Is it worth it applying for sixth form if gcse's are not great?

[jennybba]

If you are predicted mainly 4's, 3 5's and a 2 and 3 is it worth it applying for sixth form (sixth form will accept dc as long as average grade is 4 or more)? Is there any hope of possibly getting decent a-levels? What kind of a-levels can we expect with these grades? And if a-levels are not great can dc still go to university?

Is DC in Year 10 now or Year 11?
If Year 10, then there's lot of time for things to change.
If in Y11 now, is it not quite late now to be applying for sixth form? Maybe depends on areas, but round here this was all last month.
Does the Sixth Form offer BTECs? It might be possible to do both. My DC is in a similar position and is planning on doing A level in best subject (predicted 6/7) and 2 BTECs (rest of predicted grades 4 and 5).
DC also applied for a College course in case it all goes pear shaped in May/June.

I teach sixth form Economics and I would strongly recommend not A-level Economics with those grades. If you're going to hit the ground running with an entirely new subject (am assuming no GCSE in it) then you need to be a quick study. A business course would be better especially if there's coursework or another practical element (if he's reasonably well organised and motivated).

@WombatChocolate A levels are not for all. And soon BTECs / T-Levels / City&Guilds won't be either. My DD is on a L1 course at the moment. We've been told she shouldn't do the L2 course because of how it is examined. So she could do the course contents but not cope with the assessment method. There soon won't be anything left for DC who struggle with exams.

Thanks for all the replies, so it seems like a-levels are not a good idea at all? So I guess my next question is, why do some sixth forms accept students with such low a-levels if there is not much hope?

My dd left school with nothing above a 3.
She went to sixth form but did a BTEC. She retook her maths and English and passed. She ended up flying for level 1 and 2 and got distinction stars. She is now doing level 3 and will go to uni in September. (She has got offers for Manchester)
So I would be more likely to look at vocational courses tbh.

Not all 6th forms are the same. Some offer other qualifications besides A levels as PPs have described. Students may take a mix of qualifications including 1/2 A levels bad well as others.
6th form colleges tend to offer a wider range.

If your DC is sitting exams this year, it's probably a bit late to be applying anywhere, but a range of options would be best and then you can decide once results are in.

They are hard and economics would be a struggle with 4/5 in Maths. Law is not necessary for a legal career and in some cases less desirable than say English or History. . Does dc hope to go to uni?

Because some 6th forms offer BTECS as well as A Levels so can take students with a wider variety of GCSE grades.

Also it depends on whether the 6th form college is bothered about their A Level results overall, or if they are happy to take any students just to keep their numbers up (because they receive funding per pupil).

So - if you choose a 6th form that has lower entry requirements, what are their exam results like compared to other 6th forms?

A good 6th form will want to take care to match the student with the correct courses. Being on a course that is unsuitable is miserable for the student and frustrating for the teachers. The students often end up swapping courses (so missing out on months of study), or repeating a year, or even dropping out altogether.

Also does your DC have any idea what they want to do long-term? Why law and politics in particular? It might be worth looking at a careers website at some jobs they are interested in, and working back to find out what qualifications are actually needed. It may be that they don’t even need A Levels at all.

I do think some pupils just stay on at their school 6th form because it’s the easy option, and then their parents push for them to do A Levels just because they assume its the best choice, when actually there are lots of other courses out there. But it takes time to research careers and courses, and to be honest I don’t know if many people can be bothered.

Es and Us. Sorry to be blunt, but most schools and most sixth form colleges ask for a minimum of 5s and 6s for A-levels for a reason- because this is the minimum level needed to pass the course.

I would say, really, to have a firm chance of passing (and by passing, I mean an E grade) an A-level in a subject, you need a strong 5/weak6 in that subject or relevant subjects at GCSE. If it's an essay based subject, you probably need a 6 in English as well, and if it's a science based subject, you really need a 6 in maths.

If you want to get Cs or above (usually the minimum needed for uni entry) then you really need a strong 6, or a 7 or above, plus probably an average of 6s across your A-levels.

There are exceptions to this, for lots of reasons- but you don't mention any extenuating circumstances.

To get a 2 at GCSE in any subject is really, really weak- it's not just lack of effort from an able student, it suggests struggling academically in a way that means they are going to struggle with the step up to A-level.

If they are a hard worker, with that grade profile, a level 3 BTEC could be a good route for them, and this could be studied in a sixth form college environment. If they're not hard working and can't stick to deadlines, a BTEC won't work well either though- BTECs are not "easy" and they would need to be prepared to work at it to do well.

What are his predicted grades for English and maths?

Firstly, these may be their overall entry requirements, but they may offer more vocational courses as well. Have you been to an open day/evening at the college and discussed entry requirements in detail?

Secondly, funding. If the school/college is funded on a per pupil basis, they may need to take a large number of students to make certain courses financially viable or, if it's a school sixth form with a falling roll, they may just need to take everyone who applies.

Thirdly, some sixth forms do have a philosophy that they will offer courses to anyone who applies on the grounds that they deserve the chance to try A-levels. But in actual reality what often happens is after about six weeks or so, the students realise the A-levels are very challenging, and then choose to be re-coursed onto something more appropriate. And you will often find a high drop out rate along the way.

Is it a school sixth form or a sixth form college, and what sort of courses do they offer?

Some places will take those who probably shouldn’t do A Levels.

Why? Firstly they are funded per head and need enough students to run their courses. So sometimes they will take people who don’t really stand a chance if a good grade but may scrape a pass.

Secondly, lots of children and parents too push for their child who isn’t suitable to do A Levels. They often don’t understand what the likely outcomes are or won’t consider alternative courses like BTECs. Sometimes kids want to do the same as their friends and certainly still some snobbery about courses. Some kids are pretty clueless and don’t understand that a 4/5 does not indicate strong mastery of the GCSE curriculum. Often they will have achieved less than half marks to get those grades. They don’t have the maturity to think through if it’s appropriate or what’s invovled or what might come next and push to do it. Sometimes schools or colleges will accept people at the margins, but outcomes at A Level are strongly correlated with GCSE grades (not surprisingly) and those who start with low grades usually struggle and achieve low results ir don’t pass.