Work Experience Discrimination?

[Charliesunnysky10]

My Y10 daughter wants to go into aerospace engineering, specifically, working at a large employer 10 mins drive from us. She has applied twice to be part of their week-long work experience programme run 3 times a year for Y10 & 11 pupils, but has been turned down both times, despite being able to demonstrate her strengths and interest in STEM subjects. On both occasions she followed up with a letter to ask if they could give feedback as to why she has not been selected and if they might reconsider for the next programme as this is the only place she can get experience to help her apply for an apprenticeship (over 60% of their apprentices knew someone in that business already). They didn't reply on either occasion but I reassured her it's down to sheer volume of applicants.
She called twice apparently also but was put through to a vm with again, no response. My friend has recently left this company and told me they only offer work experience to pupils from 2 local high schools - she attends the grammer school slightly further away, that doesn't have this link. This seems a bit unfair, as he also told me many of the 60 they give work experience to each year are reluctant and have no interest aerospace - the school apply on their behalf because they've not found anywhere else to go, and the current 60 places aren't taken. He gave me contact details for the admin who offers the placements - he doesn't know who makes the actual decision though. The details are the ones my daughter has contacted without success. I'm wondering if it's worth me calling to check on this policy and if there's any flexibility. Or if there's another way?

Surely the company publishes the eligibility criteria for the work experience scheme?

If you've made repeated attempts to contact this admin team with no success I'd look up their HR details and get in touch that way.

Can the school get involved and contact them? Could she track down another relevant person in their HR or similar through LinkedIn? Good luck.

Instead of you contacting them would her school be willing to? I think it would be better for the school to establish connections for DD and potentially others. And you may find the Admin are more willing to talk with the school than a parent or student.

@Whataretheodds I've Googled their criteria- nothing about school links.

@OrchidsBlooming I'll ask at school, tell them what's happened so far.

@GellerYeller thanks for your good wishes, I'll try HR too (gently!)

Are you talking about RR?

We have big engineering near us they have a big drive to employ local apparently

wonder if this is the same thing

@ArnoldBee when she got the second knockback from MBDA she applied to RR in Barnoldswick in May as its just about within their 30 mile catchment and I think she said they make fans for engines which is a very close fit for aerospace engineering. I've just checked with her and said she had an email straight back to say her application is under review.

I don’t know if it’s of interest but charity Smallpeice Trust run courses specifically designed to get girls into engineering, including an aerospace course.

https://www.smallpeicetrust.org.uk/course-page/333be64c-006c-ed11-81ac-0022481b5e44

@rwalker I get that, but we ARE local. Just not at their partnership schools. The grammar she is at is very old fashioned in terms of not recognising the importance of industry links - their sixth form is very focussed on university places as opposed to apprenticeships. But my daughter is keen to take an apprenticeship route into engineering and says she needs to get as much industry experience & chance to impresd to help her application.

It sounds like you need to get the school involved. As they are a grammar, I would expect them to want a prestigious Leavers Destination.

Out school has a link with a big company who offers someone from the school a guaranteed spot on their degree apprenticeship programme. The other school in the academy trust also has the same deal. I don't know if it's because they are comps with a Sixth Form but many apply each each year and the company are often guest speakers at careers talks open to parents too.

@Patchworksack Really helpful, thank you!

@WheelsUp Thanks. I've emailed the school. I think they're just not as equipped for the apprenticeship route.

R R make engines for aircraft, I have a relative who worked there. My dad's next door neighbour also worked in aircraft engineering, I think. I don't know if either have current links.

Is your dd at a girls school, if so and they never take work experience from there they have a problem.

Some years ago my daughter had help and advice form an organisation for Women in Science and Engineering. They used to run Summer Schools and helped her to obtain a bursary and a year in industry as part of her university course.

My friend has recently left this company and told me they only offer work experience to pupils from 2 local high schools - she attends the grammer school slightly further away, that doesn't have this link. This seems a bit unfair, as he also told me many of the 60 they give work experience to each year are reluctant and have no interest aerospace

This could well be a specific policy, designed to "sell" the industry to those who have not previously considered it. Specific outreach, which is a positive thing in my book (overall, not specifically for your dd of course).

I think it's really common for schools to build links with employers for careers education/ work experience.

If her school hasn't, that's their failing, not the company's.

Is.it becuase the grammar school prefers to think its students will go on to Alevels not apprenticeships?

@sashh yes it's a girls school and they seem to favour law & medicine as a lot of old girls come back and do presentations. Because a degree I'd required for both of these they don't do much with apprenticeships which annoys me as they're missing a great opportunity by not engaging with tech etc

My DS did some of these courses. Excellent.

@Preps I agree, and yes, they are very keen to keep them on for A levels and have them go to Oxbridge or RG. She had a careers interview and he only mentioned apprenticeshops to tell her theyre ridiculously over subscribed, 75% aee in the SE, over 60% of apprentices know someone in the business and she's up against it if she's got no industry links. Old fashioned, short sighted and really negative.

@Charliesunnysky10 unfortunately its the norm to give no feedback on job applications, so that is a "work experience" in itself!

My 19yo son has been unsuccesful in applying for several summer internships this year, and he was lucky if he got a rejection email within 3 months of applying - some didn't even bother with that. I've also been applying for jobs myself recently, and my experience is the same. Employers' excuse seems to be that they get so many applications that it would be too difficult to send rejection emails (which is obviously ridiculous) or to give everyone feedback (which is obviously more reasonable).

@thundastorm I agree. My 21 year old son stays in his min wage job because his 40-odd applications for something related to his A levels were fruitless and he's given up for the time being. I was looking for a part time job to supplement my full time one and struggled despite having a 30 year work history and decent quals. In the end, a mate who works in a hotel recommended me for a bar job. My 15 year old has applied for over 50 jobs to work evenings and weekends but hasn't had any luck even those who said they'd take 15 and over or didn't have a policy. It's a tough old job market out there if you don't have a way in through the back door or get headhunted. I should add, we live in a city and my son found it easier to get hired by when he lived in Stoke, a smaller town.

They will probably be massively over subscribed for work experience and when they are, have internal priorities around non grammar state schools. Assuming that grammars usually offer more opportunities for their students - although in your case that’s not correct.

My daughter was attempting to get work experience at a large science employer near us - not UK. They have loads of applications and apparently no longer accept recommendations from employees though we know that not to be true. She applied through the regular process but also attended a number of girls in science / engineering events locally and contacted one of the speakers directly (in fact she contacted several!) .. one came through and she is there this week.

So.. google women in stem networks and events, etc, near you, look at the speakers listings or members listings, look for organisations who mentor girls and contact as many of them as you can, directly. If they suggest the standard route, then she can tell them she already has tried that. Contact the local colleges and explain that she is interested and do they have any direct links with companies..

We found that there are many paid courses designed to get girls into STEM courses at university and free ones designed at widening access but not so many programmes to access apprenticeships.

Good luck to her!!

Have you contacted WES or the RAEng? Pretty sure WES is sponsored by several of the big aerospace players so probably a good in. Also definitely go for a recommendation if you know someone, it's how I got my work experience after a similar experience years ago. Smallpiece were also great.

Jokes on them, clever girls who want to work in engineering are like hens teeth. If I was the hiring manager I'd be fuming to find out someone like that was being rebuffed.