Grade boundaries...

[BaconAndAvocado]

...How do I find out what these are? I think DS2 might have just missed an 8 in Maths.

@Tulipblank how on earth did the agent know what GCSEs you got? Did they specifically ask for them?

@Tulipblank I don’t even list my a levels as I have degrees and professional qualifications plus work experience

DS2 was 2 marks off an 8 in two subjects so I will speak to the school and see if it’s worth getting them checked. Probably won’t bother as he has the grades he needs for his A levels.

Having a review of marks (what many call a remark) is always an option.

It does cost money. If you pay it and your child’s Pradeep goes up, you get the money for that paper back. And of course, they were owed those marks.

Lots of people on MN every year say ‘why bother…a 7 is great’. They seem to think it’s greedy to hope for a 9 or to want more than you were given. But I think people forget that some students absolutely have been aiming for 9s and working at that kind of level and it is a matter of personal pride to them. They or their parents spend the money on a re-mark sometimes thinking there has really been a major error of the marking (and it does happen…..over 15 marks in an essay one year for my DS) or because they are so close, they really hope to go up to the grade above.

When people say ‘why would you bother’ I always think ‘why wouldn’t you if you were 2 marks from the grade above’.

It could well be that when a university sifts its applicants that they take students with a higher number of 8/9 grades than those with 7s. The grades will keep going on your CV. And besides that, if your mark goes up, those marks were yours. You aren’t grabbing something that wasn’t yours, but they were yours.

I understand it’s a lot of money and simply not possible for lots of people. But to me, the fact that lots of people will just shrug and say ‘well, 7 or 8…what’s the difference…it’s all better than I got anyway’ and not seem to really care, surprises me. I suppose some people want to do the best they can and know that the system doesn’t always give you what you deserve. Sometimes you just have to push a bit harder. Other people are satisfied with what the system gives them and perhaps don’t even question whether it was fairly marked.

I’m not advocating that everyone gets every paper remarked. That would be daft. And sometimes a child gets a grade that they should be extremely glad to have got and realise they were lucky. But there are also times when grades or the the breakdown between 2 papers just don’t ring quite right…and that’s the time for a review of marking….but only if it is close to the grade above as you don’t risk a big risk of going down.

In my profession it's customary to list all academic qualifications..... and yes, the agent specifically asked what I got in everything!

If you can afford to lose the money of it doesn't go up and it's only 1 or 2, maybe 3 marks why on earth wouldn't you as a parent put it in? The grades stick and might come in handy having that 6 or 7 instead of 5 or 6 later on. As a teacher and parent I'd be putting in unless I felt the mark was generous! Def a few I've seen this week where I've said put in this paper but def not the other one as it'll go down!

Wow @Tulipblank! I'm amazed any profession thinks exams you took over 20 years' ago are of any relevance to the person you are today and the skills and experience you have to offer in a role. How old fashioned!

Agree with this. I was asked for my GCSE grades recently for a job and couldn't even remember so made them up. Nobody is going to check after 25+ years let alone be impressed with them!

I know, and when we went into college today the maths teacher said they prefer a 7+. They don't offer core maths.

So we are having a rethink for something to go with chemistry and geography. Biology is the obvious one but DD says a hard no to that.

I had to produce o and a level certificates for a part time zero hours job ( exam invigilating) twice last year. As well as a full employment record for the last 30 years!

I'm impressed you knew where they were! I have no idea where my certificates are or what grades I got

Maybe they got the grade they’ve worked for.

Someone has to be on the boundary line or there’d be no boundaries.

DD got a 9 for media coursework and thought she did well in the exam but was awarded a 7 🤷🏼‍♀️. It doesn't really matter she passed them all, her lowest grade was a 5 in Spanish, she got 8s in Art and English lit and lang, and she wants to do photojournalism so we aren't too fussed.

But they do have an appeal process and about 36% of appeals are upheld.

As pp's have said, the papers aren't remarked but they are checked to see if the examiner has applied the correct marking scheme to the paper.

If your child is 1 Mark off a grade change that is needed, I would go for it.

We would like to have a review of marking as one away from the next grade boundary.

However, I’m wondering is it possible to get marked down significantly instead of up, and if so, could you then get a review of the review if you see what I mean.

Art grades seemed to be very low at dc school. Did anyone else find that? Lots of upset over that one. They've raised to bar with Art and the marking schemes

Does it matter for onward progression (ie, sixth form or HE?) if so, apply for a remark, if not, I can't see why you'd bother. There will always be many people whose marks fall either side of the grade boundary.

@UncleJack in answer to your question - yes. Re-marks always risk the grade going down as well as up.

Thanks @Radiodread, but could you have the review you requested reviewed if it did go down significantly? Would be very strange if a paper lost 20 or more marks in a review.

Wouldn’t it be nice if they rounded up if you were within 3 marks of the next grade boundary, certainly save all these review requests.

On the 'why would you bother' point:

• kids need to learn that external attainment-based assessment, and in fact any kind of judgement, is fallible and not the marker of their worthiness or actual ability to do a job or profession
• They also need to know that threshold grading will always lead to smarting for those who just miss the cut-off. Same goes for interviews where you come second.
• an absolutely overwhelming percentage of parents will not or cannot afford re-marks or reviews - if you can, all power to your elbow but this is buying your kids a seeming advantage that others can't
• Literally no-one will care about your GCSE grades post the age of 18, providing you aren't looking to do medicine, dentistry, veterinary or another very high tariff HE course. Obviously you need a pass in English and maths for many professions, but I don't think we are talking about threshold pass/ fail grades here.

@UncleJack you can appeal to Ofqual (if in England) but only if you think there has been a procedural error.

Why would they round up? that would completely devalue their marking system and would effectively move their grade boundaries down three marks. Then, you would get all those who missed the lower (three mark down) boundary all aggrieved and asking for remarks.

Someone has to miss out by one mark - that's really just life. Hard, but that's the way the cookie crumbles.

We could argue till the cows come home about the merits of summative assessment at 16 (personally not in favour) but this is the system we have.

Yes, and yes. But an appeal is over £100.

Thanks, I’m hoping to ask her teacher to check it first so they’d be able to give me an indication of whether to pursue, or not bother, if they feel the marking was already generous.

DS's teachers for two subjects contacted me to suggest it, hadn't occurred d to me before but now I have read (above) that marks can go do considerably then I don't think it is a good idea. He was two marks off a 7 for English language and sociology.

They don’t remark the papers through, they just check the marking was done fairly (which is different because a lot of subjects have a lot of subjectivity). So if the person checking the script thinks they would have marked it slightly differently but the mark awarded was still fair then you don’t get any extra marks. The marks can also go down.

This.