then more doors do open post 16 - but if not knowing early and find what alternatives there are post 16 in the local area is going to be helpful.

What were her sats results? As average is 104 or so.
But that equates to say a 5 so still the foundation paper in maths.
How much work did she do for the tests?

Dd1 did at leadt 3h and covered all the revision topics suggested and got 70%.

Can she do extra work on the maths app? As sparx say has home learning.
Would the ks3 revision guide help?
I found dd had managed to forget the algebra rules within weeks.

Spelling may only improve with a lot of reading.

Totaly it is not awful at all. I was simply stating that not everyone can be academically successful. I suggested the OP nurture her dds talents and provide as much support as possible to achieve her potential.

I don't appreciate gas lighting @cansu . That was not what you were suggesting. And I don't want this thread to become about you.

Thank you to all who have made actionable suggestions. The school have replied and I have my first set of topics for her to revise in maths.

I'll see if it is covered by mathsfactor as I do need to move on from numberblocks. And there's a big gap between that and the cgp books.

She does still prefer to read books she has already read which isn't very helpful. So we're encouraging more diverse reading.

Graphic novels - book section on here is good for suggestions - and audio books can help get some reading enthusiasm - there are dyslexia book sites
https://www.barringtonstoke.co.uk/dyslexic-reluctant-readers/
https://www.booktrust.org.uk/booklists/d/dyslexia/ out there so you the content pitched at their age but reading is easier.

If reading is really bad -
https://www.soundfoundations.co.uk/product/fast-track-ab/ but that might be too young we also used their spelling program. Others on here recommend toe to toe - and there are other one out there think we used Signposts To Spelling and some latin/greek words books. On-line you can try https://www.nessy.com/en-us

Nessy has typing program or there's https://www.readandspell.com/.

If there's handwriting issues - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Speed-Up-Kinaesthetic-Programme-Handwriting/dp/1855033860/ref=sr_1_6?crid=2FWM9NMRX8LOL&keywords=start+write+stay+right+handwriting&qid=1700952419&sprefix=write+right%2Caps%2C118&sr=8-6

By Y7 they were much less tolerant of doing much with us so hopefully your school is being more helpful than my dc secondary was.

I’m not sure if this is helpful, but I was bottom sets for almost everything in year 7 and I struggled all the way through primary. I managed to work my way to middle/lower sets by year 9. I’ve never been brilliant at anything, but I have a good degree and a respectable professional job now.

Your daughter sounds an awful lot like how I was as a child. I am now seriously considering an ADHD (inattentive type) assessment as I resonate with all the symptoms and difficulties of the disorder.