Secondary application from abroad

[ReturnfromtheStars]

Hello Mumsnetters, hopefully someone has been in a similar situation or is very knowledgable about the admission system and can help.

I am not from the UK originally and was hoping for my 2 children to be able to
experience life in my home country. After careful planning, we moved countries
in 2022 August. We did all the legwork to get the kids into the education
system in my home country and now have to do this in reverse in the UK.

Here comes the question: after several phone discussions with the School Admissions Office, we were assured our child’s secondary application will be accepted by using our UK address and putting no primary school on the form. So we filled the form in and sent it off (online) well before the 31st October deadline.

However, on 1st November my husband received a phone call stating we have to put our overseas address on the form, and the application is now deemed incorrect and won’t be accepted as an application on time, but instead will be treated as a late application.

What can we do? I am aware, the authority has to place our child somewhere, but despite all the positives of our move, our child also had considerable disruption and it would be preferable to go to a good school in walking distance with friends. Considering we applied with the correct form on time, following advice from the Admissions Office it sounds like a case of “machine says no” so I would really like to be able to use the correct words to get the message across.

It is a truth universally acknowledged (at least on Mumsnet) that all desired schools are oversubscribed. 🙂

If it isn't, OP will get a place for her child whatever the LA do. However, because of the way the system works, most schools are oversubscribed.

Thanks for explaining both! I wasn't sure if schools were classed as oversubscribed for that year this prematurely but that makes sense

Looking at primary school admission statistics 7 years ago, this is a "lighter" year group in the LA, therefore the school may not be oversubscribed. However consequently the LA may ask the the school to drop down to one fewer class etc, which in turn will make them oversubscribed.

Yes the LA could use the future address and said they would, but also could choose to use current address. They changed their minds and currently saying they cannot use future address.

I don't think they can reduce the PAN number once published.

I don't think they can reduce the PAN number once published.

Correct. The 2024 PAN is now fixed. It will be stated in the 2024 admissions policy. They can offer more places, but not fewer.

(And if they wanted to reduce it for their 2025 policy they would need to be running a formal consultation within the next few weeks).

If this is a London LA (the op hasn't said whether it is or not), I'd be surprised if 2024 was a "light" year. In my area and many others there is an ongoing bulge transitioning from year 6 to 7 due to high birth rates. 2023 was the peak, but 2024 is still high.

The last two posts are correct. They can increase PAN (i.e. the number of children they are going to admit), but it is too late to reduce it.

For context, this relates to the period when this cohort were starting primary school: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/education/2012/mar/19/primary-schools-shortage-places-labour

The way the system works means that most schools are oversubscribed, i.e. they have more applications than places. However, that doesn't necessarily mean they will fill all places. If the school you want doesn't fill all places with other applicants, you will get a place regardless of which address the LA use and whether they treat you as a late applicant.

The way the system works means that most schools are oversubscribed, i.e. they have more applications than places. However, that doesn't necessarily mean they will fill all places.

In most areas there will be one or more school(s) that don't fill all their places. However, these 'spare' places will only be evenly distributed if all schools are equally popular. Most areas have some schools that are more popular than others, and so the spare places end up being concentrated in the least popular school(s).

In my area, all but one of the secondary schools are usually oversubscribed, meaning that on March 1st all their places are allocated to families who included them on their list of preferences. But there are always people who can't be offered any of their listed schools, so they are allocated places in the 'undersubscribed' school. If that fills up, some families get no offer at all. Between March 1st and Aug 31st there is a "shake down" with many families giving up offers to go private or move away, so everybody eventually gets a place, and all schools are full or nearly full by Sept 1st.

Had similar relocated back to UK.
Visited the school early, met with head teacher. They were saying yes, great see you in September and we did required paperwork.

We hit same roadblock as you with a rejection in the mail to UK address months later from Council Education. However, we had a house in area, paid “second home” council tax, but they didn’t give us a place until we were physically present & needed to start process again. It worked out for us, and we ended up hating the school (a new had a total jerk).

Our experience, Local Ed Authority run by evil parent-hating computer-illiterate work-shy part-time paper-pushers who don’t care a jot about education and are motivated by lunch vouchers, voicemail only, out-of-office auto reply, annual leave and sick days.

We got given 4th choice school let's hope it works out. Still accessible by public transport but different county and half terms as other kid. Mixed reputation.

@RazzlePuff so your kid got into the preferred school, but the school changed leadership and went downhill? How did it turn out for your child? Did they stay or changed school? Are they happy where they are?

Yes, school changed leadership, new head was the “IT” teacher at previous job. No experience running a school, was just an inexperienced jerk. Yes, the school was run badly, good staff left in first few months. Child liked it well enough, but my opinion was low. we left that school after 2 years.

it was the process of moving in from overseas that caught us out … we thought we had a place starting on first day, but didn’t, only because local Ed authority was being awkward despite us having a friendly dialogue w them for 6-8 months in advance.