Westminster School going co-ed

[jobadoo]

Newspapers report today that Westminster School will start admitinggirls in the Under School and Senior School, going fully co-ed by 2030. I don't understand why only boys schools going co-ed and not girls schools, setting aside the academic argument that girls bring better results. Or maybe that's the only reason?

boys do best in co-ed schools
girls do best in all-girls schools.

I'm not at all surprised that boys schools go mixed.

Quite a few girls state schools have mixed sixth forms - Camden and Marylebone come to mind. So it happens

Quite the contrary, and there is a reason why the top schools are single sex ones.

Ahhh! This makes sense. Probably like HighRopes, I initially thought Victoria when you said the Corens (and she went to St Paul's so didn't have a tie).

yes, lots of state school closures due to vacancies making them unviable. In Southwark alone they are planning close / merge about 20 percent of primary schools.

There is already a thread in mumsnet name a variety of London preps that have closed as well.

Post Brexit / Covid a lot of families have left London completely the demand. This is coupled with a lower birth rate compared to the uptick that happened about 10-15 years ago. @SquirmOfEels

They were reportedly planning to expand the under school and include a 4+ entry option based on articles last year.

All the private schools, even the most academic are putting in place long term plans to survive in what will be an increasingly difficult environment.

Kings house school in Richmond (boys up to 13) is also going co Ed from 2024. But their neighboring girls only school is staying single sex. I wonder how things will work out with this trend in London and beyond. The co ed schools can't really be 50:50 with so many girls only schools full, and only a few other boys only schools. Therefore many co ed schools will be boys heavy?

@dancingbyriver , The Mall in Twickenham reduced to up to age 11 and is now co-ed (although early stages). Hampton Boys Prep and Tower House are the only boys only preps I can think of in the area competing from age 7 against LEH juniors / The Old Vic / St Catherine's for girls.

@redrobin75

What is the split (girls:boys) at the mall, do you know?

I'm curious to see which coed schools are genuinely 50:50.. probably just the very selective ones can manage to have that balance?

@dancingbyriver , sorry The Mall is girls from Sept 23 starting in reception and especially via their nursery.

Just the upper school? The juniors school feeds in and mist buys go up to the great school. And of course they have girls at A level already.

I mentioned this to a boy who is there and he said it was nonsense. This has been the gossip of the school and the boys had been asking senior members of staff and were told it was ‘unlikely in the next ten years’. Who knows?

It is going to start in the Under school. That’s the only way they could do it. The earliest girls in the fifth form would be 2028. Working back, that would mean 11plus 2026.

since 7+ entry for this 2028 13+ cohort would have been 2022, I assume they will have to bias 11+ 2026 entry to the Under school heavily to girls. I am not sure but I think they get in about 30 at this stage.

I have a DS there and have heard it is looking at 4+ entry co-ed throughout. Think this if from a few years time though. Definitely a sense of all schools looking ahead to how they can modernise, survive tough economic times, potential VAT on school fees (which really will just make private schools even more exclusive but that is another rant!) and changing markets with more and more international parents being the ones who can afford London school fees.

We have friends with sons at Falcons which is closing, friends at City Junior which is merging the preps into a coed set up, our nursery/pre-prep school Kings House Prep is going coed now, locally Radnor House/Kneller Hall are expanding. Friend on the PTA at Bute House said that the head there wants to make big changes and there may be a nursery coming there, removal of 7+ and potentially adding boys school too. We were hoping to get DD in there at 7+ but that may no longer be an option. Godolphin and Latymer have shut their prep, Redcliffe, rather than build it up, which is an odd move. We also had that one on our radar for DD but may now stick to something more local. Brighton College have taken over a prep in Kensington... It is a really odd time for London schools with a lot of openings, closures and restructures for sure.

@SwirlingGrey I think you’re right there about international families that might not value the history of W so much. W going coed is really defensive against the likes of Highgate. It won’t get more money in. The Westminster China strategy clearly didn’t work. Eton’s online platform seems to have floundered. Both were efforts to franchise the name to expand available resources without further pushing up fees. It’s hard to know where they can turn without serious money coming in from the alumni.

I think all private schools including Westminster recognise there will be an accelerating drop in demand going forward because of costs and reduced birth rates.

They want to get in as many students (boys and girls) as they can from as early as they can. Starting earlier increases fee streams but also fights off competition. If Kings, St Paul's etc remain 7+ most parents that would typically apply to all of them will do the 4+ at Westminster and if they have a happy, settled child will be less likely to bother with the 7+ at the competitor schools.

Also, the parents with a strong preference for co-ed will now consider Westminster while going co-ed is unlikely to put many off.

Its a scramble for the (best) bums on seats.

That is all very interesting but at just 3 you really cannot assess a child’s academic ability correctly so if Westminster Under takes a high proportion of children early on at 4 plus they either won’t all be able to stay at 13 plus or the academic standards will go down greatly.

From friends with sons in WU, they still have to sit the exam to go to senior schools. Quite a few schools don’t have automatic entry unless they at the same level. So they getting bright kids with supportive parents at 4+ and teaching them. Coed is more popular with some of my Asian friends since they think wants their kids to go to the same schools, less travelling on different schools events and sport fixtures.

I am not convinced there will be less demand. Demand pretty much follows the number of wealthy families in London. Post Brexit, this has probably reached a nadir. I am pretty sure London will eventually revive under the next government. I would be much more pessimistic about regional day schools.

Agree that later selection is really important and they cannot rely on 4+ student selection for staying at the top of the A-level and oxbridge entrance tables, no matter how good the teaching is.

Westminster is such a conservative establishment place that I am inclined to think that they probably think the results are in for the trial of a co-ed 6th form and it's time to make the next move - 50 years later.

The cynic in me also thinks that the preps/unders attached to the great senior schools help prop them up financially? As in, parents of preps don’t use all the facilities or buildings or highly differentiated senior school staff so if you want to keep costs low long term to attract the best and maintain your very old buildings, you grow your prep business. I am sure the prep/under at Westminster will be great teaching but it will be no guarantee to staying on later on.

Parents with bright children using good state primary school and tutors get much better value. Especially now that class sizes across London are falling.

Profit margins are could be higher for preps, yes, but barriers for new preps to start are lower, so competitors are more. I heard a talk by that man running Dukes education who said that it’s hard to make money on a prep smaller than 200 students. The smaller school still needs to pay for a site and a Head and admin and cover all the basics. So larger preps attached to an independent secondary are probably best. Either that or have a property endowment that lowers cost.

I suppose it’s a question of whether an education provided by state plus tutors is better than one provided by a really high octane prep and Westminster. No doubt that the latter route is hugely more expensive. If money was not a consideration, I think it’s better for a high achieving child to be pushed by teachers and peers, not tutors. A child who can get into Westminster is going to be in a minority of 1 at a typical state primary. Maybe he’ll be one of 4 or 5 at a prep. By being a lot harder, it’s easier to learn what it takes to perform at a higher level and it turns out being easier later on to put the afterburners on for GCSE and A levels. Well that’s the theory anyway.

@Intergalacticcatharsis Westminster doesn’t guarantee admission to the senior school even now with 7+ admission so that’s not a risk for them regarding the 4+

Its not a question of if demand will fall- it already has for preps.

Results and behaviour improve when boys schools go co-ed and worsen when girls schools do the same.......